Gender locked race?

[Rokke]

But we're probably gonna get a male-only race that nobody really asked for.

tbh this is the main reason I think we're getting Viera men. As a gamer himself, I cannot believe that Yoshi would not forsee the potential shitstorm of pairing an incredibly popular request with something absolutely no one asked for without any hype buildup for said thing no one asked for.

[KaijinRhada]

tbh this is the main reason I think we're getting Viera men. As a gamer himself, I cannot believe that Yoshi would not forsee the potential shitstorm of pairing an incredibly popular request with something absolutely no one asked for without any hype buildup for said thing no one asked for.

Yeah, this is one of the big things about gender-locking choices. Evidence of storms being kicked up over gender-locks are aplenty. The following quote from a different thread about male Viera (for those that haven't seen it) sums it up nicely:

I'm also on team, "I can't help but suspect Yoshi-P is just trolling."

He has to know how poorly player character limitations go over in this fandom. He also knows how long ago he first teased Viera as a possibility and how many people wanted to be males. That door was never closed, despite his skepticism. He made a bigger deal about trying to get the feet right. And then why wouldn't they have closed the door gently and tightly today? I can't shake this itch that he's watching all these salty tears with schadenfreude knowing he's going to get a massive crowd pop when he shows up in Tokyo like, "Nah, I'm messing with you, roll the tape!" lol.

Bolded for emphasis. But it would be astonishing for anyone to be surprised that people don't like less choices, in this game especially where character appearances and customization holds such esteem

[Rokke]

The following quote from a different thread about male Viera (for those that haven't seen it) sums it up nicely:

moose speak

it is reassuring to have Moose in your corner ;w;

[stormygabe]

tbh this is the main reason I think we're getting Viera men. As a gamer himself, I cannot believe that Yoshi would not forsee the potential shitstorm of pairing an incredibly popular request with something absolutely no one asked for without any hype buildup for said thing no one asked for.

So I LOVE how pro-viera/optimistic you seem to be. If we DON'T get male buns, I hope there's enough of a backlash to make them add them anyway. If we do, I hope they look nice. (aka Not the big bara buff burly insert-B-word-here that some want) At the same time, I can't help but remain apprehensive. There are so many great points both for them being added and omitted. I'm hoping your optimism somehow manifests into really cool looking rabbit wood elves.

[Rokke]

So no bullshit, I LOVE how pro-viera/optimistic you seem to be. If we DON'T get male buns, I hope there's enough of a backlash to make them add them anyway. If we do, I hope they look nice. (aka Not the big bara buff burly insert-B-word-here that some want) At the same time, I can't help but remain apprehensive. There are so many great points both for them being added and omitted. I'm hoping your optimism somehow manifests into really cool looking rabbit wood elves.

To me its less about being optimistic and more the glaring lack of an alternative: Theres nothing pointing to a catlike race pre JP fanfest. Its not even just a lack of a t-shirt, theres absolutely zero hints in game and zero hints in the lorebook. Zip. Zilch. Nada.

I'm sure he has weighed the blowback it could cause and if he's prepared to take it he will. He's shown he's not afraid to do something that would for sure ruffle a lot of feathers when he released Blue Mage as a limited job which was a bigger risk than a potential unique to ffxiv male only race.

BLU being limited was cushioned by BLU being released pre-expac vs being a selling feature of the expac. It was also revealed to be limited then and there, instead of waiting till patchnotes to deal with the fallout.

As for no hype or build up? When he stated he doesn't always want to give out hints and wants to keep some things a surprise just last week during interviews? He specifically said he didn't want to go into each fanfest with people knowing everything that's coming. Announcing a separate unique race without having a breadcrumb trail of hints would be exactly such a thing.

He also specifically said his tshirt choices are complete happenstance and never had anything to do with announcements in that same exact press session lol

The manbunny outfit came to be becuase a niche group of people locked their legs and would. not. stop. bugging. A playable race reaches far more than ppl wanting a gold saucer set. To say PAX Q&A's would have a new staple demand would be an understatement.

[Shippuu]

To me its less about being optimistic and more the glaring lack of an alternative: Theres nothing pointing to a catlike race pre JP fanfest. Its not even just a lack of a t-shirt, theres absolutely zero hints in game and zero hints in the lorebook. Zip. Zilch. Nada.

There's zero hints to the vast majority of things added in expansions. Where's the rule that everything has to have some hint to being added? Where was the hint of the Vath, Vanu Vanu, Kojin, Ananta, Namazu, Nu Mou, Pixies, Dwarves? These are all new races added to the game out of no-where with zero hints or clues leading up to them until they were straight up announced (in before they're somehow different because they're beast tribes).

