Il Mheg 1/2 of two mirrored zones?

[fay2]

Again, why does the official site only say we're travelling to Norvrandt? If we're travelling to parts of Dalmasca, why isn't that also mentioned? There has been zero mention of anything but the First, they have explicitly stated that is where we're going and made no indication of any Source side exploration.

They never mentioned going to Azys Lla in the fanfests for Heavenward 4 years ago, so to answer the "If we're travelling to parts of Dalmasca, why isn't that also mentioned?"
Maybe its a story relevant secret?

and also the way they show the Doma zones for Stormblood you be forgiven to think stormblood had more zones added in the east than the west. Despite getting 3 open zones in each region.


There are a few things that point to the Shadowbringers and 5.x story having us jump back and forth
◾Blackrose is a Source thing
◾The crafter content is set in Ishgard which is on the Source.

the way the leaders of the alliance are likely to act would point to point to more of Othard opening up 1st.

While the 1st Shard is in dire need of saving, someone has been managing to hold off the Light for the time being. The city is technically in a safe bubble at the moment.
Some of the the ideas I are had for people with power to stop it are Pixies (similar to fay2's idea), the rich Fat Kitties, the original Warriors of Darkness, the Crystal Tower (Allagan)?
What does everyone else think, any other contenders?

"the rich Fat Kitties" I think they problaby tried at the start but lost the will and have resigned them selves to it all being a lost cause now. They may have been the ones ordering the original Warriors of Darkness around back in the day. This would also explain Thancred's words about the city to "Midealyn"

"Midealyn" is high on the list

I don't really need to say what I think because its liking the work of Fae speakers, but I did lol

Stories involving Fae can have hole castles if not more move between realms
usually accompanied by a mist when its larger objects

the end part of
"The Orbonne Monastery"
on the 1st shard theory

After killing the Thunder God Fran mentions that it seemed to be holding the aether at bay.

I would hazard a guess Titania is likely doing the same if not better job of it especially if she was "summoned" for that purpose.

The other thing about that theory is it points to the ability to teleport between shards after attuning to aetherytes there.

[Nalien]

They never mentioned going to Azys Lla in the fanfests for Heavenward 4 years ago, so to answer the "If we're travelling to parts of Dalmasca, why isn't that also mentioned?"
Maybe its a story relevant secret?

They may not have mentioned it, but they definitely showed it... Pretty sure they mentioned it though, given I clearly remember them mentioning how they had to brush up on a lot of bioengineering terms when writing the lore for it...

It's in their Tour of the North trailer at the very least. I distinctly remember plenty of us speculating the Warring Triad coming off this shot.

As I recall, Heavensward was sold as; "Ishgard, Dravania, and the Sea of Clouds", with Azys Lla falling under the later. Stormblood was sold as; "Ala Mhigo and Far East", and that's all we got in terms of overworld zones. When Shadowbringers is being sold simply as "Norvandt on the First", why should we expect a secret Source zone? Best case, as with the Return to Ivalice raid series, YoRHa: Dark Apocalypse may take us to new regions on the Source, or some new Source area may be explored in the new version of Eureka.

Honestly, I'm not even sure if we'll be going back and forth between Source and First all that much... That kind of writing didn't work too well with Heavensward, and with Stormblood bringing in a lot of "Meanwhile... At the Legion of Doom" cutscenes, and the rise of Roleplay instances... I could see a lot of the Eorzean Alliance vs Garlemald story being covered in that method... For the Main Scenario at least, I suspect a fair few Job quests might actually involve the war on the Source and have us travelling back every 2 levels... Honestly I'd prefer all of 5.0s main story to be on the First, uninterrupted... I think it would have more dramatic effect for us to return to the Source after finishing our business there and then witness the effects of the war, rather than directly involving ourselves in the war or having constant cutaways to watch events unfold...

[fay2]

They may not have mentioned it, but they definitely showed it......

and that might be why this was shown

Honestly, I'm not even sure if we'll be going back and forth between Source and First all that much... That kind of writing didn't work too well with Heavensward, and with Stormblood bringing in a lot of "Meanwhile... At the Legion of Doom" cutscenes, and the rise of Roleplay instances... I could see a lot of the Eorzean Alliance vs Garlemald story being covered in that method... For the Main Scenario at least, I suspect a fair few Job quests might actually involve the war on the Source and have us travelling back every 2 levels... Honestly I'd prefer all of 5.0s main story to be on the First, uninterrupted... I think it would have more dramatic effect for us to return to the Source after finishing our business there and then witness the effects of the war, rather than directly involving ourselves in the war or having constant cutaways to watch events unfold...

