More content like Rathalos EX, please

[RiyahArp]

But I was told that DPS players didn't like poorly designed toxic mechanics like hard enrages.

No, they don't. But I don't think SE planned tanks to be DPS but three times as sturdy, either, to the point where 4/8 tank clears are becoming a joke. It's not difficulty in that sense, except to dps and healers. It should also be a test of tanking too, with real risk if they screw up, not "blue dps that tosses out self heals once in a while."

Rath isn't story required, nor has any EX trial ever been.

No, but a lot of people have clamored for expert dungeons to be more like this.

[Bourne_Endeavor]

No, they don't. But I don't think SE planned tanks to be DPS but three times as sturdy, either, to the point where 4/8 tank clears are becoming a joke. It's not difficulty in that sense, except to dps and healers. It should also be a test of tanking too, with real risk if they screw up, not "blue dps that tosses out self heals once in a while.".

I doubt they intended Zurvan or A12S to be cleared by eight tanks yet it's been done. Likewise, Ridorana has been cleared by 21 SMNs, RDMs, BLMs and 24 tanks and healers. This is simply players coming up with different ways to clear the content. Shocking, I know, but people like to experiment in that sort of way. As for not liking enrage. Welcome to the only mechanic which keeps DPS relevant. So either you accept them as a necessary component or tanks are simply better.

No, but a lot of people have clamored for expert dungeons to be more like this.

God forbid the game asks you to turn your brain on. The horror!

[RiyahArp]

God forbid the game asks you to turn your brain on. The horror!

It's hard to talk to you when you assume something like rath ex just requires you to turn your brain on. The fact that people might actually struggle to the point of vote abandon in some of the games activities always seems to get glossed over, because to a vocal subset of this population, everything is just so easy that it has to be harder. It also has to be forced on people so that they get good.

It shouldn't be required in expert to avoid the times when you need to clear expert/70 dungeons for story mode. I am willing to let expert be harder overall, but on the flip side that just means people will seek tomes elsewhere if it becomes too hard with too many vote abandons. No one should be forced to bang their head against the wall because some people think content should be harder and all people should be forced to improve their skills to a standard above what casual play requires. It's best content like this is optional, not required; if you have every played an MMO when you were forced to do something distasteful to progress, it can be some of the least fun activities ever. Ask any ninja who had to rep grind for utsusemi in FFXI.

[HyoMinPark]

It's hard to talk to you when you assume something like rath ex just requires you to turn your brain on. The fact that people might actually struggle to the point of vote abandon in some of the games activities always seems to get glossed over, because to a vocal subset of this population, everything is just so easy that it has to be harder. It also has to be forced on people so that they get good.

These people tend to be the same ones who try to Vote Abandon after a single wipe in a 24-man. Hello, Weeping City. Hello, Dun Scaith. Heaven forbid things don’t just roll over when you target them. Maybe if content did get progressively harder as you level, people would stop asking for things to be so brain-dead simple, or just handed to them.

It shouldn't be required in expert to avoid the times when you need to clear expert/70 dungeons for story mode. I am willing to let expert be harder overall, but on the flip side that just means people will seek tomes elsewhere if it becomes too hard with too many vote abandons. No one should be forced to bang their head against the wall because some people think content should be harder and all people should be forced to improve their skills to a standard above what casual play requires. It's best content like this is optional, not required; if you have every played an MMO when you were forced to do something distasteful to progress, it can be some of the least fun activities ever. Ask any ninja who had to rep grind for utsusemi in FFXI.

This game asks literally nothing of its playerbase for 99% of the content — doesn’t even ask for you to have a semblance of a decent rotation at level cap. The least it can do is start demanding something of players from content that is done at current endgame/level cap.

[Bourne_Endeavor]

It's hard to talk to you when you assume something like rath ex just requires you to turn your brain on. The fact that people might actually struggle to the point of vote abandon in some of the games activities always seems to get glossed over, because to a vocal subset of this population, everything is just so easy that it has to be harder. It also has to be forced on people so that they get good.

It shouldn't be required in expert to avoid the times when you need to clear expert/70 dungeons for story mode. I am willing to let expert be harder overall, but on the flip side that just means people will seek tomes elsewhere if it becomes too hard with too many vote abandons. No one should be forced to bang their head against the wall because some people think content should be harder and all people should be forced to improve their skills to a standard above what casual play requires. It's best content like this is optional, not required; if you have every played an MMO when you were forced to do something distasteful to progress, it can be some of the least fun activities ever. Ask any ninja who had to rep grind for utsusemi in FFXI.

As per usual, you jump to absurd extreme scenarios. How many times do I have to mention The Vault? Was that Vote Abandoned? Rarely. And yet it was a dungeon that actually required some thought. Even if a few vote abandons did happen. So what? Getting the equivalent of a game over every once in a while isn't the end of the world. It's certainly better than content being so easy, you literally can't fail. Turning on your brain is simply shorthand for saying you have actual mechanic to pay attention to. Meanwhile, Swallow's Compass is so laughably simple, I pull everything in Deliverance and have healed large pulls with just Regen and Assize. And my healers aren't Savage geared nor was the tank in that particular instance.

People wouldn't get their tomes elsewhere if content scaled, thus they have to do the harder Experts unless they want to do Leveling Roulette once a day.

[MoroMurasaki]

I am willing to let expert be harder overall, but on the flip side that just means people will seek tomes elsewhere if it becomes too hard with too many vote abandons.

You have to recognize the absolute chasm of difference between current expert dungeons and anything that is going to get Vote Abandoned. I don't want my expert roulette to be Rathalos EX either but there is surely so much room for increasing the difficulty of these dungeons that saying "they could make Expert roulette dungeons significantly harder" is hard to argue against.

There is so much braindead easy content in this game I don't understand how anyone who has played it for any length of time (and amassed any skill at it) could be saddened by the idea of SE stepping up their game. What better place than a roulette literally designated for "experts"?

As for them adding more content like this to the game? Sure, but I would instantly quit and I imagine many others would do the same. This sort of fight just doesn't work for this type of game let alone with their engine.

Byeee! Have fun! o/

[RiyahArp]

I don't want my expert roulette to be Rathalos EX either but there is surely so much room for increasing the difficulty of these dungeons that saying "they could make Expert roulette dungeons significantly harder" is hard to argue against.

Make it as hard as you like, just don't require it. That's all i ask. Just don't make people go through Super Vault to do the story.

[HyoMinPark]

Make it as hard as you like, just don't require it. That's all i ask. Just don't make people go through Super Vault to do the story.

There’s literally no piece of Extreme content that serves as an MSQ roadblock in this game. Considering they’ve even taken out the post-main expansion dungeons to trim down the MSQ because people complained it “took too long”, you don’t have to worry about a thing.

[jameseoakes]

There’s literally no piece of Extreme content that serves as an MSQ roadblock in this game. Considering they’ve even taken out the post-main expansion dungeons to trim down the MSQ because people complained it “took too long”, you don’t have to worry about a thing.

Is that why we haven't had MSQ dungeons for a bit?

[Bourne_Endeavor]

Make it as hard as you like, just don't require it. That's all i ask. Just don't make people go through Super Vault to do the story.

Which is a perfectly fine. In such a scenario, you have leveling dungeons are the requirement. Keep those as they are and move Expert dungeons as purely optional harder alternative. Not unreasonable hard, but hard enough tanks can't pull entire rooms.