Geomancer

[BasicBlake]

Consider this: Starting from 72, WHM's elemental spells were changed to light spells, it's likely a part of the reason this talk of healer GEO is even hapening, so so it already is happening.

Why would they take elements from white mage to give to another healer? Healer mains whine enough about homogenization.

[SeikishiYuuki]

Consider this: Starting from 72, WHM's elemental spells were changed to light spells, it's likely a part of the reason this talk of healer GEO is even hapening, so so it already is happening.

I mean sure sure, it is distinctly more likely Astro will lose noct sect, its already on life support but wholly less useful than Diurnal and you could take off noct sect and the class would be completely viable and you wouldn't have to even change any abilities.
As to the elemental spells coming of WHM, I doesn't really make sense to rip one healer to make a discount version of them. When they could use those things to make a unique caster DPS and separate distinct themes and tools to make a new healer.

[BasicBlake]

I mean sure sure, it is distinctly more likely Astro will lose noct sect, its already on life support but wholly less useful than Diurnal and you could take off noct sect and the class would be completely viable and you wouldn't have to even change any abilities.
As to the elemental spells coming of WHM, I doesn't really make sense to rip one healer to make a discount version of them. When they could use those things to make a unique caster DPS and separate distinct themes and tools to make a new healer.

Not to mention the Conjurer evolution to white mage is canon for every white mage in 14 lore, just the WoL. White Mage was holy/light aspected to begin with until Gelmorra and it’s abundance of stone and earth Aether caused the white mages of the city to delve into stone magic. So while our WoL started as a CNJ, it was not like that for the probably WHM. And why the transition from stone/aero/heal the forest to getting stuff like Holy always felt like such a drastic leap when it comes to class identity.

[BasicBlake]

To further what I was saying about aspected monsters and fights.

I am not sure if anyone here has done it, but the final boss of Amdapoor Hard is a good example of a white mage coded monster. Or what you would expect from a white magic user.

Then we have Seiryu in the Four Lords quest line that heavily ties into Yanxian Geomancy. If you go back and do the fight, or watch a youtube video of the extreme version of the fight, you have a Geomancy coded monster. Seiryu is thought to be the "God of Geomancy" in Yanxia and is the diety that Geomancers pray to. The whole fight involves shikigami (Yoshi did say Geo was going to be more onmyouji themed than previous iterations and true to feng shui roots), avoiding Tengu (who are the spirits thought to have taught Ganen Geomancy to begin with), the summoning of giant water elementals akin to the boss in Swallow's Compass, and then the breaking of the stage involving Wind, Water and Earth. You fight on a small island while tornados and gales go on around you, and you are pushed around by waves of snakes. It's also another instance of a prominent lore Geomancer using a sword. Ganen was known as a master swordsman and was never seen without his katana and bell, and Seiryu is wielding a sword throughout the fight. Neither of these famous Geomancers was known as a healer in any way, shape, or form of any game's version of healing.

[MirronTulaxia]

He is talking about FFXIV though. In certain missions people like Yugiri get some form of heal to help you along through the quest, not talking about setting the precedent for a dedicated ninja healer. The astro quest lines did talk about how they had some similarities, but nowhere in the game or books compared Geomancer to conjurer, that is purely player talk on the forums. Levava has spent how many expansions now, and Eorzea years around conjurers and white mages, yet she refers to Kyokohu's school of magic as it's own. Not as a Far Eastern Conjurer, and not as an offshoot of Astrologians.

Could they make this the first ever healing Geomancer? Yes. Would it be dumb, also yes.

I never said they were a Far Eastern Conjurer. I'm quite positive it's a separate thing from the rest. My point is simply that there is enough to say "they could be something else". From a more meta standpoint the change of White Mage makes me suspect it as well. And it wouldn't be "dumb" just because you like something else.

[BasicBlake]

I never said they were a Far Eastern Conjurer. I'm quite positive it's a separate thing from the rest. My point is simply that there is enough to say "they could be something else". From a more meta standpoint the change of White Mage makes me suspect it as well. And it wouldn't be "dumb" just because you like something else.

Taking away animations from one healer to put it on another healer with the same animations is what I would consider dumb, nothing to do with my own personal bias.

[SeikishiYuuki]

I never said they were a Far Eastern Conjurer. I'm quite positive it's a separate thing from the rest. My point is simply that there is enough to say "they could be something else". From a more meta standpoint the change of White Mage makes me suspect it as well. And it wouldn't be "dumb" just because you like something else.

