Alot of hate on new job iterations o.O

[Physic]

if they just took the slowdown off monk, decreased the damage of riddle of fire and add a speed buff instead, and just let the class go crazy with speed (like 1.5 gcd) we would be happier. we got cool skills this xpac but the slowdown and speed ups just makes monk feel like a clumsy untrained martial artist that is tripping over his own feet.

not really, the slowdown on riddle of fire is not why the current monk feels less entertaining than before the expansion. Because the slowdown was already there. and we didn't really get cool stuff, we got an extra aoe, which we wouldn't have needed, the main aoe limiter was tp, in a large pull youd generally spam rock breaker, and most things would be dead.

skills to help with gl management, after they removed gl management tools. Bootshine buff, to replace 10% damage buff, that's probably the most interesting new mechanic

there's not enough synergy/interaction/combos in the class any more.

but everyone has their own vision of what the class needs

the job has a lack of in

[Dogempire]

I like red mage but it feels like it really needs something else, engagement is nice if you can't use displacement, but a potency loss and shouldn't be tied to it. Also enchanted reprise is literally useless except for very niche situations, but even then it's not worth the mana used on it to delay your finisher.

I feel like a flat mana gain skill would be a nice replacement for reprise, or even a skill that does something like increases your mana or heck give enchanted reprise a recast timer and let it let you skip to using the 2 finishers.

[ForteNightshade]

You will always hear or read more complaints than praise because the latter doesn't really invite much discussion. People unhappy with their job(s) of choice will want to see it changed, thus be more upfront with their criticisms. I'm guilty of doing precisely that. Outside of bringing up Disembowel not being refreshed on our AoE abilities, I generally have little to say about Dragoon that isn't positive. I would like charges on Spineshatter but that's more of a neat addition than a complaint. Comparatively, I have plenty to say about the clipping issues on Ninja and Samurai's lower damage alongside how pointless Shoha feels. Why? I want these things addressed, especially Ninja who I feel could undergo some fine tuning.

[Warlyx]

gameplay wise i like the changes alot but graphically from the animation design aspect im very sad and dissapointed.

cool looking animations are on the OGCD , so u can stop the animation with a boring one :P

[Kolsykol]

BLM which is my fav only got improvements, and I am happy with WHM too.
I actually didn't like SAM in Stormblood but for some reason I am loving it in Shadowbringers and it only got new fun stuff without being changed too much ( don't fix what isn't broken I guess? ).

The two cases that I can kinda see people being upset about is MNK basically getting nothing in comparison to the rest and still being stuck with the same abilities that we've had since the beginning and SCH losing bane.
Art of War is boring as all hell...

MNK is seriously disappointing... As a huge fighting game fan I seriously want to love MNK, and it was my first class that I leveled. My character originally started out as a Pugilist.
But what we got is seriously boring, most of our animations especially sucks.
They have so many awesome animations to draw from if they'd look at fighting games, I'd love something like Chun Li's kicking.
Just something <_<............
The animations don't have to be super ultra flashy with effects if that's what people are afraid of ( altho I'd personally want it ), but seriously.
We don't really look much like what I'd imagine a Martial Artist to look like in action in this setting.
And the animations don't reflect how fast MNK's are supposed to be.

[KingofDunkshire]

I just don't like the direction they are going, they basically dumbed the game down across the board and took away a lot of the uniqueness it had making it more boring and cookie cutter.

-Turned enmity into a toggle so tanks don't have to worry about it anymore, especially now that provoke has a taunt aspect to it and removed a lot of the Tank cooldowns
-Big steps towards making healers into healbots by removing tank and DPS cool downs, nerfing healer dps and increasing outgoing damage
-Nerfed Dps support to the ground and look to make us all Blackmages and Samurai's that only dps and nothing else.
-Made the jobs I have seen/played (haven't played them all) more simple and generic

If the Raids coming up are a massive step up in difficulty then ok I can see the need for the dumb down but if they are on the same level of the last tier it means they have removed another layer of difficulty to the game. I hope they don't continue down this path because I have seen what it has done to other MMO's, WoWs current state is one, this is not a time to turn toward being a WoW clone.

