The "Wow Refugee's" impact on the FFXIV Community?

[Nixxe]

None of that is relevant.

At this point you've made it fairly clear you're just a common sophist.

[mario710]

Sensing some heavy cognitive dissonance in this thread.

[Kaylessa]

IMO impact has less to do with WOW players jumping over and more to do with FFXIV's emergence into the mainstream. When the game is niche and hidden it attracts specific sorts of players but when a game hits mainstream it tends to lean more towards a typical cross section of society, with all the drama and clashes that come with that.

I've met quite a few WOW refugees in this game and they've mostly been really quite pleasant.

[mario710]

At this point you've made it fairly clear you're just a common sophist.

Meanwhile, your pseudo-philosophical posts regarding the ’abundance of WoW immigrants’ are backed by nothing.

Sounds a lot like money.

[mario710]

Calling me a sophist is classy.

[Vahlnir]

It is indeed factual that any number (undefined) of factors will influence a community for better or worse. You ask me to provide evidence of human nature, however, I won't do that. What I will do is restate my point that change is inevitable.

Despite our efforts, everything evolves over time. To claim that WoW immigrants are the problem child of this community infecting everyone is hyperbolic without any semblance of evidence that ISN'T anecdotal.

You've said a lot of things, but this is probably the one thing I truly agree with.

[mario710]

I'm not here to discuss semantics.

My goal is to inform any uneducated - and morbidly xenophobic - individuals who cannot grasp the idea of change that it’s an absolute certainty, and perhaps, one of the few forces we can count on.

Nothing stagnates.

[MiniTofu]

I played WoW for 6 years after 1 year launch. Left WoW 10 years ago and started playing FFXIV 5 years ago. GW2 mixbag ongoing... some Aion, Cabal, Tera, Ragnarok in between.

So welcome to FFXIV, very nice community. No soul crushing DPS Meters... well SE never supports it and they will ban whoever use it against anyone for accusation and criticism in game performance. So be warned.

[HWalsh]

There has been no noticeable increase in toxicity because of WoW players moving over to this game.

There is observable factual data that we (and you) do have to admit. Once that data is admitted to, and it has to be at this point, it creates legitimate cause for alarm.

In design philosophies, WoW and FF 14 have different cores.

WoW is less MMO*RPG* and more MMO-ESport. They actively highlight it, promote "world first" events, etc.

ESports are about optimized performance. There is a "Bro mentality" where "tough love" is normal behavior, especially when sport-level adrenaline is pumping.

In an ESport telling someone, "Start pulling your weight!" Is completely normal. "If you can't hack it we can bring in any number of others who will! That upsets you!? Get gud!" In WoW it's acceptable to call out parse numbers, mock openly, call out equivalent to gear scores, etc

That's NOT tolerated in FF XIV. While some players use parsers (I've opted out of those personally), they can't, in game chat, rip you over the parse. Doing so is a violation.

It's just different intended designs of both games. FF XIV is a story driven MMO*RPG* with little-to-no ESport support. You can't talk about parsing, shame players, can't be a jerk to "toughen people up." You must complete story quests and side quests to unlock them.

FFXIV encourages level 80s to play with level 20s. They incentivize rewards for re-completing content with players doing it for the first time. That kind of thing doesn't exist in WoW. In WoW story is secondary and PVP/Raids are the focus. The end game isn't A game, it is THE game.

The reason people are concerned about the WoW Refugee Situation is the ESport mentality, when injected into an RPG society is toxic.

Is that gatekeeping? I don't think so.

If you're hanging out for some casual fun, and someone breaks out a copy of Street Fighter 5 everyone has fun until that one guy, and we all know "that" guy, starts telling everyone how to play, who to play, and starts quoting things like "frame data" and "punishment mechanics."

Things become a LOT less fun.

What this means:

I'm an RPG Player. I won't touch a raid. I was traumatized by WoW raiding so badly that I'm afraid to try it in FF XIV. I *want* to try a raid, but I'm legitimately terrified of it. I would need to look up a raid video on YouTube, follow a written guide, etc, triple check my gear score, and then I'm afraid I'd face blow back for opting out of being parsed.

All of that is due to WoW trauma.

Now we are getting a massive influx of WoW players who, to them, that is normalized behavior. To them that is how MMOs are supposed to be played. That is a much larger percentage of the WoW player base than it is the FF XIV player base it does mean that the number of those ESport players, percentage-wise, is on the rise.

Thus, I'm sorry to say it, but the WoW exodus is a reason for us to legitimately be concerned.

[Vahlnir]

-snip-

I'm not gonna admit to an imaginary cause and effect scenario in regards to the "WoW Exodus". Why acknowledge a problem that simply doesn't exist? And why blame an entirely different player base for the actions of a few here? Plot twist: we are them, and they are us. We are all people on the internet. We play 2 different games. And WoW players aren't coming here because they love Esports, I can assure you. They want something different, and that is what FF XIV offers. And I'd be willing to bet that most of them are happy to have a dev team that doesn't treat them like garbage.