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  1. #11
    Player
    Luluna's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Shadowlord
    Posts
    1,073
    Character
    Luluna Eve
    World
    Louisoix
    Main Class
    Thaumaturge Lv 100
    Great post Seraph'ir Vhinah

    I have become so tired of the same old content...I have waited around in the hope they would add some kind of openworld content for those that enjoy that. There was nothing more lonelier than a Beastmaster out in FFXI in the middle of nowhere (in a good way haha..)i had great respect for those I knew. I know I played PUP it was great I could use my Automaton as tank healer or a dps I was ok I knew people who where highly skilled. I think this is a good idea I hope they add more as it really is needed. The game is stale for some of us who are tired of duty finder. The game will feel more alive I am really excited. Please don't take from the people who enjoy this type of content...they will be adding plenty more for those who do not like this style of play.
    (4)

  2. #12
    Player
    Blueyes's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    523
    Character
    Blue Plenilune
    World
    Diabolos
    Main Class
    Blue Mage Lv 80
    I'll be honest. I think there is a misconception about what the concept of limited jobs "adds" to the game. Yes, Blue Mage hasn't been created with a familiar cookie-cutter formula. A lot of out of the box thinking has gone into it. More than I expected. And I appreciate that.

    However, is it really necessary that, in order for a job to have this level of creativity go into it, that the job must be omitted from participating in content? I'm inclined to disagree with that stance.

    People say that this opens the door for Beastmaster. Taking the method of learning Blue Magic into account, it's easy to imagine Beastmaster venturing out into the world, taming wild monsters, then calling them into battle when inside an instanced duty. But I have to stop and wonder, why can't that work while allowing the job to participate in end game content? Numbers just have to be scaled so that the job's performance is inline with other jobs of the same role.

    I just feel like people are being blindsided. People accept the Limited Job that is Blue Mage because they like of the innovation that went into the job's design, but why can't it be a normal job that can participate in all content while being innovative at the same time? Why must it be one extreme or the other?
    (12)
    Last edited by Blueyes; 11-20-2018 at 12:29 AM.

  3. #13
    Player
    kikix12's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2017
    Posts
    953
    Character
    Seraphitia Faro
    World
    Midgardsormr
    Main Class
    Scholar Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by Blueyes View Post
    People say that this opens the door for Beastmaster. Taking the method of learning Blue Magic into account, it's easy to imagine Beastmaster venturing out into the world, taming wild monsters, then calling them into battle when inside an instanced duty. But I have to stop and wonder, why can't that work while allowing the job to participate in end game content? Numbers just have to be scaled so that the job's performance is inline with other jobs of the same role.
    Consider this. Beastmaster is just one job, yes? Yes.

    If it could have, let's say, 50 monsters under its control. Is it possible to balance all of them? Mathematically yes, it is possible. But do you know how?!

    By shoehorning them into specific template like they did with all the jobs now. Ultimately there would be only two or three "beasts" that you can use, with different skins. Just like the move between carbuncle and egi. And even then, they would have two or three skills. They would be neutered into oblivion being only a beastmasters "skin". Personally I don't think that's a good option, really.
    If they'd want to do it any other way, it'd be like adding 50 new jobs. It IS possible, but it is unrealistic. The amount of work necessary would far exceed making an entirely new game, let alone any other job. After all, balancing while keeping things "unique" in such a limited environment grows significantly more difficult with every addition to the pool. And you'd ask for dozens of those at once?!


    Now, this whole "fiasco" is kind of irksome for the weirdest reasons. Seriously. I think they should just call it "Purple Mage" and be done with it. The people that want a Blue Mage can then keep crying "We want Blue Mage!" instead of "We don't want Blue Mage true to the class if we can't play it like everything else! Delete it!", Square Enix will have a "unique" class for FFXIV and people that care about the Blue Mage's systems will have it. Everyone wins!
    (1)

  4. #14
    Player
    JBee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2018
    Posts
    133
    Character
    Aranna Aran
    World
    Malboro
    Main Class
    Scholar Lv 33
    Quote Originally Posted by kikix12 View Post
    If it could have, let's say, 50 monsters under its control. Is it possible to balance all of them? Mathematically yes, it is possible. But do you know how?!
    It's not up to the playerbase to know how, it's up to the developers. And to say it's unrealistic is like saying it's unrealistic for them to balance tanks, or for them to add any jobs whatsover.

    Beastmaster worked on charms.

    - Charm A, Send A on B. When A and B both nearly dead, let go of A, Kill A and B. Repeat.
    - Charm A. Use A to kill B, C, D, E.... and when A's charm broke, recharm A and continue.
    - No viable pets were nearby for whatever reason, able to summon a pet to use that would not break but would instead expire with a timer.

    It was a powerful class that shined solo, yes, but you could still use it in group settings. You could in theory take a full group of BST into content if you chose.

