What do you guys think is the cause of severe lack of Tank users?

[Satarn]

Why create an engaging system of enmity generation for tanks when you can simply create an engaging system of damage generation for tanks (the latter being what most people are actually asking for, outside of a few like yourself)?

Nah, I'm actually constantly whining about tank dps mechanics being way too dumbed down as well. I've done so in this very thread too.

The reason I advocate for things beyond dps rotations to have depth added, is simply because I actually like, you know, tanking and want the role to be able to express player skill in more ways than just being a good Blue Icon DPS that happens to take autos. If I just wanted more complex rotation and more damage I already have that on DPS jobs - with tanks I want all of it. With reasonably scaled down dps of course, because trinity rules.

What I want from threat generation is for it to be playing in tandem with the damage mechanics - it's an easy way to add extra variance to the rotation as well as something more to pay attention too, while also making you feel like you're actually making an effort to protect your team. I can not stress that enough - I am not asking for hate mechanics to be restored to how they worked in XIV in the past, as I completely agree it's been done poorly and lacked engagement. If you can't imagine why people would like enmity to be a thing though, then I guess you haven't played games in which that aspect was really impactful to the point where players really noticed it when you were good at it.

I find it strange that you on one hand complain that tanking is too easy because of the enmity changes (which were one of the few things that they got right), and yet you seem to think the idea of tank deaths having more impact is too unforgiving.

I'm not complaining that tanking's been made easy because of enmity changes - I'm complaining that it's been made easy for several reasons(streamlined mitigation, less positioning, braindead damage mechanics on the tank jobs) and that also threat should be a thing tanks pay attention to - those are two separate points.

Neither have I argued against deaths having more impact - just against going so far as to wipe the entire, damn party every time a tank dies. There is also a difference between something being difficult in a challenging way by being easy to fail if you don't pay attention and being just terribly punishing while unlikely to fail. I find the first engaging, the other cheap. As an example - I'd rather have mitigation and enmity require more planning and attention, leading to more frequent tank deaths/aggro drops(if tank isn't doing their job well of course), leading to single DPS/healer deaths every time and thus snowballing into a wipe after happening a couple of times, rather than just missing a single cd once in a blue moon, instantly wiping the group.

"Plenty of people" is essentially hearsay from your surroundings.

Dude, are you going to pretend that SHB hasn't started a mass of difficulty and engagement complaints on the tank and healer side, which were not nearly as prevalent in the previous expansions? You can be content yourself, that's your right and good for you, but you can't argue that nothing changed in terms of player satisfaction.

However, the part where you said that you'd kick a dps for performing low but you'd keep a tank purely based on the criteria that he doesn't die is quite the double standard.

Never said I would do that, just that it's an approach many people have - since you were trying to argue that the community looks harsher at tanks than DPS, which I find untrue. The shit I've seen and heard of tanks do and get away with in savage/ultimate is unreal.

I mained healer for years, I levelled most of the DPS classes, now I got into tanking and I find it waaaay harder.

Tbh everything seems hard when you're only just learning it for the first time.