Whats with the chemist obsession?

[Claire_Pendragon]

I've always imagined CHM as a healer with no cast time to use potions for healing but mixing or amalgamating them does require a cast time. It would be a high mobility healer and a handbag as a weapon true to its FFT roots.

dont fool yourself.
CHM will still cast basic cure spells. Mixing will be done like Aetherflow on SCH. It will give 3 ethers, and 3 potions, which are just oGCDs to manage MP and help supplement their casted cures.
(Otherwise its good ol "mixing" in place of a cast bar, which requires u to stand still anyways, and still takes up MP to mix)
I know this isnt what we want to hear, but we need to stay grounded, otherwise the disappointment will only hurt ya in the end.

If Chemist don't use MP, then they wouldn't need piety.

Because a Non-Caster Type of Healer would be really cool and interesting.

Not gonna happen. Thats why SE decided against it, and made AST instead. We need dem reskinned caster WHM healers...

whereas Chemist would be the first non-magical based healer that could possibly open up role variety which is sorely lacking with healers at the moment.

They havent done that for tanks, much less do that for healers. Even if it started out nonmagical, it will just end up using castbars by the following expansion, all for homogenization purposes. er, i mean "balance".

One idea...magitech

I like it. I always wondered why SE never really tried to use Magictech more for some of the jobs. It woulda helped with lore reasons on some of the jobs we currently have, which just instead went with really simplistic retcons that didnt try very hard.

This is a non-issue. Main stat is an illusion.

we all know this. the problem is, does SE know this? I dont see a single tank outside of fending gear. i dont see a single healer outside of healer gear. heck, even DNC uses aiming gear instead of scouting. Its safe to say SE is set intheri ways at this point. Even BLU couldnt be a real job, because they had an impression of what BLU had to be, and what would be allowed in game, so instead of a true compromise, they just made it a limited job, which is essentially neither of the 2 things in the long run, and useless.

Could just make Piety and Mind completly irrelevant for a Chemist. And instead of MP they completly Function off their Job Gauge.
Or give them a gauge similar to the old TP gauge. What are traditionally secondary stats could become a Chemists Main stats which woukd make Materia melding really interesting.
But If the devs and Yoshi decide chemist is a good idea for a healer, I trust them to come up with an idea that will work.

They will use PIE, and thats the stat they will grant the party as a bonus as well.
I wouldnt trust them, they couldnt even give DRK superbolide, saying a tank move that reduces HP wouldnt make sense. They clearly arent putting more than "a single days meeting" behind the design process of the jobs. Most of their time goes into animations.

For clarification, I would love a non caster healer, thats not a reskined holy mage, as much as the next person. (more than you realize) but SE will never go this route. Expect a reskin like GEO or Devout. Otherwise it will be a ruined limited job like BLU.

The only compromise I can think of, that SE still wouldnt do, but could be argued to them if given the chance, is to have a 0.5s cast bar (mix) followed by a long 1s throw animation. This way the heal still takes 1.5s+ to reach the target. (Technically a few more adjustments to traits, to balance other issues)
This should "almost" mimic their requirement to force healers to stand still for cures, and for the cures to not be thrown out solely as reactive abilities, due to the delay mimicing the timing of hallowedground/benne. (The reason I say they wont do this, is because they refused to do it for Bow mages and Gun mages in HW. All they had to do, was give them a 0.5s cast bar, and it wouldnt have pissed off as many ppl as it did. They only go one extreme, or the other, and never in the middle.)

[RyuDragnier]

I don't think a non caster healer will ever happen. The healer gear is based on magic stats and the role actions are for a caster class. Piety, the healer stat, is also made for casters.

It's based on Mind. If we accept Intelligence as simply being that, then Mind can easily be Wisdom. It's not hard to make a concoction, but it takes wisdom to know what could cause more harm than good.

If Chemist don't use MP, then they wouldn't need piety.

Not if the "spells" are based on aether slightly drained from the user's body itself via magitek. It's something the Garleans would have easily figured out how to do. Such tech would also allow any Garlean unable to use magic to use it, but they'd need training to avoid draining too much of the stuff from themselves. This lore would also allow the existence of MP and its use for the job.

[Edax]

Not gonna happen. Thats why SE decided against it, and made AST instead. We need dem reskinned caster WHM healers...

Sounds pretty definitive, so now would be the time to present your evidence.

[Claire_Pendragon]

Sounds pretty definitive, so now would be the time to present your evidence.

