Viera can't use the new Modern Aesthetics - Modern Legend

[Rolder50]

Yeah it's really starting to feel like their... questionable choice (to put it lightly) to lock Hrothgar hair to their head might be what's holding Viera back. It's the only thing I can think of unless there's some technical problem with the ears they haven't told us about.

This whole thing reeks of lack of forethought and poor planning at this point. I wanna be wrong, but seriously. Why would they ever think people would be okay playing unfinished races that can't access a whole bunch of cosmetic content, some of which literally costs real live cash, indefinitely?

It's just a shame really. Probably my biggest complaint about this whole expansion so far, because I've loved or at least liked just about everything else I've done.

It's especially amusing when you consider the fact that there's an unofficial game mod that turns another hairstyle into the new one. Doesn't have any issues that I know of.

[LaylaTsarra]

It's especially amusing when you consider the fact that there's an unofficial game mod that turns another hairstyle into the new one. Doesn't have any issues that I know of.

Plenty of issues with mods. They furthermore don't have to actually interact with the game environment since they are hosted locally on user workstations. Hairstyles sure don't work with all head items and many gear mods don't work with long gloves, long boots and so on.

Devs have to be sure that what they release works and doesn't crash the client and they have lots of testing to do to be sure it does

[reivaxe]

From E3 Famitsu interview with Yoshida (you can find full version on reddit):
"Since Hrothgar have hairstyles tied to their character creation options rather than being separately selectable, you will not be able to apply unlockable hairstyles, but they might implement more face types after 5.0. As for Viera, there's some legacy haristyles they'll able to eventually implement, but not all of them. Some of unlockable hairstyles should be supported, others may not be."
So... Where? I want to use my Minfilia hairstyle again. I bought her outfit only for the hairstyle.

We can only really go off the latest information and sometime after that Yoshi said that Viera and Hrothgar would be getting unique hairs and not shared hairs.

"Q37:
I used fantasia to change to Viera and I'm enjoying it. As they're a special race and it may not be possible, but feel like the number of hairstyles available for Viera and Hrothgar is quite limited. Do you have plans to add more in the future?

A37:
Of course we plan on adding more, so please wait for future patches. However it will still be race-specific, so there won’t be as many selections when compared to other races."

Going by the fact that this new hair style doesn't have any traits that stand out as too disruptive for the Viera ears and legit looks like a waaaaay better version of the short Viera hair then, until proven otherwise, I think it would be in the best interest to assume the latest stance (Unique Hair, no shared hair) is the path they're taking now. Perhaps when they do release hair I will be proven wrong and they will be given some newer shared hairs, who knows.

There is really no excuse at all.
The viera head is less problematic than aura, just put the new hairstyle onto their head and not look about hairstyle clipping a little into the ears, thats it...

Aura horns come out at the same spot as other race's ears and give the head a comfy amount of room to lay hair on ... they are no harder to work with than elezen.

Yeah it's really starting to feel like their... questionable choice (to put it lightly) to lock Hrothgar hair to their head might be what's holding Viera back..

That's a very poor way of thinking about it.

What's "holding them back" is that the devs decided to stay true to what Viera are instead of taking the kitty head system and blowing up the ears.
Believe it or not but having ears come out of the TOP of a head is not something most styles were designed to work around over the years. Many would require a full redesign to look right on Viera and the devs may think "why bend over backwards to make some old hairs work when we can just make cool new hairs that are only for them and reinforce this unique head aesthetic?".

I mean, I clearly remember Viera going "I don't mind, wE gOt thE bESt haIrs iN ThE GaAaME! HuHuHu!" after the expac dropped. Seems like the release of a good looking new hair as stared the pot again.

The nature of their release it likely does mean that content for Viera and Hrothgar is very likely tied together as ... by all means they are seen as 1 race worth of work. I don't really think that's at the detriment to either of them. I don't expect Hrothgar to get 1-2-3 hairs when ever they add them cause given their head system they likely are not gonna give any heads more hairs than the other heads so until we see what happens I personally expect a decent amount of new hairs for viera and Hrothgar when ever they come.

[SturmChurro]

the devs may think "why bend over backwards to make some old hairs work when we can just make cool new hairs that are only for them and reinforce this unique head aesthetic?".

