Reminder that war is still good.

[Maneesha]

I took my 70 WAR alt via DR into The Aery last night. Trash pulls, one group, were kicking the stuffing out of me and the healer was constantly healing me, even with cooldowns.

WAR is not okay. Pre 5.0 I took much less damage in that same dungeon with the same gear. In fact, I took way less damage everywhere I've been since the expansion launched. The reason my WAR is still 70 and my PLD is 80 is that I hate how squishy my WAR is and the PLD is more bearable now, even though it also is still squishy at il440+

Whatever they did to our mitigation, they need to reverse it. Everyone compares the tanks via damage numbers - we're not DPS, we're supposed to be able to take several hits...

Don't tell me it's "okay at 80" because that's just elitist rubbish. People have to GET to 80 first.

(The main problem I have found on these forums over the many years I've been here is that there is a vocal group whose main replies can be summed up as "I like the difficulty - it's all great - get good scrub." and the average player doesn't feel that way. It's supposed to be a game where you can have fun with a reasonable level of competence. They'll probably chip in several times in all the threads like this. If they are who the devs actually listen to, that's why we're screwed.)

I haven't tanked much low level stuff since i used DR's for leveling alt jobs and am not aware of any dmg increases in older dungeons, but since they took out a lot of stuff , you simply miss a few mitigation skills, which might have been available previously or simply you haven't unlocked yet. Namely lvl 56 Raw Intuition, lvl 58 Equilibrium, lvl 68 Shake it Off, all of those you can use as mitigation, or have to use right now in higher lvl dungeons to cycle through. You don't have access to Anticipation,Convalescence, Awareness anymore and also the mitigation and self-heal on Inner Beast is gone too. But for that you have a built in 20% dmg reduction as a passive trait. Also as an advice, you should incorporate Arm's Length into your mitigation rotation, since it applies "Slow" which slows down the attack speed of the mobs and the frequency of their ability use. Does not work on some mobs(immune to status effects, but those are rare and usually every mob gets this debuff in dungeons) and bosses.

[Khimer]

(The main problem I have found on these forums over the many years I've been here is that there is a vocal group whose main replies can be summed up as "I like the difficulty - it's all great - get good scrub." and the average player doesn't feel that way. It's supposed to be a game where you can have fun with a reasonable level of competence. They'll probably chip in several times in all the threads like this. If they are who the devs actually listen to, that's why we're screwed.)

Here's the problem,its actually complete opposite: SE listens to people that don't know how to play the job correctly, that's the reason why we have less skills than we did 2 expansions ago(some of those were skills that people didn't use which is good, there shouldn't a skill bloat, but they could've made them useful instead of removing completely). People get upset that there are players who outperform them those "tryhards", "elitists", but they deserve to outperform them, because they try more, they spend time perfecting rotations and optimisation. But instead of blaming themselves those "average players" blame job design and jobs get completely butchered, so good players that actually enjoyed difficulty get screwed. Their favourite job is no longer fun which is heartbreaking honestly. Some people may say "difficult does not equal fun", but how come when asked what was the most fun iteration of drk for example, people always refer to 3.0 drk when it had the biggest apm and was one of the more difficult jobs. I can't see what's fun in pressing baindead 5 buttons and seeing high numbers without even trying(current IR btw), but i do see fun in perfecting a hard rotation, squeezing the most out of the job, optimizing every last bit of it, and getting better at it with every fight.

I'm not by any means a top savage raider, but to me it seems extremely egotistical, when people want to ruin fun for other players just because they can't be bothered to learn their job to at least decent level. If those "average players" actually loved their classes they would've tried their best to master it, not butcher it. Average players if they call themselves that should be fine with average performance.

The takeaway here is SE shouldn't listen to either every other "scrub" nor should it listen to "1% top player base", cause those people care only about numbers and not what is actually fun.

[NyneSwordz]

Yea I watched Xeno's recent tank video, all I have to say is glad he is apparently maining DRK now. Maybe it's old timer's disease.

I don't get how after putting up eye for nearly 6 years it's all of a sudden become clunky. It's the same 3 GCDs it's always been lol. Furthermore, WAR doesn't have near the amount of oGCDs that DRK has to warrant getting rid of the combo. Spam path and Fell Cleave, wow such depth. It wouldn't be good for the job IMO.

I could however see Eye being extended to 40 sec, a minor buff since it would allow for more Path & Cleaves.

Eye was never 3 gcds. What we call eye now was the old maim buff.

And its clunky now because no other tank has to deal with it.

Eye was removed for pvp and its much smoother that way.

