Dev blog: New Feast rewards

[Sindele]

"You made it about character by taking offense to my utterly baseless comments about your character" is an interesting rhetorical approach, but not usually a very successful one.

[Aviars]

So, let's invert the argument: top-end PVE players are okay with their rewards eventually filtering down to the general population's access months/years later.

Why do you feel - wait for it, wait for it - entitled to a unique brand of perpetual exclusivity?

Hard mode, if you please: no easy routes out of the discussion like 'because I earned it' or 'because that's what it is now'.

Confirmation bias is strong. You seem to think such a thread doesn't attract people with a motive. How cute

"You made it about character by taking offense to my utterly baseless comments about your character" is an interesting rhetorical approach, but not usually a very successful one.

Again, the main point wasn't his character. He suggested low effort achievements, I made a comment that he seems to prefer low effort achievements. somehow that turns him into a casual, and went about claiming ad hominem the rest of the time. Not exactly my fault

I'm sorry, were you going to answer the question or is this just a - what did you call it - "cop out"?

It wasn't a cop out, this thread attracts players with a motive. When they don't like something they see, they come and complain. It was a direct response to you claiming that your side had some sort of validity by 1-2 "high end pvers" somehow means it must be a lot more.

Sorry if that was complicated for you, I reached my daily limit apparently, so I'm going to have to get off for now. Who knew there was a daily limit to posts!

Also, you took that quote after the debate became about ad hominem, it doesn't apply, good night

[Sindele]

I'm sorry, were you going to answer the question or is this just a - what did you call it - "cop out"?

E:

Again, the main point wasn't his character. He suggested low effort achievements, I made a comment that he seems to prefer low effort achievements. somehow that turns him into a casual, and went about claiming ad hominem the rest of the time. Not exactly my fault

you can easily determine intention of peoples words through context and what they suggest relative to what they are arguing against. Requires critical thinking champ.

You're not as subtle as you think you are.

[Bourne_Endeavor]

People complain every single season offering their "solutions." You can even see variations of these solutions in this thread quite easily as hyomin wants them to be a easy grind achievement.

Also Hyomin made the claim that they would probably nerf Ultimate to make it easy for people. This falls in line with her achievement solution which really is a want.

Also no, top 100 rewards should only be available to top 100 players. why do you keep trying to make it easier to obtain?

She claimed Ultimate may lose the ilvl sync based on the precedent set. They have never kept content permanently synced. Therefore, it's entirely reasonably to assume come 5.0 they will continue that trend. She never said she wanted it nerfed. That was you putting words in her mouth just as you have done with virtually everyone who responded.

Taking away the exclusivity doesn't make it easier. It makes it consistent. Why should Feast have timed exclusive mounts when Savage and Ultimate don't?

You can read your own comments and see yourself saying that Hellhound should be part of a PVE oriented achievement be they were connected to PVE in the first place. You don't like how pvp has a mount that PVE somehow has a right to. Give it up

I said no such thing, and you're more than welcome to quote me directly if you believe otherwise. You insisted PvP and PvE should be viewed separately. I pointed out the hypocrisy of that stance since the exclusive mounts came from PvE content, thus you can't claim PvP is wholly separate when its rewards are inspired from PvE.

In fact, I have no qualms with either mounts requiring active Feast or season participation. My only complaint is their exclusivity.

I said PVE. and yes I did prove you wrong by outlining how Hellhounds and the new mount were thematically connected to the wolves dens. So no, I am not agreeing with you, and you are still wrong, champ
;]

Curious that your post has a convenient edit attached to it while mine doesn't yet I quoted you directly. Are you that much of a child you need to flat out lie over a simple typo? Wow, indeed.

You will never convince me that increasing the threshold to 1000 would be fair, and you know it wouldn't be fair either.

Nor will you convince me Feast should have a timed exclusive mount only 660 people can obtain when every other piece of content has no such limitation. You simply want to lord your mounts over people.

Alas, we have reached an impasse.

[HyoMinPark]

You made it about character when you took offense at me calling your ideas casual friendly and zero effort. At that point, you didn't want to argue the point and centered your argument around claiming my posts were ad hominems and contained no content. Don't blame me when you were the one who took offense.

Oh, no. You don’t get to say that you were arguing against my achievements suggestion with those comments; you were explicitly attacking my character because I came in with a suggestion that differed from what you think should be the way of things.

TBH, you just don't like how you aren't able to achieve the same feats as others.

You see, this actually proves to me you don't really care about time exclusivity. It's more like you are afraid you can't get top 100 and it scares you.

You seem to have a problem with people not having the talent or skill to be capable of obtaining such items or mounts.

"Wow it's so hard SE please nerf and give me everything"

That is such a sad mentality

you need to get over the entitlement for things that you don't want to insert the same effort/skill for.

you are insecure about not being able to perform the same as players that do have the talent/hard work. So obviously you would want rewards to be easier to get. That is why you LIKE the idea of Ultimate having the ilvl sync removed in a later expansion. It is clearly the talk of a casual who wants to achieve the same feats as a talented player by wanting grindy achievements and plowing through old content with a lvl and gear advantage.

