The DPS is not the Healer

[Arrius]

"You pull it, you tank it" is the last thing tanks usually say when I start a vote kick.

Good. Better leave such a group stew in the dungeon and have the tank get a instaqueue with a hopefully more competent party.
Saves him/her the trouble to leave and receive a deserter cooldown.

[Hash_Browns]

Good. Better leave such a group stew in the dungeon and have the tank get a instaqueue with a hopefully more competent party.
Saves him/her the trouble to leave and receive a deserter cooldown.

Currently, Healer is the "insta-queue". Not like I've ever had to wait long for a tank anyways.

[Arrius]

Currently, Healer is the "insta-queue". Not like I've ever had to wait long for a tank anyways.

As always with expansions. But once a few more weeks passed, it's all back to tank AIN's again.

[Hash_Browns]

As always with expansions. But once a few more weeks passed, it's all back to tank AIN's again.

I mean this is true. Personally speaking though, as I've explained before in other threads (before ShB release) - I would rather no tank, then a bad one.

I can do dungeon without a tank as long as people are overgeared, which is usually the case. I mained AST in SB, so I would rather not have to deal with tanks deciding not take aggro from me since if a DPS pulls, I would eventually get the aggro as the healer.

I'm more then happy to lose a bad tank, and wait for a decent one. Run speed doesn't matter, which was never the case. It was the principle.

I've also never had issues getting another tank into a run, and at worst would only have to wait a few minutes. Even if said tank got an insta-queue - that's not something I care about either. I just didn't want to deal with them.

[Bright-Flower]

Yeah when I tank the only person who's oppinion I'm interested is the healer. They're the one that has to work to keep me up. (Well, I manage cooldowns etc of course, but they're the ones healing me.)

If a DPS is adamant about not doing big pulls I guess they can 'veto' by not aoeing at all because when I notice dps that don't aoe I go back to single pulls.

As far as 'you pull it you tank it' goes, I'm usually doing big pulls anyway unless the healer does not want big pulls. If a dps is pulling extra when the healer doesn't want it, that's vote kick time.

I tend to be pretty flexible with pull speed. When you queue in with random people not all of them will want to speed run and do big pulls. Some people may be new to the duty, or their current job. They may be recently returned from a break. They may have net issues slowing them down. They may have anxiety issues. Or just not be very good. My stance is that if someone is in such a hurry that you're going to demand fast/big pulls and be angry or vote kick or pull for the tank if they don't do it, form a pre made and queue in. With randoms you need to be flexible.

[SturmChurro]

I'll tell you guys what I tell the dps/healer when I am the tank. "I don't do baby pulls". The only time I tone it back is when the healer seriously cannot actually handle the pulls, and that is entirely their fault since I have done them so many times. As I say it, "trial by fire". I'm going to pull big and YOU are going to adapt, they won't learn to do aoe unless they are forced to learn. Holding back just promotes this behavior. If I get kicked, I get kicked. I'll find a new group.

Healers most definitely NEED to be doing dps, especially when there are some dead weight dps that are being carried. I was progging Titania for a friend of mine last night, and if we didn't have the healers making up for the lack of dps from the melee we would most definitely NOT killed before enrage - and we didn't for several tries. Even if the DPS can pull their weight, the healers should still be doing DPS wherever possible to make the fight end faster. More mechanics means more chances for mistakes.

[SakiKojiro]

I've made some super questionable pulls because I knew our DPSes were good enough to finish them before My CD's ran out and we got horribly murdered.

The dpses are just as important to the equation.

[Chalbee]

I'll tell you guys what I tell the dps/healer when I am the tank. "I don't do baby pulls"....I'm going to pull big and YOU are going to adapt

Or, just spit-balling here, you could remember that the other three characters on the screen are also controlled by real people? The other three players aren't there to serve you, entitled swine. If you want to treat the other party members like NPCs, use the trust system.

[SturmChurro]

Or, just spit-balling here, you could remember that the other three characters on the screen are also controlled by real people? The other three players aren't there to serve you, entitled swine. If you want to treat the other party members like NPCs, use the trust system.

Never used the trust system once. Other players should be pulling their weight instead of wasting other people's time not utilizing their skill set. An aoe rotation by a dps is clicking different skills instead of single target. It is not asking for much.

Name calling is against the forum rules. You're lucky I do not report people.

[Chortle]

This topic always turns into an e-peen war between the casual players that dgaf and the tryhard speed runners who have precious time to save.

In the end, both viewpoints are valid. And so the cycle continues.