[dev 1032] What's wrong with job/subjob again?

[Lienn]

A lot of us have tried to enjoy this "freedom" and find it bland and tasteless. Thats why you see posts about wanting to change it.

Posts asking to change aren't what people is doing. They're just asking to change...they are asking to change to FFXI or FFT or any other known game...its part of human nature always chosing the old, known option instead of learning about the new one.

Basically there's 2 ways for someone learning something: By accident (you happen to learn part of something and it catch your attention enough for you to search knowledge about that) or when forced to do so.

Its exactly the same here...but due the terrible release players just prefered to utterly reject the game systems instead of giving it a chance of showing its strenght.

I'll be honest...the only point i really think will never work properly in this game is the battle regimen. I believe battle regimen will need a real revamp before it can be used properly in this game....but all the rest is perfectly fine...they just need a few tweaks, that are exactly what dev team is doing.

This game don't need skillchains, subjobs, AH or any other system from FFXI, FFT or any other FF. It does have a very good core system that can support a brand new and unique gameplay. Just give dev team time to finish adjusting it.

And meanwhile, have fun with it ^^ Its a game after all! ^^

[Kaedan]

Posts asking to change aren't what people is doing. They're just asking to change...they are asking to change to FFXI or FFT or any other known game...its part of human nature always chosing the old, known option instead of learning about the new one.

Basically there's 2 ways for someone learning something: By accident (you happen to learn part of something and it catch your attention enough for you to search knowledge about that) or when forced to do so.

Its exactly the same here...but due the terrible release players just prefered to utterly reject the game systems instead of giving it a chance of showing its strenght.

I'll be honest...the only point i really think will never work properly in this game is the battle regimen. I believe battle regimen will need a real revamp before it can be used properly in this game....but all the rest is perfectly fine...they just need a few tweaks, that are exactly what dev team is doing.

This game don't need skillchains, subjobs, AH or any other system from FFXI, FFT or any other FF. It does have a very good core system that can support a brand new and unique gameplay. Just give dev team time to finish adjusting it.

And meanwhile, have fun with it ^^ Its a game after all! ^^

I wasn't saying we should change it to FFT's system. But I was using FFT as an example of how you could change the system to bring out more uniqueness in characters.

For the most part I love the armory system. I'm happy with it as is, but I could see how it could be improved. And one of those ways would be to limit which skills can be equipped on which classes.

Though I think also adding Advanced jobs and Class-only skills would go a long way as well.

[AlexiaKidd]

As much as I like the current system for the sake of balance and class definition I would prefer going back to the sub job system. People think that in FFXI you got pigeon-holed into certain sub jobs for classes, well it was only really one thing that broke the system for the most part and the was Utsusemi as in a lot of cases people went /NIN and expected you to as well.

With the current system yes you have lot's of choices for now but down the line when the game has developed and people have figured out the optimal builds for each class, how will you feel about having to level lot's of classes to all different ranks to gain those certain abilities that will create that optimal build that people expect you to have. There will not be so much freedom in choices then and you will be back to being pigeon-holed, only now you will have to do even more work to not be considered gimp.

[Kaedan]

As much as I like the current system for the sake of balance and class definition I would prefer going back to the sub job system. People think that in FFXI you got pigeon-holed into certain sub jobs for classes, well it was only really one thing that broke the system for the most part and the was Utsusemi as in a lot of cases people went /NIN and expected you to as well.

With the current system yes you have lot's of choices for now but down the line when the game has developed and people have figured out the optimal builds for each class, how will you feel about having to level lot's of classes to all different ranks to gain those certain abilities that will create that optimal build that people expect you to have. There will not be so much freedom in choices then and you will be back to being pigeon-holed, only now you will have to do even more work to not be considered gimp.

You're not thinking broadly enough.

Even though FFXI had probably the least pigeon-holing out of all the MMOs, it still has much more than FFXIV does.

If you were a WHM, you were a healer.
If you were a BLM, you were a DD.
If you were a PLD, you were a Tank.

No one's arguing that there won't be "optimal builds" for classes in this game. But the point is that there will be more of them. You have a choice between many optimal combinations, or at least more than in FFXI.

I like being able to switch from a heal spec to a DD spec as a Conjurer as we need it. I like being able to switch from a Tank spec to a DD spec as a Glad. I like being able to switch from a DD spec to a Support spec. And that's the beauty of the system. Sure, there will only be a few "optimal specs" within each of those, but each class can change spec, allowing for a lot of flexibility.

[Griss]

the current system is the sub job system from xi to the nth degree. pick and choose the best skills and abilities from other classes to augment what you are doing with out having to take on the other useless baggage that comes with it.

[Kimahri]

You're not thinking broadly enough.

Even though FFXI had probably the least pigeon-holing out of all the MMOs, it still has much more than FFXIV does.

If you were a WHM, you were a healer.
If you were a BLM, you were a DD.
If you were a PLD, you were a Tank.

Funny thing is that when they introduced Ninja as an advanced job, it was originally intended to be a DD through the elemental wheel of ninjitsu.

[Rhomagus]

I have not read the entire thread but I am only answering the OP.

No I would not like the job/subjob system back.

I like being able to pull abilities from more than two jobs and creating a unique character, to fit a unique situation, out of all of the abilities that I have rightfully earned. Tweaking ability affinities and action point allotments is all that is needed to "balance" the current system to be as restrictive as XI.

[Vanguard319]

A lot of us have tried to enjoy this "freedom" and find it bland and tasteless. Thats why you see posts about wanting to change it.

Speak for yourself, the current system is fine, each job just needs more exclusive abilities, that give them a niche to fullfill within party play. There's no need to do away with the armory system just to give each job a specialized role. For example, speed surge and life surge are polearm-exclusive abilities, meaning that only lancers can use those skills. Likewise, arc has Quick nock, gla has heavy slash/stab, etc. you can make certain weapon skills job exclusives, i.e. skull sunder being able to be used by any job, but skull sunder II being mrd only, you could also add new job-exclusive traits, using mrd again as an example, you could have a trait that enhances steadfast, allowing it to activate faster, or a gla-exclusive trait that minimizes emnity loss when guarding. (think shield mastery)

[darkstarpoet1]

i much prefer this system. i do not want the sub job system at all.

[Reika]

The job/sub job system was limited to two jobs (I say WAS because this is a FFXI concept). The current class skill system is greater than the job/sub job system.

The Job/sub job did not create unique characters at all. "a paladin is a paladin is a paladin" is how that old job went. If you werent Pld/War you were crap. You really want that old "Bland" system back.

I say bland because people are calling this newer system bland, even though you can fully customize your character with various skills and spells, to create something far beyond your basic jobs. You can turn your gladiator into a paladin, or turn your gladiator into a dark knight (still 1-h but the spells are still there).

I suggest those who are complaining about the class skill system try ranking up more than 1 or 2 jobs and you will see.