Au Ra were implemented with a complete lack of lore and a complete lack of actual integration. All we had for them was that Yugiri was one and they were from the Far East (and a small mention in the Wind-Up Odin flavor text), and Sidurgu was from a group that came to Eorzea and got wiped out by Ishgardians. The majority of Au Ra lore for Heavensward came from Koji's naming convention post on the forums. We didn't get any kind of actual integration for Au Ra until the expansion AFTER Heavensward. A new unannounced race could be no different. We come across stuff all the time that hadn't existed to us before but the setting acts like they've been around the whole time.

BLU being limited was cushioned by BLU being released pre-expac vs being a selling feature of the expac. It was also revealed to be limited then and there, instead of waiting till patchnotes to deal with the fallout.

And the announcement of a new race and that Viera+new race are genderlocked won't be addressed when it's announced? It couldn't possibly be why Yoshida is refusing to comment on if male viera are confirmed? That they have plans to go into more detail when they reveal something else?

He also specifically said his tshirt choices are complete happenstance and never had anything to do with announcements in that same exact press session lol

He's always joked that the shirts don't mean anything and we know it's a joke, it's obvious. That doesn't somehow invalidate that he said he wants there to be more surprises and he doesn't want to give hints away for everything coming.

The manbunny outfit came to be becuase a niche group of people locked their legs and would. not. stop. bugging. A playable race reaches far more than ppl wanting a gold saucer set. To say PAX Q&A's would have a new staple demand would be an understatement.

It took a considerable time (years) to finally get the male bunny outfit put into the game, and it's rarely used. If anything that's a knock against it that despite people being vocal about it, doesn't mean it's something a majority of players want. And considering the majority of the time the Q&A's have their questions pre-screened, it's easy for him avoid having to deal with that question outside of direct interviews. And again, Blue Mage is going to be the same situation. He knows how to handle Q&A's and interviews, he's shown he's quite skilled and avoiding answering things or explaining his reasoning even if it's unpopular.

[Crushnight]

There's zero hints to the vast majority of things added in expansions. Where's the rule that everything has to have some hint to being added? Where was the hint of the Vath, Vanu Vanu, Kojin, Ananta, Namazu, Nu Mou, Pixies, Dwarves? These are all new races added to the game out of no-where with zero hints or clues leading up to them until they were straight up announced (in before they're somehow different because they're beast tribes).

Au Ra were implemented with a complete lack of lore and a complete lack of actual integration. All we had for them was that Yugiri was one and they were from the Far East (and a small mention in the Wind-Up Odin flavor text), and Sidurgu was from a group that came to Eorzea and got wiped out by Ishgardians. The majority of Au Ra lore for Heavensward came from Koji's naming convention post on the forums. We didn't get any kind of actual integration for Au Ra until the expansion AFTER Heavensward. A new unannounced race could be no different. We come across stuff all the time that hadn't existed to us before but the setting acts like they've been around the whole time.

This is what we get on beast tribes(before expansion):

1. Name
2. A sentence on their nature ie pixies are mischievous but not as bad as moogles
3. Their primal Deity if they have one
4. Area they live in
5. Use preexisting lore like lamias for ananta

This is what we get with a new playable race(before expansion):

1. An npc in game to represent/reveal in the last main patch of the current expansion
2. Clan info
3. gender info
4. their society structure
5. Where they come from

Both are handled differently and are treated differently by SE themselves if we were to get an unknown race we would get a surge of information on them at Tokyo on top of more Viera information. By this point we had more information on Au Ra but Viera are going to be better implemented with how they have set them up something i feel SE learned from Au Ra implementation being oh there here neat. So i then gotta ask why would SE repeat the Au Ra mistake while simultaneously also avoiding it its weird :s

[Shippuu]

This is what we get with a new playable race(before expansion):

1. An npc in game to represent/reveal in the last main patch of the current expansion
2. Clan info
3. gender info
4. their society structure
5. Where they come from

Both are handled differently and are treated differently by SE themselves if we were to get an unknown race we would get a surge of information on them at Tokyo on top of more Viera information. By this point we had more information on Au Ra but Viera are going to be better implemented with how they have set them up something i feel SE learned from Au Ra implementation being oh there here neat. So i then gotta ask why would SE repeat the Au Ra mistake while simultaneously also avoiding it its weird :s

So of this list, there would potentially be only 1 thing on the list that we wouldn't get for the new Race (if there is one), and that's that there was no in game NPC hinting/representing this race. (Which we can't even say for certain considering we haven't had all the patch story delivered to us).