This has to be the dumbest thing I've read in awhile

1. They do have to worry about threat/enmity between tanks (tank swapping), then you have adds to worry about if a WHM goes HAM on healing. Plus they had to remove the ramp up time to get enmity cause dps are doing insane dmg now, we're at a stage in FF14 ARR where most classes have a few 850-1,110 potency abilities in their tool kit. The difference between a BLM (top dmg) and a Tanks dmg is almost 4.5k dps, we're not even into the first actual raid yet.

2. Oh LORD healers having to heal...like cry me a river you have to do your class role

3. Nin has always been bottom of the dmg, now you have DNC being the bottom. That's what happens when you get amazing buffs, you don't get amazing buffs and amazing dmg. Then if you look at the top 5 dmg, Mach and DRG are in the top 5 in both fights, it's a damn good time to be ether of those jobs.

4. They had to remove abilities to add new ones or else we would have insane ability bloat. Hell Gunbreaker is a new job and it's already suffering from ability bloat. This isn't WoW where you can have classes with 14 or less abilities on their hotbars. Gunbreaker alone w/o using macros needs 29. Even my Ast needs 30, then you have DNC which needs about 26, DRK needs 28 and you can go on and on. When you almost need 3.5 hotbars for abilities...THAT'S NOT GUTTING JOBS, that's getting rid of bloating abilities.

The only job that can 100% say they got shafted is AST, they are over 500 hps behind WHM, which SCH is only 110 ish hps behind WHM in healing. DRK, WAR, PLD, BLM, WHM, SCH, MCH, DRG, SAM are all amazing at their roles. With RDM, SMN, NIN, DNC being in the middle while everyone else is meh. MNK while being in the top 3 dps, it's in this limbo of meh but good at dps.

[LunaProtege]

I used to play MCH In Stormblood... The new MCH feels chaotic and incomprehensible. There's like, four different sets of abilities, and NONE of them have any overlap, and there's no clear progression from one to the other. You wind up in the middle of a combo and suddenly either Drill or Air Anchor is off cooldown, and sometimes that's during the Wildcharge, and Wildcharge itself is now a frantic buttonspam.
Just... Chaos...
I now play Gunbreaker; Its like Old MCH, but without the RNG, and without having to worry about the old Heat Gauge. I like it.
... The main change I explicitly like about new MCH is Overheat being an activated ability rather than something you either have to force during wildcharge, or avoid entirely.
The shift towards MCH being more about machines is nice, but its gameplay is going to have to be FAR more manageable before I can go back to it.
... But really, with Gunbreaker being everything I wanted MCH to be, and more... I'm not sure anyone's going to see much reason to do so.

[Blanchimont]

not really, the slowdown on riddle of fire is not why the current monk feels less entertaining than before the expansion. Because the slowdown was already there. and we didn't really get cool stuff, we got an extra aoe, which we wouldn't have needed, the main aoe limiter was tp, in a large pull youd generally spam rock breaker, and most things would be dead.

skills to help with gl management, after they removed gl management tools. Bootshine buff, to replace 10% damage buff, that's probably the most interesting new mechanic

there's not enough synergy/interaction/combos in the class any more.

but everyone has their own vision of what the class needs

the job has a lack of in

The slowdown on Monk was one of the most frequent complaints in SB and they never did anything about it.

[Xieldras]

This has to be the dumbest thing I've read in awhile

1. They do have to worry about threat/enmity between tanks (tank swapping), then you have adds to worry about if a WHM goes HAM on healing. Plus they had to remove the ramp up time to get enmity cause dps are doing insane dmg now, we're at a stage in FF14 ARR where most classes have a few 850-1,110 potency abilities in their tool kit. The difference between a BLM (top dmg) and a Tanks dmg is almost 4.5k dps, we're not even into the first actual raid yet.

2. Oh LORD healers having to heal...like cry me a river you have to do your class role

3. Nin has always been bottom of the dmg, now you have DNC being the bottom. That's what happens when you get amazing buffs, you don't get amazing buffs and amazing dmg. Then if you look at the top 5 dmg, Mach and DRG are in the top 5 in both fights, it's a damn good time to be ether of those jobs.

4. They had to remove abilities to add new ones or else we would have insane ability bloat. Hell Gunbreaker is a new job and it's already suffering from ability bloat. This isn't WoW where you can have classes with 14 or less abilities on their hotbars. Gunbreaker alone w/o using macros needs 29. Even my Ast needs 30, then you have DNC which needs about 26, DRK needs 28 and you can go on and on. When you almost need 3.5 hotbars for abilities...THAT'S NOT GUTTING JOBS, that's getting rid of bloating abilities.

