Can we please put Coils of Bahamut in normal raid roulette?

[Havenchild]

It's only Second Coil that was severely nerfed (sans T9) because people back when complained that it was too hard (T7 was a wall for people because things like this could happen). The nerfs in Final Coil only applied to the trash mobs outside of the boss arenas.

All of that said, one (or more) specific mechanic of Coil fights can make or break a random DF group. T7 could have Melusine hitting like a truck (with instant kill Flaming Circles) because people didn't pay attention to their Cursed Voice/Shrieks. T8 could cause wipes because no one was handling the towers, OT didn't stand in the boss to prevent it from turning when it confuses the MT, no one stacked the right amount for Ballistic Missile (if you've run ARF, you'll notice that most DF randos never stack right and always run away with/from Gaseous Bomb), or Allagan Field in general.

Alot of these mentions are not one shots or even two shots anymore. Post nerfs and overgearing, you can consistently "fail" these mechanics mentioned and NOT outright wipe.

It takes a literal effort to fail MULTIPLE mechanics in a row to wipe. Even DF is capable to execute one or two mechanics consistent enough. Anyone saying otherwise is outright lying to themselves.

[HyoMinPark]

The fact that you disagree, is interesting. All of the fights you mentioned have higher clear rates on DF then disbands, sans maybe at the time Orbonne Monastery, the most difficult mechanically 24 man ever introduced and that only got echo, no mechanic or HP nerfs.

I disagree that Coil would be nice and easy in Duty Finder because I know how bad Duty Finder can be with simple fights, not because I personally find the content hard (though, I do love how you keep insisting I think it’s hard). I’m not disillusioned enough to think that players wouldn’t struggle with the harder floors. And when I have runs like my Copied Factory last night, where there was a total of over 130 raises across all 3 alliances with only 7 new people, I feel like my opinion is relatively justified. My first clear of Copied didn’t have half that number of raises with everyone being new. I raised a BLM in my alliance 15 times. No, they were not new to the raid.

There would be no reason to put them in there when people would just do to them what they do to Alliance raids that aren’t LotA or ST: leave and take the 30-minute penalty because the penalty is shorter than attempting to clear with random players who don’t want to pay attention. I’m not one to leave content, and I actually have quite a bit of patience with people; but I likely wouldn’t waste my time trying to teach T9 to people who refused to listen to me. It’s frustrating enough when you get EXs in Mentor Roulette and people won’t listen.

Unless SE decide to nerf all of Coil to the point where Alte Roite Savage is harder, I cannot see DF roulette randos staying after one wipe (people still leave after one wipe in Chrysalis).

That would certainly have to be quite the nerf. Because Alte Roite doesn’t even qualify as Savage content.

[Nestama]

Alot of these mentions are not one shots or even two shots anymore. Post nerfs and overgearing, you can consistently "fail" these mechanics mentioned and NOT outright wipe.

It takes a literal effort to fail MULTIPLE mechanics in a row to wipe. Even DF is capable to execute one or two mechanics consistent enough. Anyone saying otherwise is outright lying to themselves.

And which ones are those? Melusine gains a damage up buff every time she's yelled at (Cursed Voice not being aimed out of the arena/Renauds and Shriek not being blocked. Also Melusine looking at Petrifaction cast by Prosector), so I can foresee her one shotting people with Flame Circle (or nearly killing them and making healers panic) or the tank with her tank buster (that doesn't have a cast). T8's Ballistic Missile still needs to be handled correctly as far as I know and if no one handles the confused tank correctly (or the OT doesn't tank swap), then the boss is gonna turn and cleave the group with Bleed. Allagan Field is going to wipe groups if no one protects them.

If people still wipe to Chrysalis in roulette, then wipes are guaranteed in a roulette involving Coil. People will quit these faster than they do Orbonne... or Shinryu when it was 3.0.

[Bacent]

I would never touch the roulette again if these were added to it. Some of the fights are easy, yeah, but a lot of people don't want to waste time teaching new people (We all know this is true) and some of those fights were literal hell to do when it was current.