Because they are literally selling hairstyles in the mogstation, on top of various iconic styles being rewards for events, or other content in the game. While viera/hrothgar continue to have no support for any newly introduced styles with their already (extremely) limited selection.

[reivaxe]

Because they are literally selling hairstyles in the mogstation, on top of various iconic styles being rewards for events, or other content in the game. While viera/hrothgar continue to have no support for any newly introduced styles with their already (extremely) limited selection.

I have long felt that Viera and Hrothgar SHOULD get reward and mog hairs and head gear as these are things people earn with rl effort through contest or rl money.

But they may see it as a slippery slop. As it stands the head gear restraints for them are mostly easily defined and easy to see/ follow. No one's wondering why they can wear this but not that for the most part. But hair is a different beast. They may think Viera players would look at one shared hair working on them and think "Why can't XYZ and 123 work?!?!" Same for Hrothgar. I've seen many people praise the Form and Function mod for Viera bobbed around ... but it doesn't look good or right from a design POV, it looks straight up BAD and stupid really. For the devs to make that look "right/ good" on them they would basically have to redesign the very foundation/ concept of the hair style and at that point why not just make a new one that works just for them?

So it seems they made the design decision to keep these heads unique. They will never be able to freely wear the head gear like others, if they are to only get unique hairs then they will never have as many as other races. But what hairs the Viera and Hrothgar get will be fully unique to them and if they add enough then they will have the largest selection of racial hairs that also benefit from the new bars set for hair quality (Viera at least. Hrothgar have fairly simple hair that doesn't get highlights or much detail as to keep it beast like. But they are supposed to get new faces so there's that).

Not saying anyone's wrong for wanted w/e but I also don't think the devs are wrong for sticking to the idea of these being unique head races. People are not gonna look at it from a design PoV when the flood gates are opened by even ONE shared hair making it's way to Viera and Hrothgar, they are gonna demand and expect every one to work at some point and not think about how stupid this looks.

[Avidria]

snip

What I mean by holding them back is that it seems like the fact that Hrothgar hair is tied to their face aka they can only change hair via Fantasia is a harder problem to solve than fixing Viera hair, and since it also seems like they're packaged as *effectively* one race, they won't add hair/hats to Viera that they can't also add to Hrothgar.

It shouldn't take bending over backwards to provide access to the same basic cosmetic content as literally every other race in the game, and if it does then I'll repeat what I said - that smells a lot like poor planning.

I was not one of those who was happy with the limitations at launch. I was disappointed that I wouldn't have access to the stuff I spent a lot of time - and again, in some cases actual real life cash - to get, but I was hopeful because they'd said they would be working to add more for both races in the future.

I'm just disappointed that we haven't heard anything new in a while, and I actually like the new hairstyle so I'm right back to being disappointed that I can't use it. That's all this whole Hrothgar/Viera situation really is. It's disappointing.

[Aelissa]

We can only really go off the latest information and sometime after that Yoshi said that Viera and Hrothgar would be getting unique hairs and not shared hairs.

A producer of a game of this level should be responsible for his words. Otherwise it becomes like a flueger.

Seems like the release of a good looking new hair as stared the pot again.

It's a question of taste. This new hairstyle reminds me of a mad hedgehog. I don't care about it and i'll never use it on any of my characters. But it's just another reminder of how limited our hairstyle options.

[reivaxe]

What I mean by holding them back is that it seems like the fact that Hrothgar hair is tied to their face aka they can only change hair via Fantasia is a harder problem to solve than fixing Viera hair...

What?
There is nothing inherent about Hrothgar that says this had to be the way they worked. It was their choice to do that with Hrothgar's hair and heads. So no, I don't think the devs see having to buy a potion for mane changing as a "problem" they couldn't solve so much as a Character Customization Feature they gave em seeing as Yoshi said he told the team not to worry about fitting hair styles to Hrothgar ... that they were gonna do this wholly unique beast headed race thing. I'd say they see it as as much of a "problem" as picking your character's tail shape. I personally think it's a huge oversight but I don't think they see it that way at all.

