Is this why Pagos was delayed?

[Arkdra]

The number of threads on this forum decrying the AFK train and how worthless it was were countless. People here supposedly hated it. Now we have a release where people can't afk to level their roles and they aren't happy, they want the afk train back. SE can't win regardless of what they do.

Se absolutely can win. The problem with anemos wasn't the train it's that it was really boring. One of the most boring pieces of content added to the game. As it turns out, this is the same problem with Pagos. So SE can win by designing some content that isn't kill a billion hp inflated trash mobs and also fight some fate bosses with no interesting mechanics.

Or bring back the old relic, I was fine with that.

[LaylaTsarra]

Se absolutely can win. The problem with anemos wasn't the train it's that it was really boring. One of the most boring pieces of content added to the game. As it turns out, this is the same problem with Pagos. So SE can win by designing some content that isn't kill a billion hp inflated trash mobs and also fight some fate bosses with no interesting mechanics.

Or bring back the old relic, I was fine with that.

I did all the relics and some would say i got too many of them not just on my main but on my alts. Anemos was super easy and one could get not only one relic but all of them as well as full gear sets if one had a mindset for the grind. I have 8 toons at 20 so I know all about Anemos.

My comments here aren't that improvements couldn't be made to what is or was at the moment, but that this forum will complain regardless of what they do. The number of threads about how worthless Eureka was here sure didn't appear to reflect the constantly full instances and people spending time there getting their relics. And my observation was that most seemed to enjoy the AFK train.

I reserve judgement still given it's just the first week and many are still leveling so whether or not we'll see more of a train as time goes by remains to be seen. The one thing i don't like is that parties are somewhat difficult to put together and the new chaining of mobs isn't friend friendly given is your friends aren't at your level they are basically not going to fit in with your needs for mob grinding. Eureka Anemos I could take a level 1 friend with me and get them to do the train with me and everyone else.

[BillyKaplan]

The number of threads about how worthless Eureka was here sure didn't appear to reflect the constantly full instances and people spending time there getting their relics.

When you look at it like that, A1S and ARF are two of the most successful pieces of content ever released in this game...

[WhyAmIHere]

I did all the relics and some would say i got too many of them not just on my main but on my alts. Anemos was super easy and one could get not only one relic but all of them as well as full gear sets if one had a mindset for the grind. I have 8 toons at 20 so I know all about Anemos.

My comments here aren't that improvements couldn't be made to what is or was at the moment, but that this forum will complain regardless of what they do. The number of threads about how worthless Eureka was here sure didn't appear to reflect the constantly full instances and people spending time there getting their relics. And my observation was that most seemed to enjoy the AFK train.

I reserve judgement still given it's just the first week and many are still leveling so whether or not we'll see more of a train as time goes by remains to be seen. The one thing i don't like is that parties are somewhat difficult to put together and the new chaining of mobs isn't friend friendly given is your friends aren't at your level they are basically not going to fit in with your needs for mob grinding. Eureka Anemos I could take a level 1 friend with me and get them to do the train with me and everyone else.

Any forum for anything will have people complaining about the thing the forum is for. It's what people do, complain about things they don't like. Here, reddit, any fansites that may exist, what have you. Everyone enjoys doing different things, and in myriad ways.

You brought up a key point of contention that many have echoed, that it's nigh impossible to bring a friend with you into Eureka Pagos who happens to be a few levels below/ahead of you and reasonably gain a decent amount of exp for the time spent killing mobs. In Anemos, just bring 'em onto the train, and slowly they'll work their way up to being able to participate. Heck, if you have a healer leveled, you were almost always going to find an invite to a party in Anemos because at least you could rez people who died. You weren't going out of your way to do so, everyone was either at the NM, or moving from one NM spawn camp to the other. People were actively engaged with the content in a meaningful way regardless of their elvl (within reason, of course. Tanks/DPS weren't as lucky, but you could still get an invite most of the time). And as much as I've seen people berate the afk's for being afk, they sure weren't afraid to move when the NM spawned... and people were willing to get them there on time for even a silver participation.

You cannot do that in Pagos. Sure, there needed to be a paradigm shift in the playerbase of "this isn't going to be like Anemos was," and for the most part I believe there was. But a road goes both ways, and SE should have heeded the feedback of their, not just players, but their paying customers, to what expectations they had and how best to meet those expectations. Business 101, if people want a thing from you and you can't provide it, they'll go to wherever they can get it reasonably. SE dropped the ball with Pagos, and I'm going to opt to only go in when my schedule allows, and play it to the best that I can. I'm skeptical of what'll come down the road, seeing as how many people are upset by the decisions made by the dev team and how they'll address them given the dev teams track record. Hope for the best, expect the worst, and accept anything in-between... unless you choose not to and move on/do other things.

(An aside: I am tired of the whole "well I got X amount of things. It's deflective and diminutive to the point being made. We shouldn't be trying to push people down/away because they cant/couldn't commit to something the same level as we do, instead bringing them up to our level or making what was a chore for us easier for the people after us. But, that's the idealist in me speaking.)