DRK QOL changes for 5.4

[currentlemon]

Thank you for doing this. The problem that I saw with DRK mains is that they never came together and provided QoL changes to the current DRK build after the expansion came out. Most would either get into arguments of what DRK should be or ramble all day what reworks work best for the job.

After 5.3, we need to come together and ask SE for some QoL changes like what the WAR mains did. At least for now until the later patches come out. Don't get me wrong, DRK definitely needs something, but we gotta start small first. A few changes like what you suggested is a start.

[bundythenoob]

Thank you for doing this. The problem that I saw with DRK mains is that they never came together and provided QoL changes to the current DRK build after the expansion came out. Most would either get into arguments of what DRK should be or ramble all day what reworks work best for the job.

After 5.3, we need to come together and ask SE for some QoL changes like what the WAR mains did. At least for now until the later patches come out. Don't get me wrong, DRK definitely needs something, but we gotta start small first. A few changes like what you suggested is a start.

I decided to do this after seeing that DRK threads were getting nowhere. I've been posting some ideas here and there over the last month or 2, but there was much more that could be done by the DRK community as a whole to make the current build of our job a little more fun. As much as I want STB DRK back, it's in the past now, and I'd rather see this iteration be made into the best version of itself possible than to just sit around and complain/theorycraft all day and get nothing actually done to make the job feel and play better.

Agree, blood skill potency nerf is abit mixed but if its for balance due to other skills idc. Abyssal drain is too weak, and Stalwart Soul is wayyyyy to far in the toolkit for a aoe combo, Warrior got Mythril tempest pre 50 why didnt Drk....no i dont want the jobs to be carbon copies but its a freaking aoe

I agree with your statement that the jobs should not be carbon copies, but the fact that all 3 other tanks get their aoe combo at lv 40 but DRK has to wait until lv 72 is kind of unwarranted. In my opinion, all 4 tanks having AOE combos at lv 40 is a step towards good homogenisation, because this allows new players to carry over their fundamentals over between jobs. say a PLD wants to try DRK after they reach Heavensward, it would be nice if they can carry over basic skills while learning the different playstyles of the job.

[cactuarzzzz]

Thank you for doing this. The problem that I saw with DRK mains is that they never came together and provided QoL changes to the current DRK build after the expansion came out. Most would either get into arguments of what DRK should be or ramble all day what reworks work best for the job.

After 5.3, we need to come together and ask SE for some QoL changes like what the WAR mains did. At least for now until the later patches come out. Don't get me wrong, DRK definitely needs something, but we gotta start small first. A few changes like what you suggested is a start.

You can try searching the whole tank forum for other a threads since 5.0

https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...elirium-rework

It isn't that DRK never came together and provided QoL changes but it's that at some point it always get foiled , hindered , derailed by other tank especially WAR. "In the name of balance blah blah blah" and now WAR get everything they want except being numba one in term of dps among the tanks. We'll see how 5.3 change fflog.


Also..

It was in the pax event before SHB launch where certain streamers go invited to try the job changes, xenosys vex raised his concerns with living dead to Yoship during his interview, he get a "we will look at it" from Yoship and nothing more since then.

What Yoshida has been doing since then is upgrade WAR and completely ignore DRK.

[Xtrasweettea]

Literal hindering

I feel like we are back in StB with this WAR hate from DRKs.

The patterns feel very familiar: WAR gets something, DRKs hate. DRKs complain about WAR. Community responds. DRK gets upset that response isn’t always echoing their feelings. DRK complains and blames “WAR mains.” Cycle continues.

I was nice with my comment within that other thread you started. Though, since I am seeing you here actually hindering a discussion with a theme that I think many of us could get behind, my comment here to isn’t going to be as nice.

DRK is in the state it is in because the community made it that way, and the community still hasn’t accepted any responsibility for making DRK the way it is. Yes, it is your fault why DRK the way it is.

This whole mess of DRK being a “WAR with darkness and magic” theme we have going on right now is the fault of the community constantly fighting between DRK and WAR. DRK players in StB kept fighting for the same spot in parties as WAR. Instead of trying to compete equally with PLD and WAR, DRKs only focused on WARs.

DRKs only compared themselves to WAR.

Look what you got now: DRK with no unique theme but a powerful shield, an invul that people don’t like, weird level ability placement, and it grows into a WAR clone. What else SE was going to think when for almost all of StB, DRKs focused their attention on WAR?

If you want to keep this WAR clone theme going and messy room of a level ability leveling scheme: keep doing what you are doing.


As for “balance”, yeah, they have to consider that. That’s why in the other thread, I stated SE only adjusted pieces of code that were small. Small changes are easier to implement when considering "balance."

[cactuarzzzz]

I feel like we are back in StB with this WAR hate from DRKs.

The patterns feel very familiar: WAR gets something, DRKs hate. DRKs complain about WAR. Community responds. DRK gets upset that response isn’t always echoing their feelings. DRK complains and blames “WAR mains.” Cycle continues.

I was nice with my comment within that other thread you started. Though, since I am seeing you here actually hindering a discussion with a theme that I think many of us could get behind, my comment here to isn’t going to be as nice.

DRK is in the state it is in because the community made it that way, and the community still hasn’t accepted any responsibility for making DRK the way it is. Yes, it is your fault why DRK the way it is.

This whole mess of DRK being a “WAR with darkness and magic” theme we have going on right now is the fault of the community constantly fighting between DRK and WAR. DRK players in StB kept fighting for the same spot in parties as WAR. Instead of trying to compete equally with PLD and WAR, DRKs only focused on WARs.