The ears of a true Viera (As in, not some cat/ bunny hybrid they played around with in concept art that had ears closer to the position of cat gals. ) cause a lot of problems for most shared hair styles that I don't think you fully care to grasp even though I posted a clear example of it so ehhh, you do you. I mean, even when he did say they were gonna do it he said they would only be able to give Viera SOME (because only some are in the realm of logically being able to work with them from a design stand point. IMO they later decided they're better off making cool n new Viera only hair then picking some out dated years old hair styles to give them as they're making new Hrothgar heads and manes which is why they said the above answer I posted)

They decided to make these races unique in this way. It was a design choice. They could have decided to give em both miqo'te ear placement and give Hrothgar more human faces and leave it at that so that they could just make everything work without these limits but they didn't. What they did do makes it incredibly hard to make most hair styles and head gear in the game work on either of them. So as things are now I can see why giving each race only unique hair going forward would seem like the best path.

And my point was and still is that as it stands neither of these races can be seen as a detriment to the other's case yet regardless of their intrinsic connection. They're in this boat because BOTH have design choices that greatly limit what can be done in regards to shared hair styles and head gear. Sure, buns shouldn't have as much of a prob getting glasses to work as Hrothgar ... but looking at the hoods both can wear clearly shows that Hrothgar have fewer problems with that type of head gear. So it's not really productive to try to connect the dots, just accepting that they made these choices seems like a good idea.

A producer of a game of this level should be responsible for his words. Otherwise it becomes like a flueger.

... What?
I'm pointing out that recent statements hold more weight than older ones cause logically as time goes by developments behind the scenes wont be shared with us in real time. As in, as it stands this is the most recent stance we've seen taken on the topic.
If you want to believe he still intends to make shared hairs work then feel free to take that stance, idgaf. Either it is or it isn't, just saying that given this hair doesn't work when it's one of the times I COULD see a hair working for them I'm lead to believe the most recent statement should is a sign of whats to come (As in, Unique only hair).

It's a question of taste. This new hairstyle reminds me of a mad hedgehog. I don't care about it and i'll never use it on any of my characters. But it's just another reminder of how limited our hairstyle options.

Not really what I'm talking about.

I have been kicking my heels up and reading these threads for the lulz, there are a stupid amount of threads whining about this hair styles where as before there weren't. Seems like a number of people who don't care to post on the OF have taken to the forums to talk about THIS hair. So yeah, this new hair style stirred the pot.

You don't have to like it, not saying you do. I've seen a number of topics started by people who do though.

[Aelissa]

... What?
I'm pointing out that recent statements hold more weight than older ones cause logically as time goes by developments behind the scenes wont be shared with us in real time.

So you think it's okay if they'll change their statements every month?

So yeah, this new hair style stirred the pot.

No, it's not. It's just the first released hairstyle after 5.0. It doesn't matter what kind of hairstyle that is. What matters is the fact that it is not available.

[Yencat]

I'm personally not crazy about this particular hairstyle, though I'm sure there's plenty of people that genuinely like it and want to use it, but it is the second hairstyle added this expansion that doesn't work so it's possible it's just the catalyst the kicks off the discussion again. I know it is for me, anyway. We're nearing 5 months into the expansion and we haven't heard any updates on the situation.

They've been pretty consistent about their stance on the Hrothgar hair/face situation so there's not much more to be said about that other than hopefully they can go back and revise that stance, because having to Fantasia to change your hairstyle is wild to me. But I don't play Hrothgar so I can't speak for what they want.

As for the conflicting statements about Viera's hairstyles it could be anything from having actually changed their view on it so that we won't get Modern Aesthetics at all anymore and we get fully unique ones, or maybe we'll get some of the ones they can make work and unique styles for the ones that don't work. It could even be a misinterpretation/translation situation like when people asked about cross-job glamours and he answered he doesn't want Black Mages running around with an axe, when that wasn't really what was asked for.

Now I'm not frothing at the mouth-angry about this whole thing, but it would go a long way if they could make a statement and clarified exactly what the current thinking and stance on this is. Either outcome is fine (for me) at this point as long as we know what is or isn't coming (and before 6.0 preferably) but then at least we'd know for sure and people can decide whether or not they want to wait it out or go back to their previous races and have access to the full catalogue again.