We Really Need To Talk About The State And Path Of FFXIV

[Sigma-Astra]

In fact, this game could use only 5 stats for every character and nothing would change for the gameplay...

Are we playing the same game...?

[Reynhart]

Are we playing the same game...?

Yes, we are, the game where STR, DEX, INT and MND has exactly the same effect, so you could rename it Power and it would be a single stat, since items are already locked by jobs.
The game where no job needs to focus on both Skillspeed and Spellspeed, so you can rename it Speed, since items are already locked by jobs.
The game where VIT and PIE are only useful for determining HP and MP, so you can already use HP and MP as stats.
The game where DH and Crit are the same concept, so Crit would be enough, for the stat that randomly increases the damage and is used for some procs.
And you could remove Det, since it's nothing more than a substat of Power.

And, apparently, no one gives a damn on Tenacity, which effect is also covered by Defense/MDefense on gear and Power anyway...

And we would all play our jobs exactly the same as we are now.

[KaivaC]

Yes, we are, the game where STR, DEX, INT and MND has exactly the same effect, so you could rename it Potency and it would be a single stat, since items are already locked by jobs.
The game where no job needs to focus on both Skillspeed and Spellspeed, so you can rename it Speed, since items are already locked by jobs.
The game where VIT and PIE are only useful for determining HP and MP, so you can already use HP and MP as stats.
The game where DH and Crit are the same concept, so Crit would be enough, for the stat that randomly increases the damage and is used for some procs.
And you could remove Det, since it's basically a substat of Potency.

And, apparently, no one gives a damn on Tenacity, which effect is also covered by Defense/MDefense on gear and Potency anyway...

And we would all play our jobs exactly the same as we are now.

Gonna need clarification from the other raiders here on the other stats and to make sure I'm correct, but based on personal experience, that would require a reworking on main stats and how they are applied to combat, wouldn't they? On the tanking side of things, I know that Crit doesn't help Paladins as much as Direct Hit does. Whereas Warriors rely heavily on those sweet crits during their IR burst - in fact, it's why the preferred stats are Crit for WAR and DH for PLDs, because that is what is preferable to those jobs when it comes down to optimization.

Again, with your suggestion, it would require a reworking of stats and how damage is probably applied, and that might be far more work than the developers would find necessary, nor would it even be easy to do, considering that all the jobs have specific builds to pull the most use out of them.

[Reynhart]

Gonna need clarification from the other raiders here on the other stats and to make sure I'm correct, but based on personal experience, that would require a reworking on main stats and how they are applied to combat, wouldn't they?

No. What is applied in combat is Attack, Magic Attack and Healing. It's just that, depending on the job, your Attack is tied to a different stat. If you look at PLD, even Clemency and Holy Spirit are tied to Attack instead of the other two, and for healers, both their healing spells and damaging spells scales on MND, i.e, healing.

[KaivaC]

No. What is applied in combat is Attack, Magic Attack and Healing. It's just that, depending on the job, your Attack is tied to a different stat. If you look at PLD, even Clemency and Holy Spirit are tied to Attack instead of the other two, and for healers, both their healing spells and damaging spells scales on MND, i.e, healing.

Pardon me, but I could recall that the damage you do to enemies have four different variants. If I'm remembering correctly, that is normal, direct hit, critical, and direct critical, all of which are affected by the stats you have and a healthy dose of RNG. In fact, I remember that Crit melds directly affect BOTH the rate of crits as well as crit hit damage. It's more than just the three you are saying. While there may be some games out there in which you can just use those three as the only applicable combat attributes, FFXIV is not that kind of game. What you are suggesting would, at a minimum based on the experience I've personally had, require a rework of WARs, who rely very heavily on not only how strong their crits are in their IR window, but also the rate of crits.

Not to mention how it would affect SCHs when it comes to getting that crit on their shields when it is very much needed during high damage. I couldn't speak on the other jobs as I haven't tried them out, but I don't think simplifying matters as you've suggested would be nearly as good as you are saying they will be.

[Reynhart]

Pardon me, but I could recall that the damage you do to enemies have four different variants. If I'm remembering correctly, that is normal, direct hit, critical, and direct critical, all of which are affected by the stats you have and a healthy dose of RNG.

Yes, you have, since we have Crit and DH. But, both those stats use the same concept. There's no point in having two stats that work the same way. You could adjust their value to have just one stat called Crit. AFAIK, FFXIV is the only game to have two kinds of "Crits". Like I said in some other post, if one of those stats worked like the Dragon Quest crits, then it could be interesting depending on the foe you're facing.

[AmeliaVerves]

Yes, you have, since we have Crit and DH. But, both those stats use the same concept. There's no point in having two stats that work the same way. You could adjust their value to have just one stat called Crit. AFAIK, FFXIV is the only game to have two kinds of "Crits". Like I said in some other post, if one of those stats worked like the Dragon Quest crits, then it could be interesting depending on the foe you're facing.

But they don't.
While DH only affects the amount of direct hits you land, Crit affects the amount and the damage of critical hits.

sniped bc too many big pictures

The gear literally says what it's for... so apart from NIN who is using aiming accessories there literally shouldn't be any confusion about which gear to wear. Tbf for lower ilvls it really doesn't matter, I have never heard of someone being kicked for wearing the wrong accessories in a <50 dungeon. Whenever I notice something like that I just tell the person which one is the mainstat for his/her class and thats it. ö.ö

[KaivaC]

Yes, you have, since we have Crit and DH. But, both those stats use the same concept. There's no point in having two stats that work the same way. You could adjust their value to have just one stat called Crit. AFAIK, FFXIV is the only game to have two kinds of "Crits". Like I said in some other post, if one of those stats worked like the Dragon Quest crits, then it could be interesting depending on the foe you're facing.

The only concept that they share is that they produce higher than normal damage. But the materia for direct hits ONLY affects the rate of them. Crits affects BOTH the rate and amount of damage. Again, combining the two into one stat would require some reworks on jobs, because of how those two stats work.

[Sigma-Astra]

Yes, we are, the game where STR, DEX, INT and MND has exactly the same effect, so you could rename it Power and it would be a single stat, since items are already locked by jobs.
The game where no job needs to focus on both Skillspeed and Spellspeed, so you can rename it Speed, since items are already locked by jobs.
The game where VIT and PIE are only useful for determining HP and MP, so you can already use HP and MP as stats.
The game where DH and Crit are the same concept, so Crit would be enough, for the stat that randomly increases the damage and is used for some procs.
And you could remove Det, since it's nothing more than a substat of Power.

And, apparently, no one gives a damn on Tenacity, which effect is also covered by Defense/MDefense on gear and Power anyway...

And we would all play our jobs exactly the same as we are now.

Yea sure, because single player basic RPG game stat aspects are the way to go about things here. It's not hard to pay attention to what your main and sub stats are, but sure, let's make the game 20x more simple and stupid than it was before because one person doesn't like it.

/sarcasm

Crit and DH may be the same concept, but they don't even function in the same way to begin with as certain jobs require one over the other entirely. Each one functions on a different probability rate of succeeding based off of how high your own stats are and since....every job will have a different number inflation, that's not even counting with what people meld, the numbers are not going to be the same for everyone.

I don't need my spellspeed to affect my overall speed of everything that I do if you're wanting to combine both skill and spell into just speed, that's stupid. If I'm wacking things with my stick faster instead of casting faster then I'm not being a very good mage.

I'm not even sure why we need this asinine basic stat system you're suggesting. Stats in XIV are not hard, it's not rocket science.