Tales from Duty Finder: Some make you laugh, some make you cry. Let's vent.

[Liam_Harper]

Even using provoke on cooldown, if the other tank isn't using stance, the main tank should be able to snap aggro right back. provoke without tank stance just gives you top enmity +1.

Not true since 5.0. Provoke generates a bit of extra enmity on use now. Iirc it's about a 2000 potency worth, more than enough that your co-tank shouldn't steal back unless they all-out IR or you drop stance.

Tank stance is 10x the emnity. A 2k tank won't lose aggro to a 19k BLM. (However a dps CAN steal mobs in dungeons with heavy burst from a tank who hits a mob once while running). If you're a tank and struggling to keep aggro from a co-tank without stance, they're definitely voking. If you're stealing aggro from a tank as dps, they either have no stance or simply aren't using any abilities.

Heal actions have reduced emnity since 5.0. It's as low as 0.35 for WhM/Ast. Paired with tanks 10x, Regen/Medica II will almost never rip agro if your tank has hit the boss/mob.

And that's todays lesson on 5.0 emnity.

[Kaoru_Nagisa]

I also found out I can't shirk tanks in other parties. Maybe SE should fix that at least for alliances.

Honestly, I wish they would. I can put Aurora on another party's tank, but I can't shirk them whatsoever and sometimes I'd really like to be able to.

Had a... I think it was either Rabanastre or Ridorana, but we had a designated 'MT' who was doing quite well at their job and I usually try not to MT Alliance raids unless the other tanks are just that dang bad (mostly because I hate the stupid aggro wars everyone wants to get into). However the third tank kept trying to steal aggro off and on for bosses, and then would run the boss around in circles or spin it out of control. I ended up having to try helping the MT out by using up my provoke after Mister Big Man stole it off them (they'd wait until the MT had used up their own provoke before trying to voke off them, if they weren't stealing aggro via sitting in tank stance spamming combos), pull the boss back into position, then turn off my stance to let the MT take it back.

The MT picked up what I was doing the second time around, so they were prepared for it, but even with me and the MT working together to keep the boss in its proper place and them at the top, the process still would have been a lot easier to do if I could have Shirk'd him. Even turning off my stance, I'd still keep aggro for a good few seconds just from doing my regular No Mercy combo.

[Yue_Amariyo]

Not true since 5.0. Provoke generates a bit of extra enmity on use now. Iirc it's about a 2000 potency worth, more than enough that your co-tank shouldn't steal back unless they all-out IR or you drop stance.

Tank stance is 10x the emnity. A 2k tank won't lose aggro to a 19k BLM. (However a dps CAN steal mobs in dungeons with heavy burst from a tank who hits a mob once while running). If you're a tank and struggling to keep aggro from a co-tank without stance, they're definitely voking. If you're stealing aggro from a tank as dps, they either have no stance or simply aren't using any abilities.

Heal actions have reduced emnity since 5.0. It's as low as 0.35 for WhM/Ast. Paired with tanks 10x, Regen/Medica II will almost never rip agro if your tank has hit the boss/mob.

And that's todays lesson on 5.0 emnity.

you have a source? as everything i read up is provoke only does +1 on the list.

[Quintessa]

Ask this in the tank forums they'll all tell you the same thing, and even I'll tell you that it's not just A +1 anymore.

[Mhaeric]

you have a source? as everything i read up is provoke only does +1 on the list.

It definitely does more than just +1 now.

Here's one of the early reddit posts showing how much effective damage just a provoke by itself is worth: https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comme...at_is_bonkers/
Here's a post providing more details on provoke's potency and how it works: https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/wiki/enmity#wiki_tank

[Dillonja]

A few weeks ago, I was doing my daily roulettes on my pally, and got into a keeper of the lake group. I start my normal 2x-a-pack trash pulls (as is pretty much expected of competent tanks in low level content), and we make it to the first boss trouble free. I pull the boss and suddenly notice I am the only one doing anything. All three other members are just standing there, inside the boss 'arena,' watching me fight.

"Do you think maybe you could slow it down a little?" says the healer. "I am new to this dungeon."

Exasperated and below half health, I rapidly reply:

"Do you think you could maybe heal me and we could have this discussion after the boss?"

"No."

We wipe. I say something nasty and leave.

Totally not opposed to tanking more slowly, but a "ha ha, I'll teach YOU a lesson!" message just isn't going to register.

i ran into a similar issue except a little different. I was pacing slower due to the team outputting very low damage in sohm al then suddenly at the very last trash pull of the dungeon the dps who was doing very poorly the whole dungeon cries out saying to do bigger pulls. lol It like why didnt he say something earlier if he felt this way. Not that I wouldve since me and the healer would have agreed not to.

[Lammas]

you have a source? as everything i read up is provoke only does +1 on the list.

Don't read out-dated stuff from past expansions maybe

You're asking for proof for a year old change. It's even on the in-game tooltip: "while gaining additional enmity".

[Ursa_Vonfiebryd]

To Tank Wars:

It's all fun and games until you cleave the raid with [insert boss cleave here].

In my case it was Agrias' Thunder Slash. Killed us good. On a positive note, that seemed to end the squabbling. XD

[Cincierta]

Got out of a Stone Vigil random roulette party on my alt as RDM. Rest of the party comp was GNB, AST, and DRG.

It was actually one of the best PUG runs I've had in a while in there. The GNB tank was pulling everything, both me and the drg were aoeing everything, the Ast was keeping the tank up and helping to dps. Whole run took just under 10 min to get to the boss.

To that party, you guys were absolutely awesome! :3

[Berethos]

you have a source? as everything i read up is provoke only does +1 on the list.

Even without the math that others have done to back it up, it's easy enough to test. Get another player or your chocobo to hit something and have aggro, then use Provoke without any follow-up abilities (not even auto-attack). Try it with and without tank stance on. You absolutely gain a lead that's higher than a simple +1 on enmity - if it worked that way, the very next action from the other player or your chocobo would always grab aggro back, even if it was just an auto-attack. Instead, it will take either a powerful enough attack or multiple smaller attacks to catch back up if you are doing nothing at all - and that's because it gives you additional enmity when used.

Worth noting that it applies this additional enmity even when used to pull (not that you'll need it for pulls, but can be useful for pesky adds that sneak past your AoE due to unlucky server ticks, in the way Shield Lob/Tomahawk/etc are, with the added bonus of a bit more range) - again testing with a Chocobo using it as a first hit and no other action leads to either it taking 6-7 hits to steal it from me with no tank stance, or me holding it the entire time with tank stance. In comparison, hitting it once with an auto-attack without tank stance, it takes 1-2 hits for my Chocobo to steal aggro, and takes around 4-5 with tank stance after smacking the mob with an auto-attack and doing nothing else.