Revelations from Keynote II

[Claymore65]

I think the G'raha theory has some merit (though to be honest I'm not convinced by the pictures), I think it only really makes sense with a core assumption: either there is definitely Time Travel of some sort in the expansion, or the Crystal Tower opens up again due to some Calamity related Shenanigans (which to be fair, is perfectly possible). We definitely haven't reached the mythical "society is ready for the secrets of Allag" time in the setting, and in most stories "Sealed away until Civilization is Ready" is codeword for "Never".

That said, I still lean more heavily to Shard-based shenanigans of some sort, and the voice either being Arbert (our friend on the First Shard), or an entirely new character.

Just for Fun: Let's outline the evidence for Time Travel vs the case for Shard Travel. I'll be bringing up evidence of both happening in the plot, and where they've happened in the plot in the past.

Time Travel
Evidence of Time Travel in the Past

• During the Ending of 1.0, Lousioux sent the existing Warriors of Light to the future to survive the battle of Cartenaux and Bahamut's rage, though this is a little questionable
• There was one strange case of possibly symbolic Echo time travel where we gave Cid a pair of Goggles, though I think that was just to represent him getting his memories back.
• Time Travel is heavily featured in the Alexander Questline
• The Heavensward Hildibrand Questline introduces a user of Time Magic who can reverse age, though they never actually travel back in time per se, unless I remember incorrectly.
• Sharlayan Astrologers Technically use Time Related Magic to undo damage and heal wounds.

Evidence for Time Travel for the Expansion

• The Mysterious Voice's Message about "eon becoming instant" and "history being unwritten" can definitely be interpreted as Time Travel related (but isn't necessarily Time Travel related)
• Thancred's line about "this place having changed, and not for the better" can be interpreted as Time Travel related (but isn't necessarily Time Travel related)

Shard Travel
Evidence of Shard Travel in the Past

• At multiple points during ARR, they established the existence of other Shards
• ASCIANS
• More seriously, Ascians explicitly come from different Shards and are definitely capable of transferring between the Shards and the Source etc
• The Entirety of the Warriors of Darkness storyline is based on Shard Traveling Echo-Users
• Minfilia, a former major member of the Scions, traveled to the First Shard Specifically
• Unukalhai is another Shard Traveler now residing in the Source

One thing I'll note, most of the above examples were specifically part of the MSQ.

Evidence For Shard Travel in the near future

• The most Recent Patch re-establishes the existence of other Shards, reminding people who might have forgotten not once, but twice (once when Solus explains the Ascian Hierarchy, and again during Varis' "become one race" speech
• Minfilia was recently revealed to be playing a role in the expansion, a character who explicitly was on the First Shard. At bare minimum, she needs to come back to the Source and then we can have time travel shenanigans.
• Solus, someone clearly established as a major villain is going to the First to experiment with the Black Rose etc
• During the chat with Krile and Matoya, they established that the souls "aren't in this world", which could imply travel to another shard (but I'll admit this could also imply time travel).

As far as very subjective evidence, I think the voice sounds a lot like Arbert, but that might just be me and is dependent on localization etc.

[Ceridwenae]

*you made me wonder some stuff!*

I'm just wondering if you or someone else can answer this for me: do we have anything to confirm either way that the other shards are similar to each other, or even copies of each other?

Also, has it been noted anywhere if a soul can potentially manifest itself in a new corporeal form if the original form is unavailable?

[Kalise]

Also, has it been noted anywhere if a soul can potentially manifest itself in a new corporeal form if the original form is unavailable?

Uhh... Maybe Y'shtola? After going into the lifestream, when we (Well... The Elementals) brought her back there was no corporeal form there to house her soul. Which suggests one was created as she was pulled from the lifestream, albeit imperfectly (Due to the blindness and what not)

do we have anything to confirm either way that the other shards are similar to each other, or even copies of each other?

I'm not sure about any hard evidence to this. But there are some implied similarities. Such as the fact that they're all Shards from the same Source which would suggest that they're be similar. Much as if you break apart a biscuit, all the crumbs will be similar because they have the same origin.

There's also some other aspects, such as how Arbert and the Ascians seem to speak the same language as Eorzeans, with the same accent (Or at least, no-one really seems to notice that they're from anywhere other than Eorzea). Which, given how etymology works, suggests similar origins in terms of development of life because different climates and different ways of life impact vocabulary (I.e. Eskimo's IRL have many different words for "Snow" because they need to distinguish beyond just "Snow" due to where they live)

[Anonymoose]

I'm just wondering if you or someone else can answer this for me: do we have anything to confirm either way that the other shards are similar to each other, or even copies of each other?