[NyneSwordz]

Agreed. Xeno has some decent stuff but he spews some BS too and people seem to eat it up. His rant on applying eye is one of those headscratchers. War has always been the only tank job that needed a wind up. Pld has always just plopped out fof and gone to town. Drk just engages and off it goes. War had literally been a 3gcd wind up for slashing and self damage buff for all time and now its 'clunky'?

Xeno is why were memecleave now because people blindly bought into his 'rng crit QQ' sob story that had no basis in reality if you checked the math. Now hes trying to delete eye because....reasons. i too am glad he might move away from war and stop mucking it up with his 'influencer' power. The internet is great at spreading ideas. Unfortunately no distinction between good and bad ones.

I like "memecleave."

[Inuk9]

Xeno had 2 major complains about WAR.

1 - need 3 GCDs for 10% buff at pull (4 if you count the tomahawk).
2 - need a minor potency increase on some weaponskills.


That is all the changes warrior needs, no onslaught dumb changes please.

[Nedkel]

We need at least 7 skills merged into one, 3 is not enough. xD

But on the serious side note, it would be cool if they changed our gauge skills into oGCD with 2.4 sec CD.

[Izsha]

Why does war siddenly 'need' to get rid of eyes 3gcds when it has been fine with it for 5 years? The other tabks always had faster ramp so that didnt change either so war isnt any more relatively slow than ever before.

Xeno says it and suddenly its a problem? No one has mentioned this 'problem' in 5 years until a youtube personality said it. If you want to change it, then articulate some reasons WHY. Dont just parrot stuff someone else said.

[Atreides]

Why does war siddenly 'need' to get rid of eyes 3gcds when it has been fine with it for 5 years? The other tabks always had faster ramp so that didnt change either so war isnt any more relatively slow than ever before.

Xeno says it and suddenly its a problem? No one has mentioned this 'problem' in 5 years until a youtube personality said it. If you want to change it, then articulate some reasons WHY. Dont just parrot stuff someone else said.

I don't know where your 5 years come from but the Eye was added to the 3rd combo in Stormblood, before that the effect was applied by maim which is our 2nd GCD.
Eye became an issue now because the combo effect of Mythril Tempest is mocking us with the increased timer on Eye, which makes us the only tanks that have to worry about applying their buff in mob groups where as others don't have to.
Now that every tank has AoEs WAR feels cluncky with the Eye effect where other tanks just do it with either a buff or a OGCD.

[Izsha]

I don't know where your 5 years come from but the Eye was added to the 3rd combo in Stormblood, before that the effect was applied by maim which is our 2nd GCD.
Eye became an issue now because the combo effect of Mythril Tempest is mocking us with the increased timer on Eye, which makes us the only tanks that have to worry about applying their buff in mob groups where as others don't have to.
Now that every tank has AoEs WAR feels cluncky with the Eye effect where other tanks just do it with either a buff or a OGCD.

Ive been here since 2.0 playing war the entire time. War had the slashing buff on eye before they swapped it with maim. You ALWAYS had a full 3gcd combo ramp up since this game has existed. It used to he to get slashing and damage buff, then just damage buff.

Other tabks have ALWAYS had an ogcd to get up and running. Pld never had a ranp up. Even in 2.0 it was fof and 1 rage of halone. There was no ramp. Boom go while war was eye combo. Drk has never had a ranp. Darkside used to be an always on buff before the fight. Now you have to hit an ogcd to turn it on. The only job that got slower to apply their buff is drk because darkside isnt on before engaging.

So your logic is that eye is 'clunky" because other tabks have an ogcd. But that has literrally always been the case. It was clunky last month, last year, and 5 years ago but no one noticed or cared until xeno said it. Now its a 'problem'.

The aoe argument is even worse because war, againx has always been the job trying to manage a st combo with aoe. But now its easier because you can extend it. War got LESS clunky in aoe thanks to tempest extending eye and giv8ng gauge.

[Reynhart]

So your logic is that eye is 'clunky" because other tabks have an ogcd. But that has literrally always been the case. It was clunky last month, last year, and 5 years ago but no one noticed or cared until xeno said it. Now its a 'problem'.

I'm far from a top level WAR but my feeling is that Eye started to felt clunky when Path receive the additionnal gauge, thus giving the feeling that applying Eye "reduced" your DPS by delaying your next Fell Cleave. The more I think about it, the more I feel that the completely-awesome-over-the-top-Fell-Cleave brought WAR into this uncomfortable position that this is the only skill that matters.

On a sidenote, as a main DRK, I'd take maintaning DArkside with a 3-step combo any day just for breaking our 1-2-3 rotation over and over.