Again, the main point wasn't his character. He suggested low effort achievements, I made a comment that he seems to prefer low effort achievements. somehow that turns him into a casual, and went about claiming ad hominem the rest of the time. Not exactly my fault

No, no. You called me the casual. Here, let me quote it for you one more time:

you are insecure about not being able to perform the same as players that do have the talent/hard work. So obviously you would want rewards to be easier to get. That is why you LIKE the idea of Ultimate having the ilvl sync removed in a later expansion. It is clearly the talk of a casual who wants to achieve the same feats as a talented player by wanting grindy achievements and plowing through old content with a lvl and gear advantage.

I also find it high amusing—reading through other responses in this thread—that you got tilted at someone who supposedly put words in your mouth, and how they shouldn’t be allowed to insinuate things you never said, but you have zero qualms about doing that to others.

I in no way said what you are implying so don't say that I did.

And yes I will tell you how you feel because it is easy to discern by reading your post.

[Sindele]

It wasn't a cop out, this thread attracts players with a motive. When they don't like something they see, they come and complain. It was a direct response to you claiming that your side had some sort of validity by 1-2 "high end pvers" somehow means it must be a lot more.

Sorry if that was complicated for you, I reached my daily limit apparently, so I'm going to have to get off for now. Who knew there was a daily limit to posts!

Also, you took that quote after the debate became about ad hominem, it doesn't apply, good night

And yet, you still won't answer the actual question. How curious. Maybe you'll answer it tomorrow!

Also, your approach of claiming exception after the fact because you say so is not really how social interaction works. It might help you avoid moderation, but the nuance is not entirely lost on the court of public opinion.

Altogether a rather weak performance. You'll need to do much better for top 100 in Forum PVP.

[VanilleFang]

You will never convince me that increasing the threshold to 1000 would be fair, and you know it wouldn't be fair either.

Increasing the number of people who can obtain the mount by 10x would be unfair how exactly?

[Awha]

At the end of the day my argument is the top 100 rewards shouldn't be easily obtainable through low effort means that favor casuals. If you feel insulted by that fact maybe you should take a moment to reflect on that

Taking this to an extreme if every player was mailed the same rewards as the top 100 how does that detract from your personal experience earning the rewards in an activity you--hopefully--enjoy. Now if you took part in the activity out of personal enjoyment no amount of players having the same item inherently cheapen your enjoyment / accomplishment. Since the value of the accomplishment and the rewards that come with it are determined by you personally.

Now if you solely want the notoriety and the accolades that come with the accomplishment then yeah I can see how having one million players with the rewards would detract from the value of the rewards.

However, if enjoyment is the primary reason, only person that can detract from the value of the accomplishment and the rewards that follow are yourself. Really just comes down to why you took part in the activity. Also even if enjoyment was your primary reason that does not mean notoriety and accolades would not follow just so happens that if everyone had the rewards not as many people would acknowledge the feat, but is that such a bad thing that random player 1234 does not know the truth behind what you went through to get said rewards?

Snip . . .

Answer me follow if possible and the above segment if one million players obtain the item through a different means outside getting top 100 how does that inherently detract from the effort you put in to reach such a rank.

No one can ever take that away from you as a pvper, I understand grinding for ranks I have done it in other games, and even in those games I truly do not understand what is the point of asking developers to waste man hours on an item that a tiny fraction of the player base will ever get to see. As I mentioned before only way such an action detracts from the value of the rewards be title, mount, or armor is either is if you personal let one million players having the same rewards detract from the effort and experience you put towards obtaining said rewards.

I simply do not see how more people having the same reward for whatever reason nullifies the effort you put to receive the reward unless in the end you did not take part simply for the enjoyment and the catch to see how well you fared verse other skilled players. Now if you did it for solely for notoriety and the accolades then yes as I mentioned before in this thread any change would to the reward system would detract from the value of your rewards and achievements since player 1234 over time will see your title or mount and will assume that you received said mount the easy way. Which would matter if you cared what random player 1234 thought, and thus letting said player detract from the personal effort you and those around you know what you went through. Which would mean that in practice while I hate to use this phrase the real reason you are upset is that people are asking to limit how many players current and future will view you unique in turn a special snowflake. Which to be blunt is not wrong, I just wish people were more upfront about it that is all.

No shame in doing something simply for the notoriety and the accolades that come with being the deemed the best.

Sure my situation is an extreme.

[Alleo]

Please people, stop doing this comparison. Savage mounts can be obtained at any time.

And that is exactly the problem that people have. Savage is the hardest content in the game and yet even the people that beated it never get something truly exclusive. They only have it for a bit of a time and later on people can just unsynch it and get the same stuff. Heck the hardest content in the game Ultimate has just re-colored old