You Guys need to UP your housing "fix" attempts.

[Kytrin]

So what exactly are you proposing here? Are you proposing that their be FC housing wards and Personal housing wards? - Which I think would help out somewhat, and is what I'd prefer. Or are you proposing an idea of "unlimited plots?" - I guess this isn't a terrible idea. Or something completely different? I'm very curious.

I believe Jojoya is referring to straight up dynamic instanced housing where as many people as want to can buy a house at a particular location and build, decorate, and upgrade on it. In practice it would be a lot like apartments are currently only no wards and no specific limit on how many there can be. Which isn't a bad idea really, but the devs have made it pretty clear by now that a total overhaul to the system to implement something like that is about as likely as Nidhogg wrecking Washington D.C. out of nowhere.

They'd have to invest significant time/resources to do it, as well as find a way to scrap the current system in a way that wouldn't cause instant fury from the player base, and there's a fair amount of debate if they even CAN do it that way thanks to server/coding/engine limitations. I wouldn't hold my breath on it happening personally. You're FAR more likely to see them rework apartments and switch to a ward system where houses are for FCs only and apartments are for players only. Though given their radio silence on the matter thus far, that's also something I wouldn't specifically hold my breath for currently.

[EthanXdeath]

You're FAR more likely to see them rework apartments and switch to a ward system where houses are for FCs only and apartments are for players only.

Sounds awful.

[Kytrin]

Sounds awful.

It doesn't have to be. If they can bring apartments to a place where you can upgrade to the equivalent of a medium or large house in terms of size, and you can get a lot of really nice amenities with it then I expect a lot of people would cheerfully buy and upgrade their condos. The reason people don't like them now is because they're the equivalent of a small house's basement with three very in the way windows at the back.

Apartments need some serious love before they'll be seen as a viable alternative to your average player, but if the devs put the work in then they could be truly incredible. Heck, people have been suggesting all sorts of possible upgrades and ways to make apartments work well so they don't lack for ideas at least. And since apartments can't be demolished that eliminates the stress of losing one if you have to unsub because of life.

[EthanXdeath]

It doesn't have to be. If they can bring apartments to a place where you can upgrade to the equivalent of a medium or large house in terms of size, and you can get a lot of really nice amenities with it then I expect a lot of people would cheerfully buy and upgrade their condos. The reason people don't like them now is because they're the equivalent of a small house's basement with three very in the way windows at the back.

Apartments need some serious love before they'll be seen as a viable alternative to your average player, but if the devs put the work in then they could be truly incredible. Heck, people have been suggesting all sorts of possible upgrades and ways to make apartments work well so they don't lack for ideas at least. And since apartments can't be demolished that eliminates the stress of losing one if you have to unsub because of life.

Literally probably 5 minutes after I read your initial reply, I saw you had posted something about apartment upgrades as a thread. Went and read that and thought that actually doesn't sound to bad at all!

[Kytrin]

Literally probably 5 minutes after I read your initial reply, I saw you had posted something about apartment upgrades as a thread. Went and read that and thought that actually doesn't sound to bad at all!

Hey awesome! I'm glad you like my thoughts! If you have any to add feel free!

[Thee_Freshness]

It doesn't have to be. If they can bring apartments to a place where you can upgrade to the equivalent of a medium or large house in terms of size, and you can get a lot of really nice amenities with it then I expect a lot of people would cheerfully buy and upgrade their condos. The reason people don't like them now is because they're the equivalent of a small house's basement with three very in the way windows at the back.

Apartments need some serious love before they'll be seen as a viable alternative to your average player, but if the devs put the work in then they could be truly incredible. Heck, people have been suggesting all sorts of possible upgrades and ways to make apartments work well so they don't lack for ideas at least. And since apartments can't be demolished that eliminates the stress of losing one if you have to unsub because of life.

I think my biggest concern with this is that it's a good deal more dev work than just algorithmic increase in the number of wards based on demand and still leaves you with a significantly less attractive solution. Now, I may well be in the minority here in thinking of housing as the one of the main areas where I dip my toes into RP. I'm a Gridanian white mage; I want to live somewhere pretty and in the forest and with lots of green. Housing is an indulgent thing and there's nothing particularly appealing about apartments when viewed through that lens.

Like I said, I am probably in the minority here in wanting housing to be a reflection of my character conception. Maybe some people would actually prefer apartments. It just strikes me that it would be a great deal more work to implement than what would be, to me, a more attractive answer.

Me buying tickets for my inevitable move to Ishgard when The Firmament opens in...October? December?

[Kytrin]

I think my biggest concern with this is that it's a good deal more dev work than just algorithmic increase in the number of wards based on demand and still leaves you with a significantly less attractive solution. Now, I may well be in the minority here in thinking of housing as the one of the main areas where I dip my toes into RP. I'm a Gridanian white mage; I want to live somewhere pretty and in the forest and with lots of green. Housing is an indulgent thing and there's nothing particularly appealing about apartments when viewed through that lens.

Well yes, of course apartments aren't an attractive alternative in their current format. They're too small and cramped, the back windows are difficult to work with and around, and it's a royal pain to build out anything even halfway decent in general. It can be done, but you won't get more than a 1 bedroom place with it. There's simply not enough space or slots to build out anything more complex.

That's why I was saying that they need some serious overhauling and attention from the devs to upgrade them into something nice. It was never simply about increasing the number of apartments available. They need to give us something much nicer to work with than we have currently. But if they actually put in the time, effort, and energy into it then they could turn out to be something very nice, perhaps even nice enough for your Gridanian mage to take a second glance at. And if they did it well enough it would do quite a bit for the housing situation in general. We might even stop seeing 50+ million threads in housing and general discussion howling about how awful the timers are and so on and so forth. It would make a nice change.

On a side note, I don't think we'll see Firmament housing in a few months. The rebuild is supposed to last up until 6.0, which is a good year or so away as is.

[Thee_Freshness]

Well yes, of course apartments aren't an attractive alternative in their current format. They're too small and cramped, the back windows are difficult to work with and around, and it's a royal pain to build out anything even halfway decent in general. It can be done, but you won't get more than a 1 bedroom place with it. There's simply not enough space or slots to build out anything more complex.

That's why I was saying that they need some serious overhauling and attention from the devs to upgrade them into something nice. It was never simply about increasing the number of apartments available. They need to give us something much nicer to work with than we have currently. But if they actually put in the time, effort, and energy into it then they could turn out to be something very nice, perhaps even nice enough for your Gridanian mage to take a second glance at. And if they did it well enough it would do quite a bit for the housing situation in general. We might even stop seeing 50+ million threads in housing and general discussion howling about how awful the timers are and so on and so forth. It would make a nice change.

On a side note, I don't think we'll see Firmament housing in a few months. The rebuild is supposed to last up until 6.0, which is a good year or so away as is.

I suspect you're right about the housing. I was under the impression it would be at least the last 5.x patch before it was completed.

I'm open to the idea of apartments, but I struggle to imagine a situation where the exterior will be comparable to Lavender Beds. I'd would love to be proven wrong on that one and appreciate where you're going with this.