MMORPGs How they have changed for the better? or worse?

[Alexandre_Noireau]

Which doesn't actually mean much if you have any idea how dopamine works and what role it plays in the brain.

Is exactly because how dopamine works that is such the effect.

I am going to have to disagree with this from my personal experience.

My guild back in the early days of ffxi pulled me out of a horrid depression. I was nearing the point of just giving up completely. It gave me a community of people to talk to, people hang out with on a daily basis. The guild gave me structure to focus my thoughts on. And when I became an office it gave me a feeling of purpose again. That is the thing about mmos, you are not playing 10+hrs a day without interaction or social isolation, you are spending 10hrs a day interacting with people from across the globe. There are people I call friends in Saudi Arabia, Dubai, Germany, UK, Honghong, Japan, Australia, Spain, Mexico, Canada, and throughout the US. I meet my future wife in Chicago on this game for example. Alot of my ffxi guild members I still have contact with today nearly 15yrs later. I remember when we were starting college together, or in many of thier cases just Juniors in HS. Now many have kids and families. Many I have met in real life.

Who ever did the study about mmos causing social isolation... well is just wrong it is literally the opposite. (Well use to be... why mmos have changed for the worse)

MMOs provide social interaction not remove it. Are they addicting yes they are. When my account was hacked back in ffxi and it took SE, 2 weeks to unlock it and get it back. I slept horribly, didn't eat well, couldn't focus well in college, and was in a state of constant stress. So I agree it is addicting. But then again almost everything we like is not just the bad stuff.

Cool personal experience.
And no, talking with people over a screen or interface doesn't qualify as social interaction. Not at least from the perspective of a healthy biosocial development.

[Edax]

And no, talking with people over a screen or interface doesn't qualify as social interaction. Not at least from the perspective of a healthy biosocial development.

Now you're just gatekeeping. Nobody asked for the perspective of "healthy biosocial development".

[Nixxe]

Is exactly because how dopamine works that is such the effect.

How do you think dopamine works?

[Alexandre_Noireau]

How do you think dopamine works?

Neutrotransmiter associated with motivation-reward. Some people produce more than others. Neuroreceptors in some cases don't actually recept them and in others just go wild and only recept them. You might be tempted to say "Is the dopamine insuficiency or self immunity" which causes depression. Yes it is. And guess what doesn't help in the proper threatment of such ilness. Spending your whole life stuck in a skinner box that barely stimulates your neuronal networks, literally dumbing you down to basic stimuli and quite literally deteriorating your brain increasing the chances of further brain damage or brain diseases through the roof and beyond.

Stop. Glorifying. Depression or anxiety disorders or any mental illness for that matter.
They are not healthy lifestyles. Is an illness, that needs both pharmaceutical and psycho-therapy.

If we were discussing morbidly obesse people... Oh wait, there is a whole legion of people that actually thinks that is also a "lifestyle".

[Nixxe]

Neutrotransmiter associated with motivation-reward. Some people produce more than others. Neuroreceptors in some cases don't actually recept them and in others just go wild and only recept them. You might be tempted to say "Is the dopamine insuficiency or self immunity" which causes depression. Yes it is. And guess what doesn't help in the proper threatment of such ilness. Spending your whole life stuck in a skinner box that barely stimulates your neuronal networks, literally dumbing you down to basic stimuli and quite literally deteriorating your brain increasing the chances of further brain damage or brain diseases through the roof and beyond.

Stop. Glorifying. Depression or anxiety disorders or any mental illness for that matter.
They are not healthy lifestyles. Is an illness, that needs both pharmaceutical and psycho-therapy.

If we were discussing morbidly obesse people... Oh wait, there is a whole legion of people that actually thinks that is also a "lifestyle".

Yeah, you don't know what you're talking about. Reducing dopamine to motivation and reward is grossly oversimplifying it, as well as misrepresenting the role it plays in that area.

[Alexandre_Noireau]

1.- And do you go around calling Starbucks a drug dealer then?

2.- I can and I will. Escapism is not a crime, it is not morally wrong, and it is not for you to decide that it can or cannot be supported. It's your subjective opinion that society is unhealthy.

3.- No, the last thing you want to happen to a person with depression is to take what little happiness they have away from them. What's paramount to a person with depression is happiness, not health.

1.- Yes, they deal a drug (several in fact). Keep trying to play with the "illegal-legal" thingy, drugs are drugs, addictions are addictions, and if a drug addiction makes a person unable to achieve or keep a healthy lifestyle... It doesn't matter much if its legal or illegal, is damaging them and exposure has to end.
2.- Is not a crime, is not morally wrong, and no i do not decide. Yet, i'm not expressing my opinion. Is an objective fact that we live in a mentally ill society, we are seeing depression and other mental illness pandemics all over the developed and even some in developing countries, with terrible numbers to back it up. Like massive increases in the last 2 decades of teenage and young adult suicides all across the globe.
3.- That is the very definition of learned helplessness. "Nothing else can make me happy, so i just stick with this till it kills me." 21st millennial nihilism at it's finnest, or worse.

