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  1. #91
    Player
    Cilia's Avatar
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    The Hermit's Hovel
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    Trpimir Ratyasch
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    Lamia
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    Gunbreaker Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Remedi View Post
    No he openly defied Meteor, Solus was the one supporting it, however the emperor who Varis did know was an ascian yet told both him and Gaius to zip it. Actually he also forced Gaius to lend his help to Nael, since there was a scene I think from maelstrom quest that shown that Nael was assisted by Gaius in her work.
    It was in one of 2.4's debriefings on Roaille, "Let Us Cling Together." I can't find the dialogue in an online database, and seeing as I'm going out shortly I'm not going to hop on and rewatch the cutscenes to transcribe it here - but I distinctly remember it being mentioned that someone had been pulling Gaius' strings through Roaille when it came to opposing Meteor, and that few (if any) Garleans had openly opposed the project to remain in the Emperor's good graces (which is also why Gaius covertly opposed it).

    ... but this is getting off-topic...
    (0)
    Trpimir Ratyasch's Way Status (7.4 - End)
    [ ]LOST [X]NOT LOST
    "There is no hope in stubbornly clinging to the past. It is our duty to face the future and march onward, not retreat inward." -Sovetsky Soyuz, Azur Lane: Snowrealm Peregrination

  2. #92
    Player
    Remedi's Avatar
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    Character
    Remedi Maxwell
    World
    Cerberus
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    Goldsmith Lv 90
    Tendrils of Intrugue cutscene 3, spoken by the Admiral, she says that Varis was so set upon Eorzea annexation that he spoke out against the Meteor project.

    In fact If I'm not remembering wrong Roialle was sent by Varis to facilitate Gaius (without him knowing and I think moose was a bit angry about this since it essentially deflated Gaius character a great deal)
    (0)
    Last edited by Remedi; 09-30-2018 at 08:28 AM.

  3. #93
    Player
    ObsidianFire's Avatar
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    Kharagal Mierqid
    World
    Cerberus
    Main Class
    Summoner Lv 90
    Relevant game scripts relating to the Roialle situation, and a lot of what Eorzea thinks it knows (or turns out not to know as the case may be) about the state of the Empire around the time of the the Garlean War of Succession.

    Tendrils of Intrigue, Cut-scene 3
    Kan-E-Senna
    Given the troubled nature of his succession, the new emperor will require time to seal his grip on power. Yet have no doubt but that he shall, for there are not left with strength enough to oppose him.

    Raubahn
    Since the success of Operation Archon, the remnants of the XIVth Legion and the forces occupying Ala Mhigo have done naught but fortify their positions.
    But you can be sure they'll be ready to march on us again, if their emperor gives the word.

    Merlwyb
    When, not if. They say this Varis was so set upon Eorzean annexation that he spoke out against the Meteor project.

    Kan-E-Senna
    Plainly, the new emperor's intentions are of great concern to us all.
    I propose that we set aside the Carteneau dispute for the present and discuss what measures the Alliance might take to prepare for a resumption of hostilities with Garlemald.
    Moreover, I move that we reexamine the question of how our former allies in Ishgard, might be persuaded to retake their place at our side. Could Eorzea but stand as one, 'twould deal a grave blow to our enemy's ambitions.
    This cut-scene has the leaders of Eorzea make some assumptions about the XIVth Legion that contradicts what the player has been told earlier. The big assumption they all make is that the XIVth Legion is still working with/for the Empire. In particular, the leaders think the XIVth will march on Eorzea if the new Emperor, Varis, wants them to. It also seems to imply that the forces in Ala Mhigo and the XIVth Legion are still working together at this time. Given how spotty the Eorzean Alliance's intelligence is about Garlemald overall, I don't feel this is actually what's going on though, especially with what's revealed in the next script.

    Let Us Cling Together, Cut-scene 2
    Raubahn
    Following the Calamity, the forces of the XIVth Imperial Legion entrenched themselves in strategic locations across Eorzea.
    So swiftly did they accomplish this, it was suspected that they had received help. To think that it came from Roaille... My right hand.

    Ilberd
    There is more. We have reason to believe that Roaille didn't deal exclusively with the XIVth. She also answered to a higher authority in Garlemald.
    But this higher authority could not have been the Emperor. By consenting to the Meteor project, Solus zos Galvus showed himself to be more concerned about preventing the spread of primal influence then claiming Eorzea for the Empire. He would happily have seen the lot reduced to ash.
    We believe a number of high-ranking figures within the royal household were against the decision, but that they knew better than to oppose the Emperor openly. Of course, this didn't prevent them from making clandestine provisions, in which Roaille played a part.

    Alphinaud
    Alas, these provisions did not prevent Dalamud from falling, and the ensuing chaos changed the face of the realm forever. Yet Eorzea survived.
    To all intents and purposes, the Meteor project had failed, and the Empire was left to rue its lack of a decisive means to eliminate the primals. Until, that is, it stumbled upon the Ultima Weapon.