We seem to be the only candidate at the moment that could coordinate anti-Ascian efforts between the source and the 1st shard at the moment. So from that stand point it seems less jarring and would give it reason jump back and forth.

They "normally" have the MSQ prong at the start at the start of an expansion. assuming to reduce load at the launch splitting the player base. Having both prongs done before starting the main adventure.

Also have split copies of the zones to reduce the zones player numbers they later remove . To reduce load at the launch on a zone.

They may have built these functions into the story this time.

One prong leads to the 1st and sets up the rules for shard hopping.
Lakeland and the Crystarium

The other? a covert mission the destroy the new Blackrose plant.
found in southern Othard version of the zone called "Amh Araeng" on the 1st

The rules for shard hopping is something they really need to do early on in the expansion as we are likely to do it a lot on more day to day play. dealing with retainers, jumping to an fc or house to stop demo , do other content like hunts , the cacpot/other mgp things, daily Grand Company turn ins, etc.

Then on to the main event on the 1st. still thinking there will be a mid point return to the source for reasons, then the events in the trailer play out and we return to the 1st.

I hope they have a curve ball in having us travel to the 13th to suck up some darkness and weaponize it against the light on the 1st.

[Cybylt]

and that might be why this was shown

That was a placeholder model for the aetheryte in that shot.

Q: Please tell us about the scale of the First world. How big are the areas compared to the Stormblood areas?

A: It won't be less game content than Stormblood. Perhaps a little bigger. The areas are fairly dense, and Norvrandt is comparable to the three states of Eorzea. To put it simply, Norvrandt is around the same size as what's called Eorzea in the Source, and everything else has been taken over by light, resulting in an empty, pure white space taking up the rest of the world. You'll be able to experience this in the areas as well. We showed a map called Amh Araeng in a previous keynote, which is where the light is being barely kept at bay. That area surrounds the Norvrandt region in a circle, and everything outside is whiteness with no elements.

[fay2]

I picked that quote because it seemed like the quickest summary of the fact that "only six worlds remain",

Those words alone too don't say the other 7 are truly gone too

an example
If you where to get a bakers dozen{that's 13} of jam filled donuts and take a bite out of 7 and suck the jam out of those 7, you would only have six jam filled donuts remaining.

The other donuts aren't gone, but they also are not hole jam filled donuts ether.

but other descriptions make it clear that they are not simply being 'ruined' but obliterated.

The lorebook describes it as "dimensional compression", and that the Ascians "work to topple the walls between dimensions, causing them to collapse in on themselves [to] regather the aether distributed amonst the thirteen mirrored planes and concentrate it back to the original".

(Though to be fair, this is presented as an in-story hypothesis by the Students of Baldesion and the Scions, with potential for new revelations to overwrite it - although I feel sure it has been explained elsewhere as well - maybe somewhere with the Ascians, maybe in the Warring Triad, but I don't know where to look for the quotes. Still, I don't think we've had any hints at the Rejoinings being anything other than that: the splintered dimension rejoined to the Source and ceasing to exist separately.)

Again Lyse known for her scholarly knowledge
i'd be warry of anything she says on fields of knowledge out side of politics and punching stuff without Papalymo around to correct her >_<

That was a placeholder model for the aetheryte in that shot.

The hole image is full of "placeholders"
the Wagon has a Othardian design
the Windmills are source design {also wonder if windmills would have wind is there is no day night cycle}

It makes you wonder if it is not been designed to be dropped in over 1st shard town to make a othardian zone using less dev time.

Q: Please tell us about the scale of the First world. How big are the areas compared to the Stormblood areas?.

the question was not is there any new zones added to the source? we know how the devils in the details

I will still hope that they will give us a few source zones too using a type of mirroring to save dev time, and give us more than the normal 6 "open world" zones. I for one would be ok with the idea of reusing digital assets of the overall open world zone with the towns place holders changed between the dimensions.

that's some thing they can continue to do in later patches/expansions
example




Hopefully give us a few harder open world zones to play with with mobs up to 85 as we gear up.

