Blue Mage: Are you kidding me!?

[Huntrss]

And? There could still be all BLU parties if it were a standard job that could fulfill multiple rolls.

They do not want that (your still thinking SMN \SCH).

[jon041065]

They do not want that (your still thinking SMN \SCH).

I'm not thinking of it being the same as SMN and SCH. This is what I said a couple of posts ago.

On the multi-role stuff, I think having it be where hybrid set ups are possible would be a bad idea and a massive balancing challenge like you said. I would rather see stances or different job stones to have them be their own thing or a talent/spell selection system that takes a large commitment into one role before you can do some content. Then there be a significant cost to redo these choices such as using a reset item that costs a large amount of the uncapped tomes.

IF this happened, the name Blue Mage would be shared and same with spell animations. Some blue spells could probably have the same function no matter what role you would be playing as. For the most part, they would be their own individual job. Be like how melee and caster dps have access to Diversion.

What they have wanted doesn't always work out and/or doesn't match up to what plenty of their players want.

[Starcake28]

Umm i saw the video thy only showed mighty guard but i till believe blue mage will never be a tank so GL with tht without breaking the game

[jon041065]

Umm i saw the video thy only showed mighty guard but i till believe blue mage will never be a tank so GL with tht without breaking the game

Yep, we still don't know a lot about BLU because we don't know all the spells yet and if BLU gets traits from the spells or just doesn't have traits period.

You do realize that you sound like the people saying that BLU can't be a full job when you say things like that right? If BLU being a tank or healer would break the game then it will also break the game as a dps.

[Aniond]

FFXIV is an MMORPG. So why is BLU being restricted from joining mainstream content and pushed as "solo-content" orientated? If I wanted to play an extensive solo-player experience with collecting blue magic, the previous offline titles exist for that purpose.

"BLU has to have certain skills, and it'd be no fun if they didn't work against raid bosses!"

You know what's even less fun? Not being able to participate in said raids to begin with. It isn't worth having those skills if those skills are the reason we are being "limited." No one in their right mind had the expectation that we needed lvl5 death, and that we had to make it work on the latest raid bosses.

"But if BLU is accepted and doesn't have the skills they're expected to have, they'll be kicked "

Is it so hard to implement a requirement for number of skills BLU must have in order to enter an instance? A rebuttal to this suggestion would entail that perhaps a certain BLU might only have buff/support spells, and not enough DPS skills. To that I say "classify spells for their function and specify a number of DPS-oriented spells needed to enter roulette."

People who care enough to go into Savage are the same ones who will care enough to get their "core skills" to perform correctly. Why are we killing the opportunity for your consumer base in order to appease a strawman argument of a bad player?

People wanted BLU in this game. People, like myself, would have been more than happy with simple job quests making us go on some silly hunt to "learn" skills if it meant being streamlined into the general population.

I can even accept grinding in the overworld like we're in some cheap pay-to-win Korean MMO, I can even accept being forced to learn skills on an RNG basis and hunting monsters for them, but allow us the option to play with everyone else in the content everyone is doing! Because after all, this is not a solo game-- This is an MMORPG.

SE, I implore you to reconsider.

SquareEnix has said multiple times before. FFXIv is a Final Fantasy game first then an MMO. Meaning, that they will not deviant or break what the series.

[Ceallach]

I didn't ask the developers to make a job I couldn't use in the only content that keeps me playing.

The community as a whole did ask for blue mage. We were told that it would have to be implemented in a way like it is. We kept asking for it anyway. And now somehow people are mad that it's a limited job? Perhaps you didn't personally ask for it, but the players at large did, and I think what's really disingenuous is the fact people are disappointed with how it's being implemented.

Thread started to get to a positive place and then boom! More toxicity.

See above. Also, you have not yet seen actual toxicity from me. You have seen sarcasm, but believe me, I can be far worse. Be thankful I actually have a moral compass, hm?

We don't know how the level 5 death spell will work for sure yet as we haven't seen the tooltip for it. It could be a sure thing, a flat chance, or a scaling chance as the HP of the target drops. Bosses could be immune to it also despite what they said during Fan Fest. They have the feedback since then and will get more before they raise blu's level cap to 60 which is when they said you can learn that spell. Also, they did show us the Bad Breath spell and at least some of it will work on bosses. Didn't realize that blu wouldn't be useful and couldn't be fun unless Bad Breath works on everything.

It's fallacious to point out a problem with a single example and base one's entire argument on it.