    Raubahn
    Even before the accursed thing was dug up, it seemed to me the XIVth had the might to overwhelm our weakened armies. Yet they chose to hid behind their walls. Why?

    Alphinaud
    The Black Wolf was wary of making the denizens of Eorzea desperate, lest more primals emerge to bleed the land. The discovery of the Ultima Weapon, however, emboldened him to resume his war of conquest in earnest.

    Ilberd
    But there was one in Garlemald who believed that van Baelsar's actions were premature--one who stood higher in the imperial army's chain of command. He ordered the legatus to halt his advance, only to find that the Black Wolf had slipped its leash, and that the XIVth now acted alone.
    In a bid to bring van Baelsar to heel, he used the agent he had planted in Ul'dah prior to the Calamity to undermine the legion's efforts.

    Raubahn
    A man who outranks van Baelsar, yet opposed the late emperor's decision to annihilate Eorzea... This could only be the former high legatus of the Garlean Army, now known as Emperor Varis zos Galvus.
    So he was Roaille's true master...

    Ilberd
    But one of several, in actual fact. We've learned that even as Roaille served the Empire's interests, she sold imperial secrets to a certain faction in Eorzea.
    In so doing, she helped to maintain the status quo, thus prolonging the conflict. Considering who stands to profit from war, it isn't hard to imagine who her other masters were.

    Raubahn
    Seven hells... You mean to say that she was a double agent?

    Ilberd
    Triple, if you consider her services to van Baelsar and the new emperor as separate.
    In hindsight, the irony in this cut-scene is amazing. Solus must have loved Roialle's attempts at keeping everyone on even footing. Gaius, meanwhile, is the first Garlean mentioned to have figured out that trying to conquer countries encourages them to summon eikons more, not less. Apparently he wasn't interested in conquering Eorzea until he has some way of dealing with the eikons.

    This cut-scene also gives a rough timeline for when Roialle was operating, who she was working for, and when she was influencing who. In particular, she stopped having an impact on Gaius and the XIVth Legion after they found Ultima Weapon, so wouldn't have been involved with anything they did in 2.0. Even her involvement in 1.0 isn't necessarily something they were even aware of. This also seems to indicate that Gaius and the XIVth Legion went rouge before Varis won the War of Succession.

    Rough Timeline
    • Roialle becomes a spy in Ul'dah for Varis
    • (1.0) Roialle does unknown clandestine work to prevent the Metor Project from going through
    • The Calamity
    • Roialle helps the XIVth Legion form their network of Castrums quickly; this is backed by the Garlean government
    • The XIVth Legion digs up Ultima Weapon, works on restoring it and begins preparing to conquer Eorzea
    • Varis, not yet emperor, gets wind that Gaius is planning on conquering Eorzea with the Ultima Weapon. He orders him to stop his advance on Eorzea
    • Gaius and the XIVth Legion go rouge
    • Varis orders Roialle to undermine Gaius' Eorzean campaign
    • (2.0) Given how Gaius' campaign failed, its highly unlikely Roialle had the impact on it she was supposed to
    • Varis wins the War of Succession
    • Roialle gets information about the Scions and the WoL to Varis (HW cut-scene with Varis mentions her as the information source)
    • (2.4) Roialle is found out by the Immortal Flame and captured
    This cutscene has always made me suspicious of why the XIVth Legion wanted to get at Roialle as well as why Roialle was trying to get to the XIVth Legion. She's got to know the XIVth isn't with Garlemald anymore. Maybe she panicked and forgot? Ironically, the XIVth Legion could easily have had more use of her then she would have had of them. It's highly likely she knew what was going on in Garlemald at the time and I can see the XIVth wanting to know that. It's entirely possible (even likely) that had she made it to the XIVth, none of the information she would give them would make it back to Varis. Gaius not being dead makes it even more interesting. I can easily see him being very interested in figuring out what Roialle knows if he's still in touch with the XIVth (or hadn't left Eorzea yet).
    (6)

  4. #94
    Player
    Cilia's Avatar
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    Trpimir Ratyasch
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    Lamia
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    Gunbreaker Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Merlwyb
    They say this Varis was so set upon Eorzean annexation that he spoke out against the Meteor project.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ilberd
    We believe a number of high-ranking figures within the royal household were against the [Meteor project], but that they knew better than to oppose the Emperor openly.
    Therein lies the confusion. Far as I can gather Varis probably said something, but was unwilling to openly go against it. I was wrong - maybe probably.

