Glamour Log please. Just want to play the game...

[EaMett]

You've gotten upgrades. Multiple.
If you're not going to wear a majority of the game items I can't see you having inventory issues.

Again I'll take a glamour log if they implement it, but I'm also willing to tell people there's already a solution to the issue.

Always little too late on the upgrades. 400 items for 29 classes + some random armoire stuff. We're talking ~15 items per job. We have more items than that in AF gear alone for battle classes. Forget about raiding gear, crafted gear, your 2B outfits, your mogstation stuff, etc. etc. 3 expansions worth. The list goes on. That alone should be cause for concern.
But if any more needs to be added I would say who says we don't use them for glam? I have 400 items and maybe a whopping 20-30 I haven't used. Yet.
Next to that I have a retainer full of weapons and gear I love that I sometimes use when I build something around them or remember I have them when making a set. And I've thrown so much away because like you said I "didn't use them" (hell, I've thrown items away that I HAVE used, just for convenience). Needless to say I probably would have managed to do something with them had I had a system that worked better.

I'm far from being the only one in this situation. Whether there are enough of us to warrant a change is another matter. But our request certainly isn't misplaced or even unreasonable. There definitely is no "solution" for us currently

[frostmagemari]

You've gotten upgrades. Multiple.
If you're not going to wear a majority of the game items I can't see you having inventory issues.
Again I'll take a glamour log if they implement it, but I'm also willing to tell people there's already a solution to the issue.

So, wouldn't it stand to reason that if there has always been a solution to the issue, then upgrades to the glamour system wouldn't have been needed in the first place? They have given upgrades to the system, because even they admit that the system doesn't work that well; The problem though, is that they refuse to come up with an actual solution to the(any) problem and instead keep adding in bandaid fixes.
They need to come up with an actual solution, and i know one exists because multiple companies have figured out how to do this; and i don't believe that xiv is the only game that can't have a solution to the problem.

[CaptainFishSticks]

XIV feels like a lot of patch-work in how it's been implemented and upgraded over the years. I could be very, very wrong, but I feel like people who enjoy (not just tolerate, but really enjoy) XIV's current glamour systems just haven't experienced games that actually do it well. Hard to know what you're missing out on if you haven't seen it, etc.

For all the issues WoW currently has, the one thing they actually did right was the implementation of the Appearances Collection - an Account-wide log of every piece of equipment you'd collected across all characters. My only problem was just the limitations that forced you to only wear the gear that was appropriate for your class, which meant that a lot of my characters had outfit combinations that they just couldn't wear because Cloth or Leather were not their primary gear types.

I could see something like that working here in FFXIV if it was handled better. My suggestion was also to implement a system where crafting classes could, potentially, "de-class" gear and make them Glamour-only except for (obviously) Relics, Tomestone, and Artifact gear.

[Floortank]

Look, everyone in here saying FFXIV's glamour system needs a rework to be exactly like WOW's:

They're aware of WOW's system. It's not that they don't know how to do it. It's that the servers can't handle that feature.

Yoshi-P is a huge Blizzard stan, plays WOW and is a big fan of Diablo. It's not an absence of reference or an inability to copy a better design. They simply cannot.

You can run WOW on a speak and spell, but PS3 and similar processors are no longer suitable for FFXIV requirements. They are capable of letting players load the entire transmog catalogue in WOW because there isn't much else WOW needs to be able to do.

[frostmagemari]

Look, everyone in here saying FFXIV's glamour system needs a rework to be exactly like WOW's:
They're aware of WOW's system. It's not that they don't know how to do it. It's that the servers can't handle that feature.
Yoshi-P is a huge Blizzard stan, plays WOW and is a big fan of Diablo. It's not an absence of reference or an inability to copy a better design. They simply cannot.
You can run WOW on a speak and spell, but PS3 and similar processors are no longer suitable for FFXIV requirements. They are capable of letting players load the entire transmog catalogue in WOW because there isn't much else WOW needs to be able to do.

How, exactly, do you think the WoW system works? I'm asking honestly. How do YOU think that the World of Warcraft system works, and why their system works so well in comparison to XIV's? And why do you think that method can't work for XIV?
I think it's safe to say you don't actually know anything about how they work their system, or even what WoW's system requirements are; but i want to hear what you think the situation actually is.

[Iscah]

How, exactly, do you think the WoW system works? I'm asking honestly. How do YOU think that the World of Warcraft system works, and why their system works so well in comparison to XIV's? And why do you think that method can't work for XIV?
I think it's safe to say you don't actually know anything about how they work their system, or even what WoW's system requirements are; but i want to hear what you think the situation actually is.

I don't know anything about WoW, but I do know that we've had an insight into how awkwardly the inventory system has been programmed. I know we've been told that a "fishing tackle box" is impossible without taking up inventory slots that could otherwise be used for any type of item. I know (from observation) that the "new" glamour plate system has been designed to sit over the old prism system (already, as I understand it, something added on top of the original glamourless gear system) without altering how it works in any way, and that whether in inventory or the dresser, each gear piece seems to occupy an inflexible piece of space that is difficult to expand, reorganise or collapse into something less complicated.

Even if we want multiples of the same piece in the dresser, they have to be stored as separate items with their own dye information, and I suspect each plate is actually duplicating the item again (as they are not affected if you subsequently dye the base piece or remove it from the dresser entirely).