[Iscah]

https://img2.finalfantasyxiv.com/accimg2/10/56/1056bf5235ccec113603f258759b86ba239f55ad.jpg
Again Lyse known for her scholarly knowledge
i'd be warry of anything she says on fields of knowledge out side of politics and punching stuff without Papalymo around to correct her >_<

Are you trying to suggest that because Lyse said something about the six remaining worlds at one point, the entire lorebook theory is her idea?

Because that's definitely not how it works.

The Scions collectively have been researching this for some time now. This is knowledge based on what Urianger has been researching; what we've gathered directly from the Ascians' claims about their goals; what the other smarter Scions are working on while Lyse is off doing politics and punching stuff.

Lyse is going to know about their theory of how the Calamities and Rejoinings work, but that's because she's part of the group and they've explained it to her. It doesn't mean she had to be the one who came up with the idea.

The hole image is full of "placeholders"
the Wagon has a Othardian design
the Windmills are source design {also wonder if windmills would have wind is there is no day night cycle}

It makes you wonder if it is not been designed to be dropped in over 1st shard town to make a othardian zone using less dev time.

Do you mean they're using Othardian resources already in the game? Then I'd be more inclined to think they dropped their Othardian designs into this First-shard town. It would mean Ahm Areng is the less-dev-time second zone using those models.

Also, even if windmills are rendered useless by the Flood bringing weather to a halt, this was an existing, functioning town before that happened.

Mirror zone names

"Hells Sea"? Where are you even getting that from?

And this is far off beyond anything they've suggested or talked about.

And especially, if Rak'tika is on the First? It will not be the alternate Golmore Jungle, because alternate-Dalmasca has been obliterated in the flood of Light.


Their "resource-saving" work is already clear in things like the alternate-Limsa city recycling Lominsan and Ul'dahn architecture, perhaps others, instead of giving us something entirely new. There are other ways of recycling/repurposing things besides doing "mirror zones" of every new place.



Really though, I don't want to see a third set of dimensions. Already the First is taking us away from learning more about the places and cultures of Hydaelyn. We'll be learning about Ronso and Mystel when we could be finally finding out about Duskwights and Hellsguard. We're still (probably) not going to Thavnair or Sharlayan.

At least the First has been a long time coming in its setup.

[kidalutz]

Are you trying to suggest that because Lyse said something about the six remaining worlds at one point, the entire lorebook theory is her idea?

Because that's definitely not how it works.

The Scions collectively have been researching this for some time now. This is knowledge based on what Urianger has been researching; what we've gathered directly from the Ascians' claims about their goals; what the other smarter Scions are working on while Lyse is off doing politics and punching stuff.

Lyse is going to know about their theory of how the Calamities and Rejoinings work, but that's because she's part of the group and they've explained it to her. It doesn't mean she had to be the one who came up with the idea.





Do you mean they're using Othardian resources already in the game? Then I'd be more inclined to think they dropped their Othardian designs into this First-shard town. It would mean Ahm Areng is the less-dev-time second zone using those models.

Also, even if windmills are rendered useless by the Flood bringing weather to a halt, this was an existing, functioning town before that happened.





"Hells Sea"? Where are you even getting that from?

And this is far off beyond anything they've suggested or talked about.

And especially, if Rak'tika is on the First? It will not be the alternate Golmore Jungle, because alternate-Dalmasca has been obliterated in the flood of Light.


Their "resource-saving" work is already clear in things like the alternate-Limsa city recycling Lominsan and Ul'dahn architecture, perhaps others, instead of giving us something entirely new. There are other ways of recycling/repurposing things besides doing "mirror zones" of every new place.



Really though, I don't want to see a third set of dimensions. Already the First is taking us away from learning more about the places and cultures of Hydaelyn. We'll be learning about Ronso and Mystel when we could be finally finding out about Duskwights and Hellsguard. We're still (probably) not going to Thavnair or Sharlayan.

At least the First has been a long time coming in its setup.

Uh we were in Sharlayan Dravanian Hinterlands Idyllshire that entire set of ruins is the Sharlayan capitol.

[fay2]

Are you trying to suggest that because Lyse said something about the six remaining worlds at one point, the entire lorebook theory is her idea?.

