Monk Needs a Complete Rework

[reyre]

I'm no expert on MNK by any means, but I'm pretty certain we'll still need to meld just a little SkS to achieve double True Strike with minimal potency loss but honestly, I'd rather worry about that than the headache that was 6 Opo-opo PB. Other than that the rotation will remain largely the same except our PB bursts will be more lenient. The opener however will pretty much be what MNK already does in dungeons when it has full stacks ...plus TK I guess.

Other than that you're still spot on about SSS. As long as there's that pesky recast timer on all WS it'll still always be just a disconnect tool and nothing else.

Interesting, i think i read in the discord that we only need like 1.96 or 1.97 GCD to be able to double true. In fact i just read Aya's live letter patch notes and it says that, so i guess some SKS is still a need, just very litlle.

And about SSS that recats timer makes it a really gimicky disconect, because there must be a longer than 2 sec disconect in order for it to be worth it. Assuming that it remains the same.

[SpeckledBurd]

The worst part is they wanted us to wait until 6.0 for this.

No matter how you swing it, for something they’d called a rework what they showed is profoundly disappointing. Altering Greased Lightning in this way by simply eliminating it is unnecessarily heavy handed when Monk’s issue with mid fight cutscenes could be solved by giving Monk a 30 second cooldown to build GL to maximum and the Tornado Kick change. That way Monk's recovery is equivalent to other jobs and that recovery isn't automatically a DPS gain to burn for more damage. What’s worse is it seems our many other issues with the job such as RNG chakra, Fist Stances, lack of mobility, and the excess of lackluster niche actions haven’t been addressed.

However, whether this was what they intended for 6.0 or if this is them throwing together something they can call a rework beforehand to try and placate our three expansions worth of built up frustration is still a mystery and we won’t know for a few months yet. If it’s a stalling tactic, then they still ultimately made us wait until 6.0 for changes which frankly should be expected but still reflects very poorly on the devs since many of these issues date back to Heavensward.

If this is actually what they were going to deliver in 6.0 though and nothing else is heading down the pipe then I imagine this thread will reach 200 pages.

[Sqwall]

No matter how you swing it, for something they’d called a rework what they showed is profoundly disappointing. Altering Greased Lightning in this way and eliminating it is unnecessarily heavy handed when Monk’s issue with mid fight cutscenes could be solved by giving Monk a 30 second cooldown to build GL to maximum and the Tornado Kick change. What’s worse is it seems our many other issues with the job such as RNG chakra, Fist Stances, and lackluster niche actions haven’t been addressed.

However, whether this was what they intended for 6.0 or if this is them throwing together something they can call a rework beforehand is still a mystery and we won’t know for a few months yet. If it’s a stalling tactic, then they still ultimately made us wait until 6.0 for changes which frankly should be expected.

If this is actually what they were going to deliver in 6.0 though then I imagine this thread will reach 200 pages.

I agree with you here. While the changes fix the GL headaches and endgame content not being held back class restrictions (which was never something they looked at anyway). It does raise some concerns in the regard of 6.0 onward. What is the end result with this heavy handed change? While I welcome this change to release monk from the shackles of GL, I do wonder how the job will evolve from this. Mostly which skills will be removed, implemented, replaced, reworked. More importantly what do they want Monk to ultimately be with these changes prior to an expansion.

I agree that there is MORE to come in 6.0 and we will see something to the likes of MCH or DRK, a complete new direction of the job that has yet to be announced. I like the changes for 5.4 and is finally a new direction for monk, but remain optimistic (while skeptical) leading into 6.0 launch as we will more then likely see another major change. Skeptically is moderate due to the fact that monk has always been ignored every expansion and changed later in every expansions downhill trend.

My belief is that SE had the roadmap for 6.0 monk laid out back near the end of 4.0, and community backlash is ruining that roadmap. Which is why 5.0 monk was so lackluster and the cost is so high with monk as all the work prior is effectively being thrown out and needed to start over.

I agree this is the tip of the iceberg for monk and 6.0 launch will really start to see the ultimate NEW direction for monk. All that said I'm already getting my monk ready for 5.4 and testing it out to see what the new monk can really do.

[wereotter]

I would say it's still too soon to say if this "rework" isn't anything or if it is still something to be excited about. Yoshida didn't show TOO much on the live letter and admitted he doesn't know how the job plays, and they just gave us an overview of the changes.

But I would say that even if it is just a change that moves Greased Lightning from being a buff we have to maintain to a trait we always have active, and a reworking of skills that existed solely to either build, burn, or maintain that buff, that's still about as much of a rework as summoner or ninja got this expansion. Also if that is all it comes down to, I'll be glad to not be the only job to lose all my buffs when an in-fight cutscene decides to last longer than 15 seconds.

And this is good ground work to let them actually expand the job in a way they haven't been able to do for several expansions.

[Aelin_Ashryver]

One thing is forms really feel like they mean nothing now. Which is kinda meh. Also curious what is happening to Anatman. My main jobs, DRK, AST and MNK. All of which I loved due to high paced gameplay. They slowed DRK with ShB, they slowed astro with the card change recently, which really bugs me cuz I often lose my first seal due to game not realising I'm in combat quick enough. And MNK is now also changing a lot. Feel like they are slowing gameplay too much. I know monk will stay quick and I am glad not to lose stacks due to stupid cutscenes. I miss the challenging gameplay these jobs had.

[RyuDragnier]

I'm hoping GL being a passive buff and the move changes is them building towards a FF7R Tifa gameplay style for 6.0. Meaning you build stacks of a buff with combos, except you use the stacks for an actual burst combo that uses them all up with each hit. It keeps MNK rotation mostly similar while also allowing a little flair to it, and also brings it in line with the other melee who have bursts (since MNK just has a burst window, but no real burst moves).

[AnotherPerson]

I figure the GL buff being passive is really just a band aid until 6.0 The gauge doesn't seem to get a lot of interactivity which they will probably redesign and the skills are being adjusted to work with this change. I doubt the PR Department would let them introduce new skills and a new gauge mid expansion if that gauge was being used on 6.0 so the changes would most likely be incomplete. I can't say anything definite until I play the 5.4 Monk but I'm certain we'll see more changes with Monk by 6.0.

[Jirah]

I'm hoping GL being a passive buff and the move changes is them building towards a FF7R Tifa gameplay style for 6.0. Meaning you build stacks of a buff with combos, except you use the stacks for an actual burst combo that uses them all up with each hit. It keeps MNK rotation mostly similar while also allowing a little flair to it, and also brings it in line with the other melee who have bursts (since MNK just has a burst window, but no real burst moves).

Sounds a lot like DRG with the finisher crap, and did they even mention FF7R at all to make such a wild assumption

[RyuDragnier]

Sounds a lot like DRG with the finisher crap, and did they even mention FF7R at all to make such a wild assumption

Have you played FF7R? Tifa is how MNK SHOULD play. She's ridiculously fun to play as.

[Altagrave13456789]

i haven't played FFVII-R but i can't imagine action RPG mechanics porting over well to an MMO.

either way, i'm not optimistic on SE's competence in tuning Monk.