DRKs only compared themselves to WAR.

Look what you got now: DRK with no unique theme but a powerful shield, an invul that people don’t like, weird level ability placement, and it grows into a WAR clone. What else SE was going to think when for almost all of StB, DRKs focused their attention on WAR?

If you want to keep this WAR clone theme going and messy room of a level ability leveling scheme: keep doing what you are doing.


As for “balance”, yeah, they have to consider that. That’s why in the other thread, I stated SE only adjusted pieces of code that were small. Small changes are easier to implement when considering "balance."

Show me the proof that "DRK is in the state it is in because the community made it that way"!

You believing DRK is one who start attacking WAR? I have proof that every time DRK create a thread it's always WAR that came with intention to hinder/derail us.

WAR have a habit to go to the next neighbourhood and make sure they're the top.



https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...ut-Living-Dead
"We really need to talk about living dead"
OP did not even mention WAR.

https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...ad-not-removed
This thread too. OP did not even mention WAR or other tank but then guess who show up to troll?

even 2 of of my DRK changes thread that doesn't even mention WAR too
https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...t-won-t-happen.
https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...Knight-QOL-V.2

[Xtrasweettea]

Show me the proof that "DRK is in the state it is in because the community made it that way"!

I have proof that Every time DRK create a thread it's always WAR that came with intention to hinder/derail us.

You want an article? You want an insider's leak? You want Yoshi P next to a fireplace in a Cosby sweater telling you?

Yeah no, none of that exists.

What exists is this version of DRK we have now, compared to what is certainly alien in design from two previous expansions. That is the proof: a poor man's version of WAR with a shield and a leveling scheme that doesn't make much sense.

SE couldn't have just decided to make a WAR clone on their own. The community had their hand in making DRK as it is today based on the feedback provided and the conversations that were had. The community has blame for the DRK we deserve.

[cactuarzzzz]

You want an article? You want an insider's leak? You want Yoshi P next to a fireplace in a Cosby sweater telling you?

Yeah no, none of that exists.

What exists is this version of DRK we have now, compared to what is certainly alien in design from two previous expansions. That is the proof: a poor man's version of WAR with a shield and a leveling scheme that doesn't make much sense.

SE couldn't have just decided to make a WAR clone on their own. The community had their hand in making DRK as it is today based on the feedback provided and the conversations that were had. The community has blame for the DRK we deserve.

In other word you just blowing and air with nothing to back you up.

[Xtrasweettea]

In other you just blowing and air with nothing to back you up.

I like how you need proof when there's a chance you and your actions, current and historical, gave us the DRK we have right now.

Meanwhile, you have no problem blowing hot air when it comes to WAR adjustments. You state motives about SE with no proof.

[Xtrasweettea]

You believing DRK is one who start attacking WAR? I have proof that every time DRK create a thread it's always WAR that came with intention to hinder/derail us.

IT IS WAR THAT ALWAYS COMPARE THEMSELVES WITH OTHER TANK AND MAKE COMMOTION WHEN IT DOESN'T MAKE WAR SUPERIOR AND THEY AREN'T WHERE THEY BELONG TO AKA TOP TANK.

Nice ninja edit.

Maybe you should walk away from the keyboard for a few hours and come back when you are calmer. Long enough for you to collect your thoughts and reflect.

As for "attacking", that is incorrect. I didn't state attacking: I stated "comparing" and "complaining." Attacking is not the same thing as either of those.

As for the "WAR always compare" etc., this literal tribalism speaking. This is "us versus them." Being competitive with the other three tanks is not the same as what you are believing within your own head cannon. WAR mains are not oppressing DRKs nor holding DRKs back, your own attitude is.

Your actions, your language, your demeanor, and your accusations makes me want to just not even bother with trying to have open discussions on trying to fix a job I don't main. Myself and other tanks are empathetic to the shortcomings of DRK in its current state. Unfortunately, the attitude that you bring to the discussion (like this one you brought to a discussion about the DRK leveling scheme) makes myself and others not want to bother.

That is why stated what I wrote. You have to sit back and think how much of this damage is self inflicted. Do I have blame? Yes I do. I accept my part in what made DRK it is the way it is currently.

[Xtrasweettea]

Stop with the ninja edits. It destroys conversation flow and makes it looks like I am dodging parts of your responses on purpose.

"We really need to talk about living dead"

Literally on page one, comparison to Holmgang a WAR ability, while ignoring the GNB and PLD invuls:

Especially when you comare Living Dead to the changes Holmgang got.

Before you could say Holmgang had the downside that you needed a target and the WAR could not move while using it. But that is gone now, making the skill better in any regard than Living Dead, except the duration, but when will you get the full 10 seconds out of Living Dead anyway? You are dead at 10...

This thread too. OP did not even mention WAR or other tank but then guess who show up to troll?

You mean Heirro? One person, who only said one line? The guy who said “it’s fine?”

Also, comparison to WAR again, one page one:

They were too busy removing the movement penalty on Holmgang to fix Living Dead.

At least this could be a legit complaint. Though removing the movement penalty was easier than what was proposed to LD.

even 2 of of my DRK changes thread that doesn't even mention WAR too

The first one, zero likes, but came with a full conversation that was productive. There was no mention of other tanks either, just mentions of older versions of DRK.

As for the second thread, yeah, no WAR comparisons, but people were not really open to discussing with you too much either.