Not at all
just pointing out the msq has been training us to see her view point as flawed in some small way in scholarly matters


While we are on that tho. If those scholars are stuck on the source what real knowledge do they have of the shards?

Do you mean they're using Othardian resources already in the game? Then I'd be more inclined to think they dropped their Othardian designs into this First-shard town. It would mean Ahm Areng is the less-dev-time second zone using those models.

Yup and you can get 2 zones for the time of close to one.

"Hells Sea"? Where are you even getting that from?

And this is far off beyond anything they've suggested or talked about.

yup and it achieved what I wanted your in the later part of your comment "when we could be finally finding out about Duskwights and Hellsguard."
I'd love to know more about them too, I hope others do too

And especially, if Rak'tika is on the First? It will not be the alternate Golmore Jungle, because alternate-Dalmasca has been obliterated in the flood of Light..

Yes I remember you viewed MSQ is 4D when is 5D
Now your seeing dimension hopping as 5D when its 6D
I'd guess you see the world in 3D but miss the fact its 4D
its framed in 3D but its not 3D

Their "resource-saving" work is already clear in things like the alternate-Limsa city recycling Lominsan and Ul'dahn architecture, perhaps others, instead of giving us something entirely new. There are other ways of recycling/repurposing things besides doing "mirror zones" of every new place..

yup frees up time. a good thing.

I'm not saying mirror everything too im saying that mirrioring a few zones when taking about dimensional divergence, I think people will except.

It seems to be true with the response they got from Eulmore.

From a narrative point of view you could have two and destroy one but still have one so the resource not wasted or limited.

Really though, I don't want to see a third set of dimensions. Already the First is taking us away from learning more about the places and cultures of Hydaelyn. We'll be learning about Ronso and Mystel when we could be finally finding out about Duskwights and Hellsguard. We're still (probably) not going to Thavnair or Sharlayan.

At least the First has been a long time coming in its setup.

You could say the knowing more about 13th shard has been longer time coming with World of Darkness and voidsent.

"cultures of Hydaelyn" Ronso and Mystel are cultures of Hydaelyn as the 1st is Hydaelyn too,
one of the 14 divergences yes but its still hydaelyn.



People are viewing this 5th dimensionally but the act of moving between the shards is 6th dimensional.
Diverging from the origan at the point of sundering sure these zone equal eorzea zones.


At the moment the 1st shards in permanent day.

In contrast the source the sun is rising at 6am everywhere on hydaelyn and then sets at the same time in the afternoon, so a night and day cycle is happening.
you could call it a flat earth because of that too >_<

That alone would indicate that their rotating at different rates so the land isn't just "out of phase" and aren't just in a 5d layer with one another they are out of sync in other ways too .
but sure its easier to understand that 5D way i understand that

[MrThinker]

We showed a map called Ahm Araeng in a previous keynote, which is where the light is being barely kept at bay. That area surrounds the Norvrandt region in a circle, and everything outside is whiteness with no elements.

They've said that what is currently left of the First is counterparts to the Eorzea region which rules out everything but a Gelmorran style area but that could simply be a portion of Rak'tika.

With what we've been told I suspect the zones to be counterparts to 2.0 regions and possibly how we technically get our ARR remade for flight without having to flip a bunch of zones and make things more difficult for new players.

So to make some guesses

Lakeland = Mor Dhona
Rak'tika = Black Shroud
Ahm Araeng = Thanalan
Kholusia = Vylbrand (specifically O'ghomoro)
Il Mheg = Coerthas Central Highlands

Some of those race guesses also ignore the possible existence of multiple clans on the First, for example duskwight counterparts called dark elves.

If Ahm Araeng surrounds Norvrandt in a circle, its hardly going to be JUST the Thanalan analogue right? Thanalan was only the southern part of Aldenard...

Alongside Pagl'tha, but no one talks about Pagl'tha.

[Apoptomon]

Cool theories here people!

If Ahm Araeng surrounds Norvrandt in a circle, its hardly going to be JUST the Thanalan analogue right? Thanalan was only the southern part of Aldenard...

I thought it was the 'crystal wave' thing that was the thing referred to as a circle around not!Eorzea, myself. Like maybe that was as far as the light-flood got before Hydfilia was able to hit 'pause'.