I'm game for teaching people older fights. But only when I'm in the mood for something as stressful as Coil. The current 8 man raid roulette is good the way it is. If you want to do coil, make a PF for it.

[Havenchild]

And which ones are those? Melusine gains a damage up buff every time she's yelled at (Cursed Voice not being aimed out of the arena/Renauds and Shriek not being blocked. Also Melusine looking at Petrifaction cast by Prosector), so I can foresee her one shotting people with Flame Circle (or nearly killing them and making healers panic) or the tank with her tank buster (that doesn't have a cast). T8's Ballistic Missile still needs to be handled correctly as far as I know and if no one handles the confused tank correctly (or the OT doesn't tank swap), then the boss is gonna turn and cleave the group with Bleed. Allagan Field is going to wipe groups if no one protects them.

If people still wipe to Chrysalis in roulette, then wipes are guaranteed in a roulette involving Coil. People will quit these faster than they do Orbonne... or Shinryu when it was 3.0.

Before actually assuming these mechanics are that deadly, understand that these weren't outright wipe offenses pre 3.0. It is either a collective effort of failed mechanics, or failure of a single specific mechanic (of the few that can even wipe a party) that is. Hop into these instances right now and you will down these fights ignoring almost every mechanic you mentioned. The fights progress too fast for it to be any outright life threatening thing. Hell, you can kill the boss before Allagan Field goes off depending on DPS.

[AngeliouxRein]

I would love to see Coil in roulette! Such a great story locked behind it but the only way to do is to be zerged through it. It kills the whole experience D:

[Hasrat]

I'd also like to add that I'm honestly not too keen on the idea of nerfing the rest of the fights into the ground to make them casual content, either. Mostly because it's massively entertaining to jump into an unsync run and watch the level-cap players naively trying to faceroll, while I, much lower level, execute mechanics and understand why we're wiping time and again. I find it endlessly hilarious when overgeared overleveled players get put in their place by some ancient mechanics that are still 100% required. (pretty sure this only applies to T9 at this point, maybe T11?)

[Nestama]

Before actually assuming these mechanics are that deadly, understand that these weren't outright wipe offenses pre 3.0. It is either a collective effort of failed mechanics, or failure of a single specific mechanic (of the few that can even wipe a party) that is. Hop into these instances right now and you will down these fights ignoring almost every mechanic you mentioned. The fights progress too fast for it to be any outright life threatening thing. Hell, you can kill the boss before Allagan Field goes off depending on DPS.

I'm assuming they're deadly based on what I expect in Duty Finder and my expectations are always low in that regard (because the bad experiences I've had outweigh the quick and easy runs I've had). I will always expect the OT to either never grab the add, or be too late to. I am always going to expect the tank and melee DPS to be petrified because they're getting hit by Cursed Voice. I expect everyone to be petrified every so often by Cursed Shriek (and if at a bad time, the melee DPS might die to the AoE). I expect one or more DPS to ignore the adds. I expect the ranged DPS to be stacked on top of each other and the healers at some point (and depending on how many damage up stacks Melusine has, the wombo combo will kill them). The mechanics do hurt when ignored and can be outright deadly depending on the group you get in Duty Finder. Certain fights nigh impossible ( especially T9, T11 and T13. Maybe even T12 because of black, blue and red fire and Flames of Unforgiveness, etc).

[Crushnight]

They WERE the savage equivalent of their time but with the massive nerfs that were done across the board (least HP nerfs) they were not bad anymore.

Cool lets also add Gordias savage as well since it qualifies all those conditions too, love to see how random df groups handle Nisi, Royal Pentacle, Digititus and hand of pain sync'd XD

[RyuSaarva]

I would love to see Coil in roulette! Such a great story locked behind it but the only way to do is to be zerged through it. It kills the whole experience D:

you still zerg through it synced, you need to do it with minimum item level + remove all accessories.