The only job that can 100% say they got shafted is AST, they are over 500 hps behind WHM, which SCH is only 110 ish hps behind WHM in healing. DRK, WAR, PLD, BLM, WHM, SCH, MCH, DRG, SAM are all amazing at their roles. With RDM, SMN, NIN, DNC being in the middle while everyone else is meh. MNK while being in the top 3 dps, it's in this limbo of meh but good at dps.

This has got to be the most uninformed post I've read in a while.

1. Enmity is a toggle now since tanks can hold on to it much easier. Before you had to kinda work as a team to make sure no one ripped enmity from the tanks (Diversion, Lucid, Tact/Refresh, etc). Proper cooperation could make runs smooth or hell. Now it's very single-player focused and, since it's easy to hold on to, you simply throw your shield or Flash 'em to gain their attention where it was a tad more complex before.

2. Oh Lord! Healers having to only heal is...boring! Since healing skills are very potent, and the damage output (based on some players' calculations) is still the very same across the board, Healers are bored since they have nothing to do in between heals. GCD overall feels sluggish if there's no proper weaving. FF14's encounter designs do not support well those gameplay changes, especially older content. It's not fun.

3. Not talking about DPS and meta standings, but rather the fact that DPS support has been removed from jobs to make them more about...DPS (like 2 certain classes mentioned). Variety is the spice of life and MMOs are about people working together to clear content, not doing their own thing coincidentally with others to clear content. There's a difference here.

4. Number of skills =/= difficulty. We're not talking button bloat here, we're talking jobs gameplays being made simpler. You've read on the AST debacle yes? Many are lamenting the simplicity of new cards and that the old system had more complex thought put into it. Although not for all, a few other threads have popped up saying the same thing: some jobs have been made too simple and generic.

(A hint: next time make sure to actually read or understand the arguments presented before calling the post "dumb")

[Eskuire]

Getting to the OP topic, probably because a few players are able to read between the lines and are starting to see this game is beginning to take the path of WoW. We aint there yet, but this is how a large lifespan MMO knows how it starts. It comes with an MMO making things "easier" for newer players to catch up, which at the same time, makes everything worse for the people already at the finish line. I'll use Bard as an example (since I have ~5/6 years of it under my belt)

BCoB : Bards were there to silence certain ADS mechanics, provide Foe Req for bosses, Sing songs for long drawn fights for Mana and TP - All is good, their toolkit complimented their craft.

HW : Bard gets a makeover and turns into a Bowmage with a castbar, changing the class completely. As the expansion went on and Alex savage dropped, people quickly learned that Song weaving was now a thing, instead of taking cast times for VB/WB, we would shut off Wanderer's apply dots / buffs, reapply, and go about business, entire previous toolkit remained (Minus some damage buffs)

SB : Gauges introduced, old toolkit remained, best the class has ever been, removal of certain damage buffs, but it is what it is, we didn't change from a class perspective addition of Refresh and Tactician was awesome.

SHB : Removal of all toolkits minus 2, now based solely on damage with minor buffs. Complete overhaul and a lack of identity from previous expansions

Spending 3 expansions building upon a class is the exact route WoW took (Pre-Cataclysm the 4th expac)before everything was dumbed down for newer players, a more vocal group of people who didn't understand that work appears. This led to class changes and an elitist attitude among people who had the mindset of "It's a stupid game now, if you can't learn this crap, get out." the continuing dumbing down of things led to a vicious toxic community that punishes newer players to the point where it is not fun. It creates a toxicity between someone like me, who has played a class for 6 years and learned every aspect of it and poured in hundreds of hours learning and wanting to be the best Bard I could be and then compare it to the person who JUST jumped in, put in next to zero work and expects the game to cater to him specifically just because he doesn't want to spend time learning something, using cross hotbars, keybinds, reading guides, learning rotations, or taking the same journey I took, and it creates a feeling of "Well, if he's new and you're listening to him, then why the hell am I giving you money for six years only to be shafted?"

This is exactly how this starts, hell I was there for it. Build upon, don't change foundations. Foundations is what got you to a 4th expansion, so you build on it. Changing it into a new shiny building when not asked is what removes veterans from being able to converse with someone new and explain the ins and outs of all classes. LIKE WHAT THE DAMN MENTOR SYSTEM SHOULD BE

/end rant