Musings on DNC and meta comps in ShB

[silentwindfr]

The stupid thing is that they've emphasizing single-target buffing yet there's still literally no way to tell how well your party is performing unless you run a parser, which is officially "not allowed".
Picking your partner is a complete shot in the dark unless you run third-party software.

That aside, it really all depends on how much DNC boosts things.
For all we know a Selfish DPS could do 1.3 damage, but DNC does 0.9. Compare this to a party of general DPS who all do 1.1 each. The numbers are the same, just distributed differently.

actually is true and false, we already know that a few jobs are here for only do massive dps, like blm and sam. for me i think the DNC will be the job that will support this sort of dps that have technically no buff and are only here for dish a tons of dps...
even mnk can become a monster, let see.... dnc with saber dance with a mnk as buffed allied... the damage that the monk will throws will not be small and i think that them goal.

right now the goal is to add buff over buff over buff... that why job like brd/drg/nin get place in raid while having far less potent dps than the high dps job... but we can't be sure without get the whole picture.
because it's important to remember that brd do loose the +2% crit on song, that the reduction of resistance is out too.... a lot of important buff will disappear, how it will be translate in the dps of the jobs that did loose some of this effect is something we don't know... maybe bard will get a far more potent dps.... who know.

Given what all a DNC can do I can wholeheartedly say they will have to be the lowest DPS in the game. That being said I do think they will be mandatory for parse runs to chase those oranges.

What gets me is that SE said they want to do away with preconceived mandatory classes and lower job synergy, but then release DNC???

Anywho just spit balling here but I think the new meta comp will be something along the lines of GUN/PLD/SCH/AST/DNC/some other 3 not sure yet.

for the DNC it will depend on which job you will choose as dance partner... saber dance add 30% of critical and dh.... what is cool but have a huge cd, some job will become monster with this buff, other less but still get strong.

it will depend of what the team have as dps, if they have a monk, samurai or black mage a dancer will become really strong for buff this one. the synergy between monk and dancer risk to be really high, since the dance partner can give ressource to the dnc allowing it to use better skill and dance.

then why the monk will be really good... because the monk will be the fastest attacking job of the game... means more attack = more ressource for the dnc...

all in all it will be like a group into the group. a duo that have for sole purpose to deal insane amount of dps... do it will be mandatory, not really actually. drg and nin still have potent buff and can be interesting as buffing jobs... but like i have said we lack the whole picture... all we can do is theorize on air since we have not the whole change that the job have get or the new skill....

[HyoMinPark]

actually is true and false, we already know that a few jobs are here for only do massive dps, like blm and sam.

Slight correction—BLM and SAM have high damage if they’re played properly. However, it’s fairly common to find players that do not play either of these jobs properly. Even still, players that don’t have access to third-party tools will still feed jobs they think are dealing high damage despite them being below the tanks in actuality.

That’s the point Lumadurin was making: there’s no way to actually know who is dealing what kind of damage in order to maximize a buff without turning to a tool that explicitly tells you. Just because a person is a BLM or a SAM doesn’t necessarily mean that they’re dealing the most damage and can maximize the buff’s potential.

[Crushnight]

My friends have been arguing who gets to be my partner in 5.0 XD and its all down to that crit DH buff, though while it is nice i would wait to see the full kit to see how much different buffs dnc can provide the more it offers the more likely it would be bottom on the pDPS totem poll, but since its a DPS i expect it to still remain above healers and tanks pDPS, so it has a good shot at farming/padding groups rather than clear/prog groups unless a fight is designed in a way for needing those buffs early on (because if they designed a fight where these buffs are mandatory that is bad fight design).

[silentwindfr]

Slight correction—BLM and SAM have high damage if they’re played properly. However, it’s fairly common to find players that do not play either of these jobs properly. Even still, players that don’t have access to third-party tools will still feed jobs they think are dealing high damage despite them being below the tanks in actuality.

That’s the point Lumadurin was making: there’s no way to actually know who is dealing what kind of damage in order to maximize a buff without turning to a tool that explicitly tells you. Just because a person is a BLM or a SAM doesn’t necessarily mean that they’re dealing the most damage and can maximize the buff’s potential.

going with: "yes but some people are bad with this jobs and jobs" work for every jobs around. we talk of synergie in terms of bonus get from by example saber dance. give +30% of critical and DH to the two potential higher dps is not something you can under estimate. however, i feel that the best choice for dance partner will be monk, ninja, sam. in this order, mostly because the ressource gain is based on weapon skill, it's seems. and they are the three fastest job around in terms of attack speed.

however, it will depend of the player skill, like always. a good synergie means nothing if the player are bad.... but it don't change the fact that the best possible will be this three. even if every dps will be good, but if you have one of this three it will be safer to expect to get a maximum dps from this partnership.

Do you have source for that? I haven't seen anything saying that.

was said while the live letter if i'm right.

[ForteNightshade]

going with: "yes but some people are bad with this jobs and jobs" work for every jobs around. we talk of synergie in terms of bonus get from by example saber dance. give +30% of critical and DH to the two potential higher dps is not something you can under estimate. however, i feel that the best choice for dance partner will be monk, ninja, sam. in this order, mostly because the ressource gain is based on weapon skill, it's seems. and they are the three fastest job around in terms of attack speed.

however, it will depend of the player skill, like always. a good synergie means nothing if the player are bad.... but it don't change the fact that the best possible will be this three. even if every dps will be good, but if you have one of this three it will be safer to expect to get a maximum dps from this partnership.

Except the whole point being made is you can only be aware of who's doing high damage by utilizing a third party program—one the devs don't want to actively promote or implement themselves. Even if we assume they are good, you want to use a buff during burst windows not just slap it on a Samurai and hope for the best. This also necessitates a parser at least for those theorycrafting how to optimize each job. Simply put, DNC keeps circling back to a job dependent on knowledge the game doesn't provide. Which is a tad silly.

Actually, if we applied DNC's buff to the current crop of jobs. BRD would be your runaway pick due to Crit scaling. This alone emphasises why you cannot just assume SAM/BLM are the best targets.

[silentwindfr]

Except the whole point being made is you can only be aware of who's doing high damage by utilizing a third party program—one the devs don't want to actively promote or implement themselves. Even if we assume they are good, you want to use a buff during burst windows not just slap it on a Samurai and hope for the best. This also necessitates a parser at least for those theorycrafting how to optimize each job. Simply put, DNC keeps circling back to a job dependent on knowledge the game doesn't provide. Which is a tad silly.

Actually, if we applied DNC's buff to the current crop of jobs. BRD would be your runaway pick due to Crit scaling. This alone emphasises why you cannot just assume SAM/BLM are the best targets.

even without third party tool you have a way to know who do most damage is called boss dummy near rahgr.... you can know by seeing the difference in timer for finish one. plus you don't need to do a lot of math for know which jobs have more damage potential.... plus the trouble with the dnc dance partner is it give ressource from the action of the partner, then technically a fast hitting job will be better. but in the end from what i did found out only one buff, one heal and one attack are from the dance. if the leak are true the attack is insane...

same from the leak the buff have a cd of 2 minutes... can be changed but is not something that will happend often, means you will choose one partner that have a decent dps and a fast hitting capacity for give a edge to the dancer more than the buff for the partner.

finally we know from the way the jobs are created that technically the two massive dps potential is the sam and blm, mostly because it's them role... but it don't means that other dps can't be dance partner, we are talking of potential, without test is impossible to know and even if the theory say something, if the skill of the player involved is not on par with the theory it will have not the result expected.