    Can we get off this, though? It's a tertiary point at best... wasn't intended to be anything more than an example of political posturing; doesn't change whether or not Varis genuinely supported the thought of coexistence with Doma, if he was even aware of the effort.
    (4)
    Trpimir Ratyasch's Way Status (7.4 - End)
    [ ]LOST [X]NOT LOST
    "There is no hope in stubbornly clinging to the past. It is our duty to face the future and march onward, not retreat inward." -Sovetsky Soyuz, Azur Lane: Snowrealm Peregrination

  5. #95
    Player
    Remedi's Avatar
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    Remedi Maxwell
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    Cerberus
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    Goldsmith Lv 90
    It does tells that Varis wants to rule over the living world instead that over the ashes of it as such it's important to his character.

    While the second cutscene makes it seems that no1 in the house spoke against the meteor project, they are quicly to reassume in that cutscene that Varis was against it, when deducing who was Roialle master. As such the first cutscene information is correct. Just like Gaius, Varis was against it openly, but was made to heel when the emperor decided to go for it.

    I think that we need to reconsdier the discussion Zenolidubus and Varis had during 4.3
    Thing is, after Zenolidubus said that everything went as planned Varis had a death stare on him which Zenos reciprocated.
    I think this is more important to understand with the new informations.
    the part where Varis says that "we cannot suffer eikons, was I not clear on this point" might've not been directed at Zenos but instead be directed at the Domans and after Zenos told him everything went as planned it was there that Varis found out he got played and that's why he gave him the death stare.

    As said however this is how you want to interpretate actions and facts, until we have confirmations like 4.4 we can only have ideas at best of what happened.
    Facts for the rulers of Garlemand I don't think we'll have them till 5.0
    (0)
    Last edited by Remedi; 09-30-2018 at 11:14 PM.

  6. #96
    Player
    MPNZ's Avatar
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    Nephie Elz
    World
    Lamia
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    Archer Lv 90
    Honestly, with Garlaen air superiority stiffled: Dragons will provide a needed counter in the short term, but without the help of the Sharlaya or Thavnair: it will be very hard.. Not to mention entry by Dalmasca or gyr abania will be impossible as they will literally be a warzone, so we may have to move a small force Towards either the capital or to make alliances with nearby nations to create an opening. Just in case they like totes go the war route
    (0)
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    Ewwwwwww, it's all glowwy again!

  7. #97
    Player
    Ramesses's Avatar
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    Sharlayan
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    Prince Nuada
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    Diabolos
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    Reaper Lv 70
    The thought of having an Order of Dragon mounted Dragoons or Knights is exactly the direction I was hoping to see for Ishgard's aftermath. It brings the tale full circle for that story arc while also providing combat aerial capabilities for the Eorzean Alliance.

    This is actually how I'd like to see the Heavensward Knights rebuilt... it just makes logical sense on several levels.
    (3)

  8. #98
    Player
    Bright-Flower's Avatar
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    Nyr Ardyne
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    Balmung
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    Paladin Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Ramesses View Post
    The thought of having an Order of Dragon mounted Dragoons or Knights is exactly the direction I was hoping to see for Ishgard's aftermath. It brings the tale full circle for that story arc while also providing combat aerial capabilities for the Eorzean Alliance.

    This is actually how I'd like to see the Heavensward Knights rebuilt... it just makes logical sense on several levels.
    I was REALLY hoping that the Dragoon job quest in SB would be about dragoons forming a bond with dragons. I guess we 'kinda' got that since we do help out a couple dragons but it's not quite the direction I hoped for. Ah well.

    I just hope PLD gets a decent story in 5.0 after the convoluted mess of 3.0 and the lack of stakes in 4.0.
    (0)

  9. #99
    Player
    Ramesses's Avatar
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    Prince Nuada
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    Diabolos
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    Reaper Lv 70
    Quote Originally Posted by Bright-Flower View Post
    I was REALLY hoping that the Dragoon job quest in SB would be about dragoons forming a bond with dragons. I guess we 'kinda' got that since we do help out a couple dragons but it's not quite the direction I hoped for. Ah well.

    I just hope PLD gets a decent story in 5.0 after the convoluted mess of 3.0 and the lack of stakes in 4.0.
    You and me both... that was how I always saw the real ending of Ishgard's tale; a reformation and re-emergence of the bond between knight and dragon. A new Heavensward set of Knights with true meaning. Didn't really happen.

    Only thing that sated my irritation with this was that Estinien got a very decent "aftermath" tale in the tales of the Storm thing.
    (0)

  10. #100
    Player
    Iscah's Avatar
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    Aurelie Moonsong
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    Bismarck
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    Red Mage Lv 100
    I think it's likely we'll get that plot at some point. We just haven't got there yet.

    When it happens, I really hope Estinien will be involved with it - and he was busy elsewhere during Stormblood.

    We also need a resolution to Heustienne's story, whether that can happen in the same plotline or it'll be told separately.

    It's worth keeping in mind that we're not all the way through a pre-planned multi-game story yet, and there are hanging plot threads in a lot of the job quests. Ideally the best stories and climaxes need to be saved for the last expansion, whatever it is.
    (0)

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