"Play XIV if(cont)" and"you have a responsibility to" are not statements that coexist

[SturmChurro]

Personally I wish FFXIV followed more of a meta slave mentality over this you do not pay my sub one. I really wish at times we could just flash numbers around cause sometimes people need a wake up call for poor play.

You can flash numbers around. If it's so important for someone to call another out, why not do it anyway?

[Awha]

You can flash numbers around. If it's so important to call another out for it, why not do it anyway?

If I end up running content with pugs I often do call people out if they are what amounts to a sort of waste of space but sometimes it would be nice if I could just show the numbers of a player without worrying about being reported.

It does not happen often but when you get those players they are doing fine in x content. Yet even the most bullheaded player will have a hard time defending a dps doing less damage then a healer or tank on single target fights.

Facts should not be considered toxic. Though here that is sadly the case. Hell often you are called a meta drone if you dare expect people to try cause end of the day the content can be cleared with dead weight.

[SturmChurro]

If I end up running content with pugs I often do call people out if they are what amounts to a sort of waste of space but sometimes it would be nice if I could just show the numbers of a player without worrying about being reported.

It does not happen often but when you get those players they are doing fine in x content. Yet even the most bullheaded player will have a hard time defending a dps doing less damage then a healer or tank on single target fights.

If you are already calling people out for "if they are what amounts to a sort of waste of space", I'd assume they could already report you, frankly. Wait, you aren't using a third party program to gather said numbers are you?

[Awha]

If you are already calling people out for "if they are what amounts to a sort of waste of space", I'd assume they could already report you, frankly. Wait, you aren't using a third party program to gather said numbers are you?

I word it nicer in game. Though if I use a third party tool the numbers it records should not be seen as toxic. Linking the numbers then saying x you need to step it up is not toxic though in FFXIV it is seen as toxic due to SE dated view on parsing.

[linayar]

I word it nicer in game. Though if I use a third party tool the numbers it records should not be seen as toxic. Linking the numbers then saying x you need to step it up is not toxic though in FFXIV it is seen as toxic due to SE dated view on parsing.

I think the problem is that numbers is meaningless without context, but people abuse that to this day, so I don't think SE's view is that dated when it can still apply to present day players.

For example, a "gray" parse on a certain website still means that you cleared the content. You would be right in saying that player could do better, but that's where the fact ends. The issue of whether the player should do better or needs to do better, especially if they're doing enough to clear the content without dying or causing the party to hit enrage but is getting gray parse due to gearing or conservative means of doing mechanics or some other reason, is a matter of opinion.

Now, you could say you would only use numbers on people who are dying or causing the party to wipe or hit enrage, but if the numbers are readily available, others might not stick to those cases.

And then if we go to the other extreme to follow along the OP's scenario, you can't say there won't be people who would use numbers in context that don't even need them like in normal content.

[Awha]

I think the problem is that numbers is meaningless without context, but people abuse that to this day, so I don't think SE's view is that dated when it can still apply to present day players.

For example, a "gray" parse on a certain website still means that you cleared the content. You would be right in saying that player could do better, but that's where the fact ends. The issue of whether the player should do better or needs to do better, especially if they're doing enough to clear the content without dying or causing the party to hit enrage but is getting gray parse due to gearing or conservative means of doing mechanics or some other reason, is a matter of opinion.

Now, you could say you would only use numbers on people who are dying or causing the party to wipe or hit enrage, but if the numbers are readily available, others might not stick to those cases.

And then if we go to the other extreme to follow along the OP's scenario, you can't say there won't be people who would use numbers in context that don't even need them like in normal content.

Personally even if the content is cleared if a dps is doing less damage then a tank or a healer claims they are healing those are valid cases to show them the numbers cause sure we cleared but that should not be an excuse for that level of poor play. Do not get me wrong you can clear content in this game carrying many people. I happen to do that myself with friends who have physical or mental limitations that prevent them from preforming. Though that is why we do not take pugs when we do it. Sure they could join PF and prob get through fine but still not cool imo.

Parser is not inherently toxic nor is showing numbers though clearing the content should not be an excuse to poor play. Not saying I expect perfect play but I expect players at max level when it comes to pugs or PF groups unless stated otherwise that everyone playing has a general idea how to play.

[linayar]

Personally even if the content is cleared if a dps is doing less damage then a tank or a healer claims they are healing those are valid cases to show them the numbers cause sure we cleared but that should not be an excuse for that level of poor play. Do not get me wrong you can clear content in this game carrying many people. I happen to do that myself with friends who have physical or mental limitations that prevent them from preforming. Though that is why we do not take pugs when we do it. Sure they could join PF and prob get through fine but still not cool imo.

Parser is not inherently toxic nor is showing numbers though clearing the content should not be an excuse to poor play. Not saying I expect perfect play but I expect players at max level when it comes to pugs or PF groups unless stated otherwise that everyone playing has a general idea how to play.

If you are doing the mechanics correctly without any death/hitting enrage but with relatively poor DPS compared to the majority of parsers, why is that considered poor play? PVE is supposed to be player vs environment, not a competition between you and another player.