What we have confirmed so far is that they were identical copies at the moment of the great sundering, but have been on very different - but simultaneous - paths ever since. Theoretically, the different balances of Light/Dark, the Source getting rocked by 7 Calamities, and the butterfly effect should ensure the worlds have little in common by today. (Theoretically.) The First was shown to be different in the way Arbert and Co. had similar, but different, job titles and abilities. (Their names and gear were borrowed from Eorzeans so they'd blend in, though.)

Also, has it been noted anywhere if a soul can potentially manifest itself in a new corporeal form if the original form is unavailable?

As far as we've seen proof for? If the soul has the Echo and can transcend the flesh and death, they could force themselves into another living person's body, extinguish them, and warp their body to look like their old one. But that seems like a terrible thing to do. If you had clones of yourself it ought to be pretty easy. (Solus - perhaps actually Emet-selch, perhaps not - actually thanks Varis for conjuring up all those clones and saving him the trouble of warping other bodies to look like him.) If you had a powerful technologist like Amon or Aulus maybe you wouldn't need the Echo? Maybe? And then there's whatever the Warriors of Darkness / Unukalhai are doing, I guess. They all died and then showed here with physical forms. That was ... just never addressed.

Uhh... Maybe Y'shtola? After going into the lifestream, when we (Well... The Elementals) brought her back there was no corporeal form there to house her soul. Which suggests one was created as she was pulled from the lifestream, albeit imperfectly (Due to the blindness and what not)

I think Y'shtola just used a risky teleport spell and got "stuck", no? Her body/soul should still have been entwined, even in aetherial form. I think it's being awash in the great torrent that is the Lifestream for too long is what damaged her.

[Kalise]

I think Y'shtola just used a risky teleport spell and got "stuck", no? Her body/soul should still have been entwined, even in aetherial form. I think it's being awash in the great torrent that is the Lifestream for too long is what damaged her.

Not quite.

The "Risky" teleport spell WAS in fact meant to take her into the lifestream.

With the risky part being, it's not at all certain that you will actually get out again and, if unable to get out soon enough, your soul will just lose all traces and be part of the lifestream (I.e. Dead in the same manner that everyone (Eventually) dies and returns to the lifestream)

Though, there's not really much information about what happens to the physical body during this spell. Given that all the times where we see someone's soul separate from their body when they die (ALC quests for example) it does suggest that the body is left behind.

While with Y'shtola's (Forbidden) spell there was no trace of her at all at the scene, no body or anything aside from her Aethereal Trail.

So it's hard to say if she has a new body or the same one. Since, as far as I can recall, there's no other mentions of someone being able to enter the lifestream with their body. Ascians might have entered it but they give up their mortal bodies and then have to possess new ones. Even the story in Tam-Tara Deepcroft (Hard) is about creating a new body for her fiance because all she had was his head (Also, who tf just leaves a friend alone with their fiance's HEAD after he just died?) and his soul was in the lifestream.

There's certainly a possibility that she was able to bring her body into the lifestream and then it was pulled out with damage thanks to the brutal torrent of it. But at the same time, it's also equally possible that the spell would break the body down into pure aether in order to power a spell of such magnitude of forcibly shunting the soul into the lifestream along with an excess of aether to create a new body upon leaving.

It kind of surmounts to that whole Sci-Fi teleportation trope I guess. Wherein you have teleportation such as that from say, Charlie and the Chocolate Factory, where Mike Teavee's body is broken down into tiny pieces and then sent to the receiver and put back together. While on the flip side you have Star Trek where your body is broken down completely and a brand new one is replicated at the receiver.

Which one it is, it's hard to say with such limited information about the spell and the events when it was cast.

[Iscah]

Not quite.

The "Risky" teleport spell WAS in fact meant to take her into the lifestream.

With the risky part being, it's not at all certain that you will actually get out again and, if unable to get out soon enough, your soul will just lose all traces and be part of the lifestream (I.e. Dead in the same manner that everyone (Eventually) dies and returns to the lifestream)

Though, there's not really much information about what happens to the physical body during this spell. [Whether it is transported or built anew] it's hard to say with such limited information about the spell and the events when it was cast.

I don't think the information is that limited, and it points to the body being 'carried' in aetherial form. Urianger explains it to us when he first works out that Y'shtola must have used the spell to escape.

