Things to think about before you call someone "Bad"

[CorbinDallas]

His first post on the forum too, what a great impression.

[Lorgana]

What's this, more excuses for bad players? Get outta hereeeeeee

[SekkerOfTrust]

You all shows urselfs, i didnt came here to talk about grammar. Just loged to forum because i had enough. Raiders and hardcore players are the most toxic i have seen in any MMO ever. I can understand some of ppl plays for many years already that doesnt mean everyone else does. That ''watch a guide after 5hours'' its an attitude most of raiders does. Imo SE should remove ''the static'' system actually rolls, it just exclude people. You all used to learn and play few hardest contents maps and think u are better than everyone else. I proved myself while for example i was farming Sephi Ex whit 5/8 ppl whit diamond gear and they died over and over and i was the last standing most of the times. System right now allows you to ''try'' or ''learn'' a savage fight for 3 days after that you will find a party clear or a learning party that dont make to second mechanic of boss. If you dont have a friend/fc/linkshell to help you to clear u are excluded to that content due to elitist and static system. People learn while playing, when i touched Ridorama first time i was like huh thats a real hard stuff and after 10 runs i do it whitout a fail or death. At the end common raiders that just log to do that cuz have all the content/achives/etc done dont care of other ppl. Whats the people that cleared savage? 20-25%? Im sure many more players will do if they dont find that barrier of static/rude/elitist group that exclude them, many of the non-raider are willing to learn and does and im sure many will be on pair to actual raiders if had a chance but raiders keep excluding em cuz go whit a static clear for week and done, imnot saying 100% of playerbase are ready to clear it due to dps check but why bother SE put the most effort to content for 20% of playerbase? They dont, its people that keep ''exclusive''. The actual raiders are holding his ego cuz this game has to much content and people that dont try or get trown away can spare is time on other stuff or you will see ppl banishes from servers.I wont argue more about it, only SE can change the status because u cant have faith on people.

[Daibunnie]

You all shows urselfs, i didnt came here to talk about grammar. Just loged to forum because i had enough. Raiders and hardcore players are the most toxic i have seen in any MMO ever. I can understand some of ppl plays for many years already that doesnt mean everyone else does. That ''watch a guide after 5hours'' its an atritudemost of raiders doesnt. Imo SE should remove ''the static'' system actually rolls, it just exclude people. You all used to learn and play few hardest contents maps and think u are better than everyone else. I proved myself while for example i was farming Sephi Ex whit 5/8 ppl whit diamond gear and they died over and over and i was the last standing most of the times. System right now allows you to ''try'' or ''learn'' a savage fight for 3 days after that you will find a party clear or a learning party that dont make to second mechanic of boss. If you dont have a friend/fc/linkshell to help you to clear u are excluded to that content due to elitist and static system. People learn while playing, when i touched Ridorama first time i was like huh thats a real hard stuff and after 10 runs i do it whitout a fail or death. At the end common raiders that just log to do that cuz have all the content/achives/etc done dont care of other ppl. Whats the people that cleared savage? 20-25%? Im sure many more players will do if they dont find that barrier of static/rude/elitist group that exclude them, many of the non-raider are willing to learn and do and im sure many will be on pair to actual raiders if had a chance but raiders keep excluding em cuz go whit a static clear for week and done, imnot saying 100% of playerbase are ready to clear it due to dps check but why bother SE put the most effort to content for 20% of playerbase? They dont, its people that keep ''exclusive''. The actual raiders arw holding his ego cuzthis game has to much contentand people that dont try or get trown away can spare is time on other stuff or you will of ppl banish from servers.I wont argue more about it, only SE can change the status because u cant have faith on people.

How long did it take you to type that up?

[KaivaC]

You all shows urselfs, i didnt came here to talk about grammar. Just loged to forum because i had enough. Raiders and hardcore players are the most toxic i have seen in any MMO ever. I can understand some of ppl plays for many years already that doesnt mean everyone else does. That ''watch a guide after 5hours'' its an attitude most of raiders does. Imo SE should remove ''the static'' system actually rolls, it just exclude people. You all used to learn and play few hardest contents maps and think u are better than everyone else. I proved myself while for example i was farming Sephi Ex whit 5/8 ppl whit diamond gear and they died over and over and i was the last standing most of the times. System right now allows you to ''try'' or ''learn'' a savage fight for 3 days after that you will find a party clear or a learning party that dont make to second mechanic of boss. If you dont have a friend/fc/linkshell to help you to clear u are excluded to that content due to elitist and static system. People learn while playing, when i touched Ridorama first time i was like huh thats a real hard stuff and after 10 runs i do it whitout a fail or death. At the end common raiders that just log to do that cuz have all the content/achives/etc done dont care of other ppl. Whats the people that cleared savage? 20-25%? Im sure many more players will do if they dont find that barrier of static/rude/elitist group that exclude them, many of the non-raider are willing to learn and does and im sure many will be on pair to actual raiders if had a chance but raiders keep excluding em cuz go whit a static clear for week and done, imnot saying 100% of playerbase are ready to clear it due to dps check but why bother SE put the most effort to content for 20% of playerbase? They dont, its people that keep ''exclusive''. The actual raiders are holding his ego cuz this game has to much content and people that dont try or get trown away can spare is time on other stuff or you will see ppl banishes from servers.I wont argue more about it, only SE can change the status because u cant have faith on people.

