Anyone else getting bored of FF14’s repetativeness?

[Valkyrie_Lenneth]

Because I pay the same amount of money you do to play this game. It's my right to say what I think would be improvements. Right back at you, if you don't like change, feel free to leave.

I've played action mmos. The "ooooo shiny" factor wore off after a month or so, and I found the bosses and encounters more boring, and the combat got just as same after awhile. Tera was one that got old pretty quickly.

Also, I was under the impression that the reason wow is failing isn't because it hasn't changed, but because it's changed too much.

[Kaylessa]

Also, I was under the impression that the reason wow is failing isn't because it hasn't changed, but because it's changed too much.

It's complicated. WoW had to change because the market for MMOs is so much different than when WoW was first released back in ... 2006? You have to remember that before WoW most MMOs were sandboxes, and WoW started that heavy transition from predominantly sandbox gameplay to themepark gameplay. So there was a bunch of stuff in vanilla WoW that needed to change. Also just QoL improvements. There were no quest markers - you had to actually read the quests. There were no markers above enemies to indicate it was a quest enemy, you had to read the quests. Adventuring could easily kill you so you had to group up with people spontaneously to survive (something which I love and is something I love about ESO making it more social a game than both FFXIV and WoW).

But there are some changes that were not so good, like the implementation of the huge emphasis on RNG for loot, which makes it clear Blizz devs don't ever want you to stop playing the game.

[Xyr]

I've played action mmos. The "ooooo shiny" factor wore off after a month or so, and I found the bosses and encounters more boring, and the combat got just as same after awhile. Tera was one that got old pretty quickly.

Also, I was under the impression that the reason wow is failing isn't because it hasn't changed, but because it's changed too much.

Certainly not. What has changed in WoW? 99% QoL stuff. The art didn't change, they are still using the crap from 2006, it's just rendered in 10x more. The combat changed? Nope. The raids and dungeons changed? Certainly not, the boss names might be different and have different models but the the mechanics are the same. WoW is failing because the core of the game didn't change and it's just too old. Just like FFXIV, there are plenty of people in WoW that still plays because they enjoy the old unchanging style. But what else beyond that? It can't attract newer players because it doesn't have modern gamestyle, so as more and more players leave because it's getting old, it began to fail.

[Valkyrie_Lenneth]

Certainly not. What has changed in WoW? 99% QoL stuff. The art didn't change, they are still using the crap from 2006, it's just rendered in 10x more. The combat changed? Nope. The raids and dungeons changed? Certainly not, the boss names might be different and have different models but the the mechanics are the same. WoW is failing because the core of the game didn't change and it's just too old. Just like FFXIV, there are plenty of people in WoW that still plays because they enjoy the old unchanging style. But what else beyond that? It can't attract newer players because it doesn't have modern gamestyle, so as more and more players leave because it's getting old, it began to fail.

What is a modern game style? Super duper graphics? Action mmo? Fps mmo? Turn based? Founders packs for $200? What to you says "this is a modern game"?


I'd also like to point out that for all you say xiv is old and not modern, the game is growing its player base, not losing it. It's had the highest amount of subs, and that was before the expansion dropped. Nothing that points to the game dying.

[Xyr]

What is a modern game style? Super duper graphics? Action mmo? Fps mmo? Turn based? Founders packs for $200? What to you says "this is a modern game"?


I'd also like to point out that for all you say xiv is old and not modern, the game is growing a player base, not losing one. It's had the highest amount of subs, and that was before the expansion dropped. Nothing that points to the game dying.

I'm not saying FFXIV is DYING right at this moment. WoW was at its height in WoTLK, it then started to fall as more and more people left because the game was just getting old, it took several years to reach the current state they are in right now, and it's the same for FFXIV, people are going to leave because it's getting old and nothing's changing, it won't be instantaneous, but it will happen over a period of several years, because that's how games are when they remain stagnant.

As for art/graphics, ideally, FFXIV should have the best graphic in the MMO market, it's an FF game for Christ sake. Anyway, that would be ideal but it should at least be on par with FFXV graphics and better than BDO, but their current graphics is more like FFX-2 remastered.
As for combat, it needs to flow better, each action should connect with the next smoothly instead of feeling like they are all individual actions. Imagine watching a TV series, and each episode has nothing to do with the next.

The whole weaving oGCD thing is not ideal at all. Again I'll use the TV example, there is vague plot of some sorts but 1 out of every 3 episodes is a filler. That's how the weaving system feels. If there is weaving, it should help you connect one action to the next, instead of feeling like it's an independent action altogether.

I'll give more examples, imagine you are dancing, each step should connect you with the next rhythmically, but the current combat is outdated and feels like you are trying to dance but you started to slip, but you don't fall so you just keep slipping over and over, there's no connection between the steps, you are just balancing your body from falling moment by moment. And it sure doesn't look good either.

[Kaylessa]

What is a modern game style? Super duper graphics? Action mmo? Fps mmo? Turn based? Founders packs for $200? What to you says "this is a modern game"?


I'd also like to point out that for all you say xiv is old and not modern, the game is growing its player base, not losing it. It's had the highest amount of subs, and that was before the expansion dropped. Nothing that points to the game dying.