I hate looking up info from old interviews. Hell, i cant even find patch notes from hotfixes from 2.0. 1st patch notes i can find are from 2.1.
so nope, not doing that kinda work for random threads years later. (you're both free to not believe me, and nor should u believe claims. but im not trying to convince u either.) I can only say its in an interview where it said the same thing about why they went DRK instead of SAM for HW tank. GL finding it if u want.

[Mimilu]

I hate looking up info from old interviews.

I can't find which one but I remember Koji saying something about it during one of the 2014-15 Fan Fest Live Letters.
Originally Chemist was going to be a gun-using healer but they were having problems with their mechanics during the preliminary development and scrapped it, splitting it into AST and MCH.
I don't think Chemist is impossible though because I also remember them saying that they played with the idea of SAM being the tank for HW but scrapped it for DRK because they felt SAM didn't fit the expansion thematically (and there was a large group of people who wanted DRK).

[Zanarkand-Ronso]

]) I can only say its in an interview where it said the same thing about why they went DRK instead of SAM for HW tank. GL finding it if u want.

Considering the theme of HW, a Dark Knight works alot better then a Samurai.
Where people fighting for Samurai over dark knight? Yeesh, I hate the idea that Dark Knight could have been a DPS. But I hate just as much that Samurai became a DPS while advertising it as a Tank in their benchmark

[Mimilu]

Where people fighting for Samurai over dark knight? Yeesh, I hate the idea that Dark Knight could have been a DPS. But I hate just as much that Samurai became a DPS while advertising it as a Tank in their benchmark

There was a very small group of people annoyed SAM didn't make it.
There was more people upset that DRK wasn't a DPS. Back when Yoshi-P took over XIV, there was a player-survey that asked what kind of jobs people would like to see and DRK was used as an example for "A DPS job that focuses on enfeebling enemies". Add to DRK's history in past FFs being a damage dealer that sacrifices its own survivability for damage and darkness, people had their hearts set on DPS-DRK and felt betrayed (this is one of the reasons why Yoshi-P doesn't do hypothetical or bounce ideas with fans anymore).

(2) they mentioned a mudra healer like CHM, but "it didnt work out" but yet we got AST, which presses stuff every 30s, rather than every cast.

With AST, their cards are there own thing, separate from their main ways to heal.
I think they still could do a Mix mechanic for Chemist but it can't be its main way to heal (it can still be involved with healing though).

(3) We still dont have a lower GCD healer (or tank) like NIN/MNK. The best we have, is to stack spell speed. (DRK has blood weapon, and that didnt lower it to 2s, and nor was it up full time, just on occasion)

Healers rarely use GCDs to heal as is, so to SE they probably don't need them (what with SE's stance that healers need to at least heal, with DPSing being left to "play-style"). (Not to mention clipping issues)

[Claire_Pendragon]

Where people fighting for Samurai over dark knight?

People speculated and request the SAM parry tank, while some wanted a melee DPS. (Similar to a 2hand sword DPS, one of which yoshida said would have been a DPS build of PLD, to act as a DPS instead of tank. (PLD, named Knight in JP, had the 2hand ability in prior FFs, so thats where this was going originally))
Yoshida planned out a parry tank SAM, and played around with the idea of DRK tank as well. In the end, SAM didnt have enough fancy stuff, to stand out as a tank, but he felt DRK having MP/magic at its disposal, could allow for more options for tanking, rather than just a parry tank (which he didnt want parry to work on magic attacks)
But he also said he didnt want SAM being a melee DPS. (SAMs are just pretty much the eastern equivalent of a Knight, sorta~) Since he feels a cloth/leather using job would be better, and he he feels SAM should be in platmail like prior FFs, so this DPS job should be called "Rounin".

Or at least, thats how i remember the interview going.

With AST, their cards are there own thing, separate from their main ways to heal.
I think they still could do a Mix mechanic for Chemist but it can't be its main way to heal (it can still be involved with healing though).

Agreed, thats why my suggestion was a sort of "stance" that you alternate with oGCDs. (To help justify a shorter "cast" time (mix time) on the job)
But this does leave issues with DPSing. My only idea left, is to do what WHM does, and "repay" the lost GCD with another GCD for dps. (In this case, a sort of "left over" material/mix, from the potion? idk yet) I also think WHMs "straight forward healer, who reacts" playstyle, should be the healer with a 2s GCD. Its not like they do a lot of extra weaving, due to the long cast times, and lack of oGCDs compared to other healers. (technically not the number, but the long CD leaving them w/o oGCDs for far too long)

EDIT: hit post limit for the day, so cant reply till tomorrow.