It doesn't make sense to chop one job in half and make it too less unique jobs. There's a ton of lore and in game content to make Geo a unique caster dps is my point. It'd be totally wasted to make it a healer when there's probably a good 2-5 better options for a healer. There aren't a lot of good caster DPS options left and none with as much established in universe that are coded DPS.

[MirronTulaxia]

It doesn't make sense to chop one job in half and make it too less unique jobs. There's a ton of lore and in game content to make Geo a unique caster dps is my point. It'd be totally wasted to make it a healer when there's probably a good 2-5 better options for a healer. There aren't a lot of good caster DPS options left and none with as much established in universe that are coded DPS.

There really aren't any other healer options that aren't White Magic related other than Chemist. And of those White Magic related jobs they're either White Mage+ or mixed with Black Magic, neither of which really makes it a "better" healer option than Geomancer. What is better or worse is ultimately subjective, and at least for me I wouldn't consider Chemist as a Healer better than Geomancer.

And none of what I'm proposing is taking the same animations, simply the aesthetics. White Mages changes make sense in this light. Otherwise it just seems somewhat arbitrary.

[Archwizard]

There really aren't any other healer options that aren't White Magic related other than Chemist. And of those White Magic related jobs they're either White Mage+ or mixed with Black Magic, neither of which really makes it a "better" healer option than Geomancer. What is better or worse is ultimately subjective, and at least for me I wouldn't consider Chemist as a Healer better than Geomancer.

And none of what I'm proposing is taking the same animations, simply the aesthetics. White Mages changes make sense in this light. Otherwise it just seems somewhat arbitrary.

I mean.
Elements are fairly arbitrary in 14. Aesthetics are arbitrary by definition.

Prior to 14 the only consistency with magic was "Black Mage gets Fire, Ice, and Lightning, White Mage gets Holy and Cure." There are as many entries with Aero and Stone classed as Black Magic as there are classed as White Magic, and since they're all just "Magic" damage to a healer (most classes in general, really, aside from BLM and BLU, since only those two treat elements as mechanical differences) the actual choice of elements available to the healer is purely cosmetic.

Meanwhile, there is a logical fallacy in assuming that just because something was "taken away" from one job, it'll go to another job. It could be gone simply because the devs don't want anyone to have it, or at least don't care enough to keep it.

[MirronTulaxia]

1. I wouldn't say they're arbitrary. Black Mages got the elements they did because of tradition. White Mages (presumably) got the elements they did to contrast Black Mages. They might not be groundbreaking or really of any import beyond tradition, but tradition is as valid a reason as any other in this instance.

2. I would say broadly the consistency with Black and White Magic isn't specific spells so much as the intent behind them. Black Mages have spells to kill enemies faster, White Mages help your party survive.

3. For a Healer I would agree that the difference is pretty much just aesthetics (though even then, they could certainly do something with elements for a Healer, I could come up with something where it's meaningful off the top of my head using Geomancer as a base, and likely other designs).

4. If you'd like to point out what specific logical fallacy it is feel free. Something tells me you're using logical fallacy as stand-in for "saying something I don't agree with".

5. I didn't say that they absolutely would use those elements for another healer, or even another job at all. Merely positing a theory that it would make sense if they did those changes because they had those plans, not saying those plans will happen.

6. In this instance I strongly doubt the developers don't want anyone to have wind/earth/water magic, especially as we already know Blue Mages still have those. Since we know that isn't the case then asking why they made those changes is at least somewhat important to investigate.

7. If you have any other theories on why they made that change that aren't simply "because they felt like it" feel free to throw them out there. So far the only answer you've given is "they don't want anyone to have that" which is not sensible. And yes, as always it could simply be arbitrary, I said as such in that post. All answers could be seemingly arbitrary or lack noteworthy meaning, but as that just squelches conversation without adding anything meaningful it's not really worthwhile to pursue. If that is the case then the answer is already had, so exploring alternative branches is better.

Edit: I'll clarify that last point a bit. Every possible change has a myriad of theoretical reasons behind them. One of those reasons, always, is something along the lines of "because they feel like it/it's arbitrary". That path isn't fruitful. It tells us nothing. There isn't really any evidence you can bring up to support or denounce it, unlike literally every other path. Because of that, to me, it's simply better to explore other possible answers to see what lines up and what doesn't.