How is possibility one a problem? If someone doesn't want to take blu through a dungeon because they can't learn a spell that's their choice. Some will want to run the dungeon as blu regardless because they find the job fun. Choices are a good thing. The second possibility might not even be possible. The potency of the blue spells we have seen now is on the low side but blu's damage will not scale with their weapon but be based off the rest of their equipment. So right now we can't say for sure if these spells will be weak or not in practice just that the potency is low.

The question here is, "Why do you take a blue mage with you and/or be a blue mage in any given content?" I don't really have a problem with this response, but I think you misunderstood the point of view in asking the question.

First thing here doesn't make sense to me. Why would they have to make a group in party finder to avoid getting blue mages when blue mages won't be able to queue for matchmaking in the first place? If you are trying to say that some people will make groups and exclude blue mages then that's their choice. Got enough hyperbole in that second statement? They said that each spell will have a learn chance tuned for that spell. Some will be very rare and some will have a 30% chance as they have announced. Some could have a higher chance to learn.

Because if you're just going to clear something by spamming Level 5 Death, it's not fun. There's be no point in learning mechanics at all, because the entire raid wouldn't even last five minutes. Sure, this assumes we get Level 5 Death and it'd work on bosses, but the point stands that the blue mage would need to contribute something meaningful in the role cast for him or her.

If you like playing solo that's your choice. Some of us like to focus on group content and others like a mix of both. The game should have various types of content but I'm firmly in the camp of "jobs should be for everyone" and then you can your job of choice into the content of your choice. Finally, not everyone asked for content like this and I would say it's not being disrespectful to believe that the devs can do content like this and full jobs.

You say that, but not every job is for everyone. For example, I play dragoon, and just from my frustration of having to deal with four positionals, I can guarantee you monk isn't for me. Just because it's different does not mean it's less worthy of being called what it is: a job.

Yeah, the issue is false dichotomies are a very disingenuous and fallacious argument tactic. Good job.

Let me know when you're done with ad hominems.

As for your level 5 death take it with you because blue mage Don't need it again i'm going to point at FF11 but i'm not saying make blue mage like FF11 system but fighting style H*** YA also if you from WoW and never really played FF11 Blue mage full-time tht mean got all spells shhh plz

I played FINAL FANTASY XI, and the fact the blue mage could learn nearly two hundred spells and do literally anything alone was ridiculous. It works basically the same way here from what we've seen, but as a limited job, the blue mage won't throw off job balance, so I'm all for it.

[Kabooa]

The community as a whole did ask for blue mage. We were told that it would have to be implemented in a way like it is. We kept asking for it anyway. And now somehow people are mad that it's a limited job? Perhaps you didn't personally ask for it, but the players at large did, and I think what's really disingenuous is the fact people are disappointed with how it's being implemented.

What's disingenuous is you claiming that people at large asked for Blue as a Limited Job.

All that was asked for was Blue Mage. What we didn't ask for was to roleplay Mr. Jensen as we keep saying we 'didn't ask for this'.

And again this isn't some one or the other situation. All it would have taken was 15 minutes of scrapboarding to come up with an equitable design paradigm to keep the world progression and skill hunting and still fit that into Job Balance. That's it.

That's literally it. There's even multiple RPG games out there that -do that- they could have used as a springboard, but they chose not to.

I personally am disappointed because this is the laziest way they could have gone about it. I personally hope it is enjoyable, but it will forever be tainted by the fact that I can't raid with it, until that changes.

Which is what Feedback can hopefully get them to do, and not playing Uncle !@#%ing Thaumaturge.

[Huntrss]

Everyone ask for Blue Mage and Yoshi-P said No. Now Yoshi-P found a way to put Blue Mage in and the reply is No instead of joy. They have said it will be going up to level 60 but I don't expect level 70 until all other Jobs are 80. this isn't going to be Current at all because then it some how break the game? Blue Mage is for old content like AAR and soon Heavensward and having fun in that. This is a Job you put away when your done not one you carry until the end of the game.

[Dualgunner]

Let me know when you're done with ad hominems.

Let me know when I started. Nowhere in my post did I attack you the arguer instead of your argument--rather the opposite, I said your argument was fallacious. Let me know when you're ready to debate in good faith.

[Arkdra]

Yep, we still don't know a lot about BLU because we don't know all the spells yet and if BLU gets traits from the spells or just doesn't have traits period.

You do realize that you sound like the people saying that BLU can't be a full job when you say things like that right? If BLU being a tank or healer would break the game then it will also break the game as a dps.

I was rooting for tank. Makes the most sense. The only identity blu has is get hit > learn spell so it makes sense that they would take the role focused on getting hit.