    49 unique abilities to start with, they said. 49. And attaining them is RNG based. I don't love that RNG part at all, but ok, I can deal with that. But going through that effort - to play a solo job - is a joke.
    (6)

  5. #15
    Player
    Andevom's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Posts
    720
    Character
    Andevom Vonskivaux
    World
    Diabolos
    Main Class
    Dragoon Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Blueyes View Post
    I just feel like people are being blindsided. People accept the Limited Job that is Blue Mage because they like of the innovation that went into the job's design, but why can't it be a normal job that can participate in all content while being innovative at the same time? Why must it be one extreme or the other?
    Short Answer: Because of the playerbase.

    The concept of a Blue Mage being able to customize their skill set, which is a big part of the draw, would be completely destroyed because people would ultimately dictate what the "correct" setup is for endgame. All those nifty abilities you've learned would be narrowed down to a handful, especially since they'd have to make certain abilities flat out not work against raid bosses.

    This is a job created for people who aren't necessarily into that scene so they can mess around and have fun, while still working towards something without being told they're "doing it wrong". For everyone else, you've got all the other jobs at your disposal.
    (7)

  6. #16
    Player
    JBee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2018
    Posts
    133
    Character
    Aranna Aran
    World
    Malboro
    Main Class
    Scholar Lv 33
    Quote Originally Posted by Andevom View Post
    Short Answer: Because of the playerbase.

    The concept of a Blue Mage being able to customize their skill set, which is a big part of the draw, would be completely destroyed because people would ultimately dictate what the "correct" setup is for endgame. All those nifty abilities you've learned would be narrowed down to a handful, especially since they'd have to make certain abilities flat out not work against raid bosses.

    This is a job created for people who aren't necessarily into that scene so they can mess around and have fun, while still working towards something without being told they're "doing it wrong". For everyone else, you've got all the other jobs at your disposal.
    Dragoon is now a job that can only be used in open world and FATEs and can no longer queue for roulettes or raids, because players are trying to dictate how the DRG should use their skills.

    But that's fine, right, cause you've got all the other jobs at your disposal.
    (5)

  7. #17
    Player
    Ilenya's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Limsa Lominsa
    Posts
    1,508
    Character
    Aurora Vlondett
    World
    Balmung
    Main Class
    Arcanist Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by JBee View Post
    Dragoon is now a job that can only be used in open world and FATEs and can no longer queue for roulettes or raids, because players are trying to dictate how the DRG should use their skills.

    But that's fine, right, cause you've got all the other jobs at your disposal.
    How does that...Even make sense in this context? You know, besides the fact the playerbase does try to force optimal meta stuff on people at times.
    (2)

  8. #18
    Player
    Shadowshinra's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    73
    Character
    Shiea Shinra
    World
    Cactuar
    Main Class
    Dragoon Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Andevom View Post
    Short Answer: Because of the playerbase.

    The concept of a Blue Mage being able to customize their skill set, which is a big part of the draw, would be completely destroyed because people would ultimately dictate what the "correct" setup is for endgame. All those nifty abilities you've learned would be narrowed down to a handful, especially since they'd have to make certain abilities flat out not work against raid bosses.

    This is a job created for people who aren't necessarily into that scene so they can mess around and have fun, while still working towards something without being told they're "doing it wrong". For everyone else, you've got all the other jobs at your disposal.
    No. The concept of Blue Mage is simply learning and using enemy attacks, I don 't know where the "customize move set" has come from (11?) but that's not what Blue is. In the current way they're adding BLU we'll be able to use 24 of the 49 attacks, we'll quickly figure out which are the best 24 and just like Yoshida didn't want, we'll see people being kicked from party finders if they don't have that 24. Their excuses for it being limited were weak.
    (6)

  9. #19
    Player
    whiskeybravo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Posts
    2,840
    Character
    Whiskey Bravo
    World
    Leviathan
    Main Class
    Warrior Lv 100
    I can appreciate their efforts for trying to recreate a faithful BLU job in this game.. But I gotta say the result is a bit disappointing. If BLU will never be able to participate in group content then it's really a shame. We already have a solo grind for practically useless relics, so here's another solo grind for practically useless BLU. I thought this was a team game.

    At the end of the day I guess it doesn't affect me too much, I was never planning on being a BLU main, and quite frankly I would've debated about leveling it up anyways since I don't particular care for caster jobs. So like much of the other side content in this game, it will be the next to join my list of Unaccepted Quests.
    (2)

  10. #20
    Player
    Ilenya's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Limsa Lominsa
    Posts
    1,508
    Character
    Aurora Vlondett
    World
    Balmung
    Main Class
    Arcanist Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowshinra View Post
    No. The concept of Blue Mage is simply learning and using enemy attacks, I don 't know where the "customize move set" has come from (11?) but that's not what Blue is. In the current way they're adding BLU we'll be able to use 24 of the 49 attacks, we'll quickly figure out which are the best 24 and just like Yoshida didn't want, we'll see people being kicked from party finders if they don't have that 24. Their excuses for it being limited were weak.
    Yes, it was from FFXI, but that also had...*goes to look* ... A lot of blue magic, some of which gave stats, or combined for autoabilities, and how you set it up mattered. Otherwise, you just had access to all blue magic you learned when you could cast it.
    (0)

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