Au Ra's poor implementation was less to do with groundwork set up before they arrived, and more to do with zero impact, relevancy, or even appearing in the entire Heavensward story/areas outside of a total of about 3-4 NPC's. A new race could be more important to the 5.0 story and it would be the same as "learning from the implementation of Au Ra". We could be going to wherever this new race is from, which would immediately put it on being better implemented than the Au Ra was in Heavensward.
Even then, Au Ra was implemented poorly, but it didn't do anything to really negatively affect the game. So even if they did the exact same thing, it's not like it's even really an issue in the first place? It's certainly not a big enough issue to even consider not doing it because of that.

Ah, one thing I will tackle is the whole Yoshida's vision - I don't think that's rightfully true. I think that the fact that Matsuno Yasumi is now working on this expansion with him that he has a lot of ways as well, especially as the creator of the Viera and of course, the developer of FF12 and tactics.

That's a pretty big assumption there unless you have proof? Matsuno worked in collaboration for the Ivalice raid series, we have little pointing to him being further involved in the development of the expansion (and considering they're bringing in new guest creators for the next raid, he's likely not helping).
But if they stated he is working as a new position on the expansion and I missed it, I'd love to see.

[Gwenorai]

-snip-

Aye, this was from hearsay - I can't find anything but the Livestream where they're talking about the 24man. So, you're right - but I still think there's still a point there. That if Matsuno wrote the lore, then Matsuno also has a say on what happens to his creations and also has to go through him. Unless you think Yoshida can simply go around his vision? I'm not stating you said this, I'm genuinely curious on your take on the matter regarding this.

[Rokke]

There's zero hints to the vast majority of things added in expansions. Where's the rule that everything has to have some hint to being added? Where was the hint of the Vath, Vanu Vanu, Kojin, Ananta, Namazu, Nu Mou, Pixies, Dwarves? These are all new races added to the game out of no-where with zero hints or clues leading up to them until they were straight up announced (in before they're somehow different because they're beast tribes).

Au Ra were implemented with a complete lack of lore and a complete lack of actual integration. All we had for them was that Yugiri was one and they were from the Far East (and a small mention in the Wind-Up Odin flavor text), and Sidurgu was from a group that came to Eorzea and got wiped out by Ishgardians. The majority of Au Ra lore for Heavensward came from Koji's naming convention post on the forums. We didn't get any kind of actual integration for Au Ra until the expansion AFTER Heavensward. A new unannounced race could be no different. We come across stuff all the time that hadn't existed to us before but the setting acts like they've been around the whole time.

Comparing beast tribes to playable races is a stretch. With Yugiri’s intro we were shown there is a race with a strange tail + horns/ears, that had a face unique enough where it might offput people who’d never seen it, that was from the Far East- a place that had lost badly in a recent skirmish with Garlemald. While we definitely didn’t know the various intricacies of all 51 tribes of Xaela, we did have a starting point. Then Au Ra were confirmed and we got to see what Yugiri might look like under her mask through the reveal art work. Then at a later fanfest we got to see in the game character creation screen, the subrace, the 3D models, the 3D models wandering Ishgard, etc.

Au Ra did not suddenly come into existence at the moment of their reveal.

And the announcement of a new race and that Viera+new race are genderlocked won't be addressed when it's announced? It couldn't possibly be why Yoshida is refusing to comment on if male viera are confirmed? That they have plans to go into more detail when they reveal something else?

Of course theres a possibility of something else. I just don't think it will play out with a something else, hence my comments in this thread.

It took a considerable time (years) to finally get the male bunny outfit put into the game, and it's rarely used. If anything that's a knock against it that despite people being vocal about it, doesn't mean it's something a majority of players want. And considering the majority of the time the Q&A's have their questions pre-screened, it's easy for him avoid having to deal with that question outside of direct interviews. And again, Blue Mage is going to be the same situation. He knows how to handle Q&A's and interviews, he's shown he's quite skilled and avoiding answering things or explaining his reasoning even if it's unpopular.

And after years of attempting to dodge the question we got the confirmation of bunny suits being in the works and then a few more years of being dogged about it's progress and they were revealed at the same con they were originally asked for.

In person requests started in the west and continued until JP and even Korea joined in. Prescreened questions are a thing, yes, but unless they plan only taking written in questions from this point on, its inevitable for a comment to slip through.

he was "prescreened" as well, after all.