Well...you poked the hornet's nest...you can't get mad when hornets are understandably irked when yet another person unjustifiably portrays an overall group of players based on some bad players they ran into. Have you ever played with players on Aether? Primal? Elemental? Or is your limited experience just what you experienced on Chaos? Kinda painting a wide picture based on your experience with just one datacentre. Just sayin, but you do you. Just don't open a box that you aren't prepared to have opened for you. People get curious, ya know.

[Legion88]

You all shows urselfs, i didnt came here to talk about grammar. Just loged to forum because i had enough. Raiders and hardcore players are the most toxic i have seen in any MMO ever. I can understand some of ppl plays for many years already that doesnt mean everyone else does. That ''watch a guide after 5hours'' its an atritudemost of raiders doesnt. Imo SE should remove ''the static'' system actually rolls, it just exclude people. You all used to learn and play few hardest contents maps and think u are better than everyone else. I proved myself while for example i was farming Sephi Ex whit 5/8 ppl whit diamond gear and they died over and over and i was the last standing most of the times. System right now allows you to ''try'' or ''learn'' a savage fight for 3 days after that you will find a party clear or a learning party that dont make to second mechanic of boss. If you dont have a friend/fc/linkshell to help you to clear u are excluded to that content due to elitist and static system. People learn while playing, when i touched Ridorama first time i was like huh thats a real hard stuff and after 10 runs i do it whitout a fail or death. At the end common raiders that just log to do that cuz have all the content/achives/etc done dont care of other ppl. Whats the people that cleared savage? 20-25%? Im sure many more players will do if they dont find that barrier of static/rude/elitist group that exclude them, many of the non-raider are willing to learn and do and im sure many will be on pair to actual raiders if had a chance but raiders keep excluding em cuz go whit a static clear for week and done, imnot saying 100% of playerbase are ready to clear it due to dps check but why bother SE put the most effort to content for 20% of playerbase? They dont, its people that keep ''exclusive''. The actual raiders arw holding his ego cuzthis game has to much contentand people that dont try or get trown away can spare is time on other stuff or you will of ppl banish from servers.I wont argue more about it, only SE can change the status because u cant have faith on people.

Sorry, but i'm 3 weeks behind and had to grind gear to actually get into Savage.
I needed 1 hour to learn all elemental phasesa nd the transition phase of O9S.
But now i'm stuck and can't get a clear because people are joining my PFs labeled as "kill, know mechanics, have enrage experience, 3 strikes" with zero (0) experience in any phase of the fight and wiping the party on the first mechanic.
For 2 complete weeks now i'm kicking players out of my parties because they a) don't meet the expectations stated in the PF description b) can't play their job on an acceptable level for Savage content c) are immune to advices and d) are in no way prepared for for the content.
And then they start to berate me in /tell what gives me the right to exclude them. Where are we here? It's my f*****g party with my rules and i have every right to enforce my rules there.

[SekkerOfTrust]

Im talking about Chaos Center, i cant say about the rest becuase i never played there, and isnt just one or two cases, it happens on most of hard content, and im not the only who noticed that as i many i saw over my 3 months playing says almost the same, even joined a hunt linkshell where many of em was raiders and saw how they talk about other players, its awfull. Raider tend to put trolls or #iwontlearnnever or #iwatchNetfilxwhileplaying on the same boat went it comes to hard content, then u see em struggle on normal content sometimes. As i normally go healer, if i make to find one of em in dungeons lets say they only will get heal for unavoidable damage if they arent the tank, and if they cry just ''git gut'' but i know this isnt good because everyone can make a mistake but if u do a mistake on savage even going blind on day 1-2 u get fired out. Maybe i need to change and play whit japanese folks or just quit, they arent harrashing like on Chaos.