Modern MMO style involves a lot of … I hate this phrase, but handholding. Old MMOs would boot you out into the world and leave you to find your own way, it was a world and you carved your path in it. Modern MMOs will have the developers tell you what to do - go here, do this quest, pray return to the Waking Sands. Modern MMOs de-emphasize social experiences, vanilla WoW had NO party finder, you formed your own party out in the world. The combat tends to be easier so overland content will be solo-able. In vanilla WoW you had trouble killing a single enemy when you started out, so walking to an area with 3 or 4 enemies was dangerous. Modern MMOs de-emphasize stats and choices. Modern MMOs have quick leveling to respect people's time.

FFXIV ARR isn't old, but the original FFXIV was based on an older style of MMO and never would have been successful. They pivoted to a more modern style in ARR.

[TankHunter678]

Certainly not. What has changed in WoW? 99% QoL stuff. The art didn't change, they are still using the crap from 2006, it's just rendered in 10x more. The combat changed? Nope. The raids and dungeons changed? Certainly not, the boss names might be different and have different models but the the mechanics are the same. WoW is failing because the core of the game didn't change and it's just too old. Just like FFXIV, there are plenty of people in WoW that still plays because they enjoy the old unchanging style. But what else beyond that? It can't attract newer players because it doesn't have modern gamestyle, so as more and more players leave because it's getting old, it began to fail.

The art did change steadily, but Blizzard never updated the art of old content. The combat did change, with classes getting reworks every expansion and entire systems that were in vanilla being removed like resistances, minimum ranges, etc. The Raids did change with even more difficulties thrown in and flex raiding. The Dungeons did change with Mythic+ thrown in. The mechanics have changed with a lot of new ones thrown in with every expansion.

And right now WoW is getting a surge in popularity because while everyone is dissatisfied with BFA for numerous reasons (Story recycling, class design, titanforging, infinite AP grinds) WoW Classic is coming. With the success or failure of WoW Classic being rumored to be the decider between what Blizzard's approach will be for the next expac after BFA.

[Xyr]

The art did change steadily, but Blizzard never updated the art of old content. The combat did change, with classes getting reworks every expansion and entire systems that were in vanilla being removed like resistances, minimum ranges, etc. The Raids did change with even more difficulties thrown in and flex raiding. The Dungeons did change with Mythic+ thrown in. The mechanics have changed with a lot of new ones thrown in with every expansion.

And right now WoW is getting a surge in popularity because while everyone is dissatisfied with BFA for numerous reasons (Story recycling, class design, titanforging, infinite AP grinds) WoW Classic is coming. With the success or failure of WoW Classic being rumored to be the decider between what Blizzard's approach will be for the next expac after BFA.

The art didn't change, it just got higher resolution. An example of change in art would be the difference between cinematic of classic vs BFA. Reworks for classes is not a change in combat, changing talents, changing numbers, adding new spells, etc. doesn't change the combat system. Just an example, it would be like WoW changing their combat to BDO style(this is an extreme example but it shows the point) would be considered changing their combat system. What they did was just tuning and adding spells. At the end of the day it's still "cast spells, queue up more spells, 1.5s gcd." Whatever defines the core of their combat, it didn't change.

Raids got more difficult but the mechanics are the same, the bosses are the same style, changing difficulty is not the same as adding interesting and new content. What they made are just natural progression of updates, but did they change the cores? No.

[TankHunter678]

The art didn't change, it just got higher resolution. An example of change in art would be the difference between cinematic of classic vs BFA. Reworks for classes is not a change in combat, changing talents, changing numbers, adding new spells, etc. doesn't change the combat system. Just an example, it would be like WoW changing their combat to BDO style(this is an extreme example but it shows the point) would be considered changing their combat system. What they did was just tuning and adding spells. At the end of the day it's still "cast spells, queue up more spells, 1.5s gcd." Whatever defines the core of their combat, it didn't change.

Raids got more difficult but the mechanics are the same, the bosses are the same style, changing difficulty is not the same as adding interesting and new content. What they made are just natural progression of updates, but did they change the cores? No.

If changing how people interact with the combat system, changing how their classes work on fundamental levels, is not a change in combat then there is not an MMO on the market that will have a "good" combat system. Likewise for the art where the difference between level 5 gear and level 120 gear is immense with far more layering systems, additional models rather then just different color texture, and much more highly detailed textures. Same thing when it comes to raid and dungeon mechanics.

Sorry but MMOs cannot afford to change game genre every expac. That is literally the only way to "change up" things going by your definition of combat changes. Making an entirely new game.

[Xyr]

Snip

Changing the entire game is difficult, however, with the progression of technology in both physics and computer science, how are you going to keep up with modern games when you are counting technological progression in terms of 10-20 years? The only way is to essentially remake the game, so either remake the game or update it completely every 10 years. And yes, it is entirely possible, not in one expansion, but in the course of 4-5 expansions as a combined effort. This is the difference between putting a game on lifesupport as it ages vs remodeling and renewed life. No, it's not easy, but neither is monopolizing the MMORPG market, you want to continue to have the stranglehold on the market? You need to take difficult measures. Not sure why people think they can just keep taking it easy and hold on to the title of number 1 forever.