The only thing I miss about WoW when playing FFXIV: Scrub's rights.

[Omedon]

A lot of terms I'm going to use in this post are very general, perhaps even hyperbolic, and not to be overthought. This is mostly a thought experiment that I find fascinating as I consider the differences between the two MMOs playing tug of war for my time these past few months, and I thought I'd write it all down and open it for discussion.

I'm 2 months into my return into FFXIV after returning to the game for the first time since about two months into the launch of ARR, and FFXIV is just about the perfect MMO, indeed the perfect game where I'm sitting right now. It's an MMO that actually lets the player own their time and live in the world. I have very few bad things to say about FFXIV, and it feels like home almost if not as much as WoW does now.

There's only one question I have found myself asking at a couple points in the main thoroughfare of the MSQ: "Man... what if I was just... bad? I'd be screwed here!"

The most recent thing to bring this question front and center has been the role quest finale. I main DRK so I got the tank version. Personal skill tests as side content I have no problem with. When WoW threw in the mage tower in Legion (personal skill test to unlock weapon appearances) I was totally ok with it being there because it was optional difficulty where optional difficulty belongs: off to the side. I don't play MMOs "to be challenged," so I didn't do it, simple.

But those role quests, even "Using the power of Very Easy" were rough. It took me half a dozen attempts to get by because the NPC (a fellow tank) kept dying, and while I did nail it the first run I started using blackest night on him, it was really, REALLY close.

And this is a mandatory step to get through the story, the culmination of 2 months of binge watching the MSQ potentially stopping me dead at the final act. That's... that's almost inexcusable.

Crazy story mandatory dungeons or trials (the final fight of Stormblood's post-game and the bollywood fight in stormblood come to mind), you can just keep fishing for a carry group if you must, but this, this straight looking past my stats to my reflexes and asking "Are you the player good enough to see the end of the story," that's just insane to me! And don't get me started on duties where you're not playing the class you signed up for, and them actually daring to be "hard!"

My point is, it's jarring to me to come from one game that will generally give a properly respectful path of least resistance to the "I play to chill" player (what one might call "a casual scrub" *raises hand*) to see the story and unlock features (which the MSQ does also gate), to a game that literally has skill testing trials to ask "are you, the player, good enough to get through the story?" There's a very scandalized part of my mind that thinks "did you withdraw my sub fee? Then yes I am!"

Continued next post...

[Omedon]

Again, much of this is hyperbolically stated, but it almost feels like as nice as the community is (and you are extremely nice when compared to other games) the game itself is... kind of elitist in deciding who gets to see the next episode of the story. Now, maybe this is intentional as a way to make sure we aren't "bad on each other's time," it's kind of a filter for late game roulettes I guess (which WoW has done before... and canned soon after), but I mean... it feels kinda weird, maybe even icky.

But... I made it through the filter so it's all ok, right?

Thank you for reading, I'm interested in any thoughts along this line. Do you think FFXIV is "fair" to its potentially less... performance-minded players?

[Lastelli]

Role quests require nothing more than: a) basic level of competency and knowledge of battle/job mechanics and b) adequate gear.

If you struggled so much then you lacked one or both of those.

[Omedon]

Role quests require nothing more than: a) basic level of competency and knowledge of battle/job mechanics and b) adequate gear.

If you struggled so much then you lacked one or both of those.

Ok *mostly* nicer than the WoW community. I stand corrected!

[Enla]

Not really honestly? All those role quests ask of you is to have some knowledge of your toolkit and some situational awareness. Most of these are 60-80 so it's to be expected that the game would think you'd know to heal your NPC companion if an ability existed on your bar to do so. Hell even the fight that did give me trouble awhile back - 'Zenos' right before Shadowbringers dropped only gave me trouble till I realized I had gimped my DPS output on SCH by ignoring Energy Drain. Once I realized that it was fairly simple.

And then there's the Trusts where the game basically decided to give us all a free, easy way to level through the MSQ and relearn our toolkits in a fairly low punishment way - especially as Healer because Thancred literally is so broken he has to try and actively die to even have a chance at kicking the bucket. Really, the game is /very/ kind to people who aren't performance minded and it's one of the things I love about it. But there's a difference between not being performance minded and just mindlessly spamming your buttons, and that is somewhat punished at this stage of the game.

[Lastelli]

Ok *mostly* nicer than the WoW community. I stand corrected!

I'm just preparing you for what's coming with other comments. Those quest are SE's way to tell you "dude, if you can't do this, I'm afraid I can't let you play with other people in end game content". And it really isn't a high requirement because those quests are quite trivial. If you struggle, that's a sign you need to change something in your playstile if you want to engage in end game content. If not, the game offers many other ways to have fun and I suggest you stick to those.

[Asalia]

Ok *mostly* nicer than the WoW community. I stand corrected!

I'm sorry in advance then,
I did like a great many number of player all the role quest, yet i'm a heal main, i didn't feel the slightest difficulty except for the tank one wich is easily explained by the awfull gear i had at the time.
If you know the basics of your role, and of this game's mechanics, each and everyone of those fight were really easy.
I mean it that's the basic of the basic stuff... you're gonna have a VERY bad time in any 80 dungeon / Trial if you consider this already too hard.
(I'm not even talking about Ex / Savage / Ultimate ^^""""""")

[Omedon]

Just to reiterate here: I did indeed clear my role questline and the dungeon and trial that the MSQ put in front of me shortly after (trusts are amazing and are literally my condition to remain engaged with the game going forward), and the point of this conversation is more about the hypothetical, reasonably skilled player that could potentially find the role quests or other skill testing duties a step too far in their placement in the main thoroughfare of the game.

As I’ve stated, optional difficulty placed off to the side in your raids and your difficulties above normal are totally fair to me. Where I kinda did a slow head turn was at the core story “daring to test me.”

Again, I cleared it, but on the other side of it all I kinda had a very “take it easy, you’re just the story and the base access product” kinda feel.

[Asalia]

Then i disagree totally with you on the way to approach this type of game ^^
In my personal opinion, this is still a MMO, Story driven, but a mmo.
You have to play with other player, the game want you too and was made for it. you don't get access to trust before 71, squadron is still wonky all of those alternative are mainly here to "test the waters" or practise a bit, but at the end of the day you're supposed to play with other people.
Given the fact that the story is the main focus of this mmo, i feel like the story should test me, it should get harder and harder and force me to dive into my class to give me the feeling of wanting to master it. Heck i'm supposed to be the Warrior of Light
The game should tell me : " You don't deserve to see the rest of the story if you do not invest a bit in the mechanics " I'm not watching a movie after all, i'm playing a Mmo.
Again that's just the approach i have, which seem to be in contradiction with yours (Hoping this does not come as agressive, my english is way more rusty than i thought >.<)

[Mavrias]

Just to reiterate here: I did indeed clear my role questline and the dungeon and trial that the MSQ put in front of me shortly after (trusts are amazing and are literally my condition to remain engaged with the game going forward), and the point of this conversation is more about the hypothetical, reasonably skilled player that could potentially find the role quests or other skill testing duties a step too far in their placement in the main thoroughfare of the game.

As I’ve stated, optional difficulty placed off to the side in your raids and your difficulties above normal are totally fair to me. Where I kinda did a slow head turn was at the core story “daring to test me.”

Again, I cleared it, but on the other side of it all I kinda had a very “take it easy, you’re just the story and the base access product” kinda feel.

I mean this is a video game not an interactive movie. "Daring to test you" is standard video game stuff. Can't beat Bowser at the end of World 1? Then no World 2 for you. Can't beat the first Griffin in Witcher 3? Can't progress the story til you can. Et cetera.