[Vidu]

You all shows urselfs, i didnt came here to talk about grammar. Just loged to forum because i had enough. Raiders and hardcore players are the most toxic i have seen in any MMO ever. I can understand some of ppl plays for many years already that doesnt mean everyone else does. That ''watch a guide after 5hours'' its an attitude most of raiders does. Imo SE should remove ''the static'' system actually rolls, it just exclude people. You all used to learn and play few hardest contents maps and think u are better than everyone else. I proved myself while for example i was farming Sephi Ex whit 5/8 ppl whit diamond gear and they died over and over and i was the last standing most of the times. System right now allows you to ''try'' or ''learn'' a savage fight for 3 days after that you will find a party clear or a learning party that dont make to second mechanic of boss. If you dont have a friend/fc/linkshell to help you to clear u are excluded to that content due to elitist and static system. People learn while playing, when i touched Ridorama first time i was like huh thats a real hard stuff and after 10 runs i do it whitout a fail or death. At the end common raiders that just log to do that cuz have all the content/achives/etc done dont care of other ppl. Whats the people that cleared savage? 20-25%? Im sure many more players will do if they dont find that barrier of static/rude/elitist group that exclude them, many of the non-raider are willing to learn and does and im sure many will be on pair to actual raiders if had a chance but raiders keep excluding em cuz go whit a static clear for week and done, imnot saying 100% of playerbase are ready to clear it due to dps check but why bother SE put the most effort to content for 20% of playerbase? They dont, its people that keep ''exclusive''. The actual raiders are holding his ego cuz this game has to much content and people that dont try or get trown away can spare is time on other stuff or you will see ppl banishes from servers.I wont argue more about it, only SE can change the status because u cant have faith on people.

Okay, I cant work through this wall of text in as much detail as I would like to right now, because my head hurts.

Mainly because of one thing - and thats the thing I'd like to adress: Your issue with statics and how that excludes people from the more difficult content.
You dont seem to realise that content can only get more difficult and offer more of a challenge if the devs can assume two things:
- the party is working together and communicating with each other
- everyone in the party is able to perform at a high(er) level than in their average DF
I'm pretty sure that a party with two DPS who are both pulling only about 2k will be able to clear The Burn. I'm absolutly sure that a party with four DPS pulling 2k each has no chance to clear even O1S.

A static enviroment provides both of those things: A group of people who are willing to work together and are able to communicate with each other and a certain level of skill (because if someone lacks that, the static can either remove that person or help them improve).
You also seem to forget that a lot of people desire content that they can play together with their friends - while setting up and running a static is hard work (trust me, I do that), its also one of the best ways to create a way to create content that "enforces" you to do it with friends, instead of just easly doing it with randoms.
I also dont get your hate for statics in this context - by definition those people stick together in their fixed group, so for Savage-content you'll never interact with them. They shouldnt be bothering you - they're doing their thing, completly unintrested in you.

I would also like to remind you that SE is far, far away from putting "the most effort to content for 20% of [their] playerbase" - well, at least if you mean "Savage raids" by "content". I wouldnt be surprised if the recent GS-GATE or LoV required more effort than Savage-raids, fights that are re-using the complete graphic settings of the NM-raids (or is that also only done by 20%?) and only need adjustments in outgoing damage, HP and mechanics. There is very little content thats being created exclusively for raiders.

[Mixt]

Content is five hours old.

"Watch a guide!" they say

Realize that no guides exist yet because not enough time has passed for any to be made.

"I don't care, watch one anyway" they say, despite it being impossible to watch something that does not exist.

And then we have a problem.

And if you respond to their impossible demands with impossible demands of your own...
"What's that? You mean you can't fly under your own power by flapping your arms really hard? I DON'T CARE! DO IT ANYWAY!"
"Rage rage rage rage rage imabighypocrite rage rage rage missingthepointi'mtryingtomake rage rage rage incoherentscreaming rageragerage!"

And this is why i don't do extreme or savage content until a few days have passed, so guides have time to come out and i can avoid that scenario.

Was this part of the point you were trying to make?

[Vidu]

Im talking about Chaos Center, i cant say about the rest becuase i never played there, and isnt just one or two cases, it happens on most of hard content, and im not the only who noticed that as i many i saw over my 3 months playing says almost the same, even joined a hunt linkshell where many of em was raiders and saw how they talk about other players, its awfull. Raider tend to put trolls or #iwontlearnnever or #iwatchNetfilxwhileplaying on the same boat went it comes to hard content, then u see em struggle on normal content sometimes. As i normally go healer, if i make to find one of em in dungeons lets say they only will get heal for unavoidable damage if they arent the tank, and if they cry just ''git gut'' but i know this isnt good because everyone can make a mistake but if u do a mistake on savage even going blind on day 1-2 u get fired out. Maybe i need to change and play whit japanese folks or just quit, they arent harrashing like on Chaos.

I'm on Chaos aswell and I dont share your experience. While I raid with my static, I tend to do a lot of Ex-primal farms using PF and while I run into the occassional rage-quitter, every dismissal I can recall right now because someone messed up big time when they really shouldnt have - repeating the same mistake for the third time, not being able to handle mechanics in a Clear group, stuff like that.

And of course people need to vent about the actual bad players they come across in DF! We have a whole thread dedicated to that here on the forums and trust me: Its not only raiders who post their, its pretty much everyone.
There is a huge difference between someone telling their friends/FC/LS/the forum about "This aweful bard" they just had in their expert roulette and telling that bard "hey, you really suck!"
And honestly: If someone hasnt figured out the basics of their job and gameplay by level 70, they're not much better than a deliberate troll in my book.