Everything points to them working with a creaky, impractical core system that they can't easily rebuild, so they're doing the best they can to make it work, even if it still looks "not good enough" compared to better-designed systems.

[frostmagemari]

I don't know anything about WoW, but I do know that we've had an insight into how awkwardly the inventory system has been programmed. I know we've been told that a "fishing tackle box" is impossible without taking up inventory slots that could otherwise be used for any type of item. I know (from observation) that the "new" glamour plate system has been designed to sit over the old prism system (already, as I understand it, something added on top of the original glamourless gear system) without altering how it works in any way, and that whether in inventory or the dresser, each gear piece seems to occupy an inflexible piece of space that is difficult to expand, reorganise or collapse into something less complicated.

Even if we want multiples of the same piece in the dresser, they have to be stored as separate items with their own dye information, and I suspect each plate is actually duplicating the item again (as they are not affected if you subsequently dye the base piece or remove it from the dresser entirely).

Everything points to them working with a creaky, impractical core system that they can't easily rebuild, so they're doing the best they can to make it work, even if it still looks "not good enough" compared to better-designed systems.

And instead of actually going back and recreating a better system, they simply band-aid and compound a currently clunky system that's only future is to break under its own weight or simply become an untenable system for those customers that they attempt to design it for.
You do know that the WoW system didn't start out as something that the game was designed to do, right? The game didn't even launch with the ability to transmog items and wasn't put into the game until midway through cataclysm, and in legion was it further expanded. The system was something that Blizzard had to find a way to make work (it started out as something similar to the prism system, only it was done by an NPC), and they put in the time to get the system working and kept working on it to make it better(the creation of the appearance tab that logged your outfit looks); not just putting on band-aid fixes to put off the eventual collapse of the system another expansion.
Why is this such an unreasonable request of the XIV team? I don't think it is; but it's becoming an increasingly prevalent theme for someone to convey that something is simply "too hard" or "would take time to do" and therefore it shouldn't even be considered to be done.

[Krotoan]

And instead of actually going back and recreating a better system, they simply band-aid and compound a currently clunky system that's only future is to break under its own weight or simply become an untenable system for those customers that they attempt to design it for.
You do know that the WoW system didn't start out as something that the game was designed to do, right? The game didn't even launch with the ability to transmog items and wasn't put into the game until midway through cataclysm, and in legion was it further expanded. The system was something that Blizzard had to find a way to make work (it started out as something similar to the prism system, only it was done by an NPC), and they put in the time to get the system working and kept working on it to make it better(the creation of the appearance tab that logged your outfit looks); not just putting on band-aid fixes to put off the eventual collapse of the system another expansion.
Why is this such an unreasonable request of the XIV team? I don't think it is; but it's becoming an increasingly prevalent theme for someone to convey that something is simply "too hard" or "would take time to do" and therefore it shouldn't even be considered to be done.

Are you and the rest of the playerbase willing to wait and postpone all other content until they finish and implement the new system? Considering how core and interconnected inventory and glamour seem to be pretty much everything else will need to be stopped/scrapped until the new system is done and running or at least finalized.

This is likely what the biggest block to "going back and recreating a better system" is. They don't and wont have increased resources, their parent company has shown very often they have a set amount they want to invest in the FFXIV devs, so since they are limited they will need to divert all resources capable to the project, and there's no point in implementing anything new till its finished since all items will have to be compliant and compatible with the new system.



I agree the only true fix is a rework from the ground up, but I don't see the company doing that as they would lose so many subscribers until it was finished and even then it's harder to win people back than to just keep them hooked with small fixes.

[EaMett]

Are you and the rest of the playerbase willing to wait and postpone all other content until they finish and implement the new system? Considering how core and interconnected inventory and glamour seem to be pretty much everything else will need to be stopped/scrapped until the new system is done and running or at least finalized.

This is likely what the biggest block to "going back and recreating a better system" is. They don't and wont have increased resources, their parent company has shown very often they have a set amount they want to invest in the FFXIV devs, so since they are limited they will need to divert all resources capable to the project, and there's no point in implementing anything new till its finished since all items will have to be compliant and compatible with the new system.



I agree the only true fix is a rework from the ground up, but I don't see the company doing that as they would lose so many subscribers until it was finished and even then it's harder to win people back than to just keep them hooked with small fixes.

I mean.... They could just patch fix this one up too. All they would need would be to clean item instancing up and they could have an easier solution to this problem by just creating instances with default data (dye, etc.) for the plates. I suspect the code is actually already there tbh since they probably already create new instances for the plates. I suspect the glamour dresser works the way it does so it isn't destructive of your gear which a log system might very well be.

[Krotoan]

I mean.... They could just patch fix this one up too. All they would need would be to clean item instancing up and they could have an easier solution to this problem by just creating instances with default data (dye, etc.) for the plates. I suspect the code is actually already there tbh since they probably already create new instances for the plates. I suspect the glamour dresser works the way it does so it isn't destructive of your gear which a log system might very well be.

I have a feeling (since I don't actually work on the team) , that pretty much every one of the problems we have is because of how our system constantly has to verify our entire inventory every couple of seconds (something the devs have actually mentioned) . This would likely have to change. Unless they wanted to layer an entirely new system on top of the archaic one they have for item referencing.. which would probably create more problems.
"just patch fix"-ing is what got us here. Layer upon layer of jury-rigged solutions on top of a severely limited system.