Sorry to pick this out from pages back -
MMOs can be quite beneficial to social development. Older adults can benefit from forming meaningful friendships online, and those with Autism Spectrum Disorder can learn new social skills in a "safer" (ie - less intimidating) environment.

https://www.sciencedirect.com/scienc...47563215004057

https://www.aane.org/video-games-ben...special-needs/

Excellent articles, thank you.

Yeah, you don't know what you're talking about. Reducing dopamine to motivation and reward is grossly oversimplifying it, as well as misrepresenting the role it plays in that area.

I'm not a neurobiologist, and this is an MMORPG forum, not my doctorate thesis. Yes, it is simplified, yet is what they mainly work at, and yes, dopamine regulates other processes too, but the chemistry in our brains still a whole new world to keep studying and learning. Neurobiology is amazing and neurochemistry even more so. So much to study and learn.

Yet, you know what is not that "unknown" anymore? The effects of long periods of isolation and lack of significant human contact and healthy social relationships on people with depression. Case. Check the Hikikomori Syndrome - Social Withdrawal. And how is spreading like wildfire through the western world. Capitalism and Neoliberalism lifestyles failed promises and fantasies aside, last thing you want is these people to keep their habits. They are being literally killed by modern society, learned helplessness and their addiction. You can threat one at the time, and since we are not moving into a cyclical resource-energy based economy that allow for a better more humane world anytime soon, in the mean time i rather work on what we can change: Teach these people that there is hope, that things can change.

[Nixxe]

I'm not a neurobiologist, and this is an MMORPG forum, not my doctorate thesis. Yes, it is simplified, yet is what they mainly work at, and yes, dopamine regulates other processes too, but the chemistry in our brains still a whole new world to keep studying and learning. Neurobiology is amazing and neurochemistry even more so. So much to study and learn.

Yet, you know what is not that "unknown" anymore? The effects of long periods of isolation and lack of significant human contact and healthy social relationships on people with depression. Case. Check the Hikikomori Syndrome - Social Withdrawal. And how is spreading like wildfire through the western world. Capitalism and Neoliberalism lifestyles failed promises and fantasies aside, last thing you want is these people to keep their habits. They are being literally killed by modern society, learned helplessness and their addiction. You can threat one at the time, and since we are not moving into a cyclical resource-energy based economy that allow for a better more humane world anytime soon, in the mean time i rather work on what we can change: Teach these people that there is hope, that things can change.

If you have the means to do so, I'd recommend seeking out a therapist.

[Edax]

Is an objective fact that we live in a mentally ill society

You are incorrect. There is no objective "this is a mentally ill society and this a not a mentally ill society" metric.

3.- That is the very definition of learned helplessness. "Nothing else can make me happy, so i just stick with this till it kills me." 21st millennial nihilism at it's finnest, or worse.

No it's not. Millennials aren't saying "nothing can make me happy". And seeking happiness is not nihilism.

[Alexandre_Noireau]

1.- You are incorrect. There is no objective "this is a mentally ill society and this a not a mentally ill society" metric.

2.- No it's not. Millennials aren't saying "nothing can make me happy". And seeking happiness is not nihilism.

1.- I am correct. In fact there is, actually exists a WHOle World Health Organization that does exactly that, study and categorize in an objetive manner the health, including mental health, of societies arround the world. Spoiler alert. Western World is mentally ill and facing a serious pandemic of social-whitdrawal syndrome, depression, anxiety and stress disorders and others. A whole emisphere, OBJECTIVELY MENTALLY ILL.

2.- Seeking happiness as in shutting in cutting all social relationships and allowing a skinner box operative program destroys their brain and further develops unthreated mental illnesses increasing chances of suicide through the roof. You really need to work on your concept of Happiness. Specially to make it something far more significant than "Something that pleasures me".

If you have the means to do so, I'd recommend seeking out a therapist.

Already did.
Thanks for the good advice.

[Edax]

1.- Yes, they [Starbuck] deal a drug (several in fact). Keep trying to play with the "illegal-legal" thingy, drugs are drugs, addictions are addictions, and if a drug addiction makes a person unable to achieve or keep a healthy lifestyle... It doesn't matter much if its legal or illegal, is damaging them and exposure has to end..

1.- I am correct. In fact there is, actually exists a WHOle World Health Organization that does exactly that, study and categorize in an objetive manner the health, including mental health, of societies arround the world. Spoiler alert. Western World is mentally ill and facing a serious pandemic of social-whitdrawal syndrome, depression, anxiety and stress disorders and others. A whole emisphere, OBJECTIVELY MENTALLY ILL.

2.- Seeking happiness as in shutting in cutting all social relationships and allowing a skinner box operative program destroys their brain and further develops unthreated mental illnesses increasing chances of suicide through the roof. You really need to work on your concept of Happiness. Specially to make it something far more significant than "Something that pleasures me".

1. Please cite where the World Health Organization has declared an entire hemisphere mentally ill.

2. Skinner boxes do not destroy brains, they would obviously be illegal if that were the case. And no, I don't need to work on my concept of happiness. I'll will not seek medical advice from someone who has ranted about society being mentally ill or rants about how coffee shop baristas are drug dealers. If you did this out in public, there is a legitimate chance you might be checked into a mental asylum.