5.2 Info thread

[DynnDiablos]

Personally, I don't mind the crackdown on erotic/porn mods as it has gotten way out of hand. No markers in fights is interesting, but I get where they're coming from with people using outside tools. Did anyone feel like the first hour we were being scolded and placed on time out?

[Vahlnir]

Did anyone feel like the first hour we were being scolded and placed on time out?

From what I've read from a few translations? Yeah, basically. I think my only bone to pick with all of that was this bit...

"If you call out someone for low DPS, the problem isn't even just using a 3rd party tool, its harassment"

I'm not entirely sure what he means by that, especially since he mentioned parsers right before this, but I know how it sounds to me. Does that mean that we can't call anyone out ever, even constructively? If so that's...kinda bull. I've never used a parser, but we don't need parsers to be able to tell when someone is underperforming. At the end of the day though I am glad that they have finally drawn their line in the sand on the matter of mods and 3rd party tools like parsers.

[Holymoly]

"If you call out someone for low DPS, the problem isn't even just using a 3rd party tool, its harassment"

Personally I never thought of parsers I used in other games I played as an harrassment tool, but rather a means by which to assist our guild/FC to improve. I also don't understand how it is seen as providing an unfair advantage rather it helps the individual improve their effectiveness. We live in strange times when self improvement is seen as "cheating".

[Iscah]

Any news on when/how they are going to implement the streamlined MSQ?

They've previously stated the streamlined ARR MSQ (and thus New Game Plus access to ARR) will be in patch 5.3.

"If you call out someone for low DPS, the problem isn't even just using a 3rd party tool, its harassment"

I'm not entirely sure what he means by that, especially since he mentioned parsers right before this, but I know how it sounds to me. Does that mean that we can't call anyone out ever, even constructively?

I'm pretty sure this is directly addressing the fuss over that livestreamer harassing someone over their poor DPS. At the time people were saying the streamer had been punished for using a parser despite this being unofficially okay in the past, so (they said) it was unfair and inconsistent to target him - when actually the harassment would have been the issue.

So they're pointing that out (without actually mentioning the event, perhaps) and emphasising that it's a harassment issue and not that parsers themselves are punishable.

[Lium]

I also don't understand how it is seen as providing an unfair advantage rather it helps the individual improve their effectiveness. We live in strange times when self improvement is seen as "cheating".

From what I understand, the unfair advantage has more to do with the PC and console stratification. Are these add-ons also available for the PS4? If add-ons are allowed, that effectively relegates console players to a lower tier, so to speak. PC gamers would be the only ones allowed to raid (in an FC or static) because certain add-ons would be required. And those add-ons would not be available on console. This provides a gameplay benefit that not everyone has access to.

Now, I have no idea if any of that is true. I read that on MassivelyOP. But at face value that sounds like a fair point.

[Liam_Harper]

At the end of the day though I am glad that they have finally drawn their line in the sand on the matter of mods and 3rd party tools like parsers.

Regarding parsers, have they?

It's still a grey area, so basically they'll turn away and ignore it as long as you don't harass anyone for dps. We all know a lot of PC players use and will continue to use them, which means newer and console players are at a disadvantage. The "toxicity" will exist in that players are silently kicked for low dps and won't know why, instead of called out.

If they really firmly believe parsers are toxic and will never add them, why haven't they taken the firm stance and blocked all third party programs communicating with the client?

[ForteNightshade]

Regarding parsers, have they?

It's still a grey area, so basically they'll turn away and ignore it as long as you don't harass anyone for dps. We all know a lot of PC players use and will continue to use them, which means newer and console players are at a disadvantage. The "toxicity" will exist in that players are silently kicked for low dps and won't know why, instead of called out.

If they really firmly believe parsers are toxic and will never add them, why haven't they taken the firm stance and blocked all third party programs communicating with the client?