URIANGER
The very first that man did conceive to traverse great distances, and the ancient precursor to all methods of travel that utilize the Lifestream: Flow.
The spell entaileth the reduction of the corporeal form into its constituent aether, that the caster might enter the Lifestream, and ride its currents thereby. Unlike the teleportation magicks of modern times, it requireth not a lengthy incantation. That Y'shtola should choose to employ such a spell bespeaketh the need for haste.
[But] know that the scholars of Sharlayan forbade the use of this spell─and with good reason.
The caster hath but limited control over his course. For every mage who came safe unto his destination, another would be set adrift in the Lifestream, never to emerge.

And for Y'shtola's own remarks on the experience...

Y'SHTOLA
A long soak in the Lifestream followed by a long journey... I would not recommend it to anyone.
But rest assured my strength is returning to me. I shall be back to my former self ere long.

Y'SHTOLA
One does not simply “drift” in the Lifestream; it is a constant struggle to hold on to your very essence. The experience has hardened me in ways I can ill explain.

[Ceridwenae]

What we have confirmed so far is that they were identical copies at the moment of the great sundering, but have been on very different - but simultaneous - paths ever since. Theoretically, the different balances of Light/Dark, the Source getting rocked by 7 Calamities, and the butterfly effect should ensure the worlds have little in common by today. (Theoretically.) The First was shown to be different in the way Arbert and Co. had similar, but different, job titles and abilities. (Their names and gear were borrowed from Eorzeans so they'd blend in, though.)

If they were identical copies could it follow that locations are, to some extent, similar, even if they've been somewhat altered in some way as a result of those calamities (as in, somewhere is still identifiable as City X but that wall over there is in a different place)?

[ObsidianFire]

If they were identical copies could it follow that locations are, to some extent, similar, even if they've been somewhat altered in some way as a result of those calamities (as in, somewhere is still identifiable as City X but that wall over there is in a different place)?

I'd say probably not. Calamities are more then just... an earth-quake. We're not talking, "cities are laid out differently" kind of differences. We're talking "continents are in different places with different climates" differences.

This is especially true of the first several umbral Calamties. The 1st Calamity was so long ago that no one knows what the world was like before it. Just that it was a total "system reset" of society and politics. And to make matters even more interesting, no one apparently knew about magic back then.
The 2nd Calamity was a year long volcanic eruption that blotted out the sky with smoke and ash and lightning. Mankind fled into caves to wait for the skys to clear. They called on the Twelve which lead to them discovering magic at this time. And again, there's a "system reset" of society.
The 3rd Calamity was when the sun grew huge and dried out the world. Crops failed for years and many lush green areas became wastelands. It's currently thought this is when the region of Thanalan became like it is today.
The 4th Calamity wasn't a natural disaster so much as it was a societal one. The power generator of the Allagan Empire was broken by a gigantic earthquake and the Allagan capital was swallowed up by the earth. This lead to the collapse of the Allagan Empire and another "system reset" for society.
The 5th Calamity was essentially an ice age. Glaciers covered much of the land and icebergs were common place. This probably was even worse in Ilsabard as it's further north then Eorzea is.

So the Source has had all this stuff happen to it, while the Shards probably have not. If anything, the Shards probably don't have the "system resets" the Source does when it comes to culture, so they probably have a more modernized lifestyle. Their land probably hasn't been through anywhere near the abuse the Source has either. Or if it has, it's probably on a much more localized scale and they probably didn't get hit with all of these.

[Ceridwenae]

Just for Fun: Let's outline the evidence for Time Travel vs the case for Shard Travel.

Time Travel
Evidence of Time Travel in the Past

• Thancred's line about "this place having changed, and not for the better" can be interpreted as Time Travel related

That last one is what poked my last couple of questions. The answers made me lean toward time travel more definitely.

One thing I'll note, most of the above examples were specifically part of the MSQ.

Yeah, this is what's truly important. I almost don't fuss over the hows and whys as long as everyone playing has a good chance to follow them. I want equality in the MSQ for all!

Evidence For Shard Travel in the near future

• During the chat with Krile and Matoya, they established that the souls "aren't in this world", which could imply travel to another shard (but I'll admit this could also imply time travel).

As of this point, I'm saying it's both. Both will happen! We will time travel to a different shard, probably a currently broken one but before it's broken, fix it so it doesn't break, replace the balance over everything, go forward twice over for reasons, and then go back home and win. Somehow, and not necessarily in that order. It's all parts of Back to the Future. Let's hope people we know don't start to disappear. Also, just how linear does this game treat time travel? How much does time travel actually screw with things? Is it even wise to do it? Just because we can does it mean we should? I'm looking forward to any philosophical debate on it (in or out of game).