Because they know their raid scene dies the moment they block ACT. Without it, no one has any reason to even look at Savage beyond getting a couple kills just to say you did it unless you're doing Ultimate. It'd also make Ultimate itself extremely difficult not because of the mechanics but you'd have no way to determine why you aren't meeting DPS checks in a fight—at least when it's relevant—where you absolutely need that information.

[Liam_Harper]

Because they know their raid scene dies the moment they block ACT. Without it, no one has any reason to even look at Savage beyond getting a couple kills just to say you did it unless you're doing Ultimate. It'd also make Ultimate itself extremely difficult not because of the mechanics but you'd have no way to determine why you aren't meeting DPS checks in a fight—at least when it's relevant—where you absolutely need that information.

Exactly.

They know it, we know it, yet they continue to pretend it's evil and no one parses and the game is all rainbows and sunshine. Meanwhile low dps players are kicked with zero input, the raiders have to work with clunky third party tools that the devs have little input on, ps4 players are excluded entirely and you have to sneak around like a naughty child pretending you don't use it just to maintain this illusion. If abuse over dps is harassment, you can enforce that rule even with parsers. They're in denial and have their fingers in their ears. It's frustrating. They won't even consider a parser strictly limited to EX content upwards or adding one to SSS.

It'd be interesting to see what would happen if thousands of raiders came together at once and openly posted to Enix "I parse in savage, ban me, I dare you".

[ForteNightshade]

I think your overreacting a bit. Most people who raid only use act most of them don't depend on stuff like the trigger call outs and the marker placer one is really like the lowest priority one. Since most of the time someone just places markers normally anyway xD or we all have different marker setups. I feel like this was just cause of the twitch incident where a streamer got banned for targeting x player with harassment on stream.

It isn't Arthars that prompted this but the World First group. People noticed the marker placement program, which became increasingly prevalent on streams. I think it's a bit silly how they're reacting to it since most used that program for convenience sake. It's annoying to have readjust markers constantly. Ironically, they made their own version of it.

Exactly.

They know it, we know it, yet they continue to pretend it's evil and no one parses and the game is all rainbows and sunshine. Meanwhile low dps players are kicked with zero input, the raiders have to work with clunky third party tools that the devs have little input on, ps4 players are excluded entirely and you have to sneak around like a naughty child pretending you don't use it just to maintain this illusion. If abuse over dps is harassment, you can enforce that rule even with parsers. They're in denial and have their fingers in their ears. It's frustrating. They won't even consider a parser strictly limited to EX content upwards or adding one to SSS.

It'd be interesting to see what would happen if thousands of raiders came together at once and openly posted to Enix "I parse in savage, ban me, I dare you".

We essentially do. Raiders watch streams of Savage and Ultimate where ACT is prominently displayed. It's actively talked about on reddit and even on the forums themselves.

Their stance is silly but not unsurprising. They want to ensure a hugbox where no one feels bad, which is ironic considering as you put, people will simply kick without saying a word. I suppose the logic their is the person can easily dismiss said kick as not their fault. My own theory is they don't want to deal with having to actually police players who will legitimately harass people. So it's easier to let it stay a third party tool they can blanket ban you on. Less work on their end.

[DynnDiablos]

Exactly.

They know it, we know it, yet they continue to pretend it's evil and no one parses and the game is all rainbows and sunshine. Meanwhile low dps players are kicked with zero input, the raiders have to work with clunky third party tools that the devs have little input on, ps4 players are excluded entirely and you have to sneak around like a naughty child pretending you don't use it just to maintain this illusion. If abuse over dps is harassment, you can enforce that rule even with parsers. They're in denial and have their fingers in their ears. It's frustrating. They won't even consider a parser strictly limited to EX content upwards or adding one to SSS.

It'd be interesting to see what would happen if thousands of raiders came together at once and openly posted to Enix "I parse in savage, ban me, I dare you".

Why would I pretend I don't play on PS4? I am very open about it, and I play just fine. I've never been abused for it either. I prefer to play this game on my gorgeous 60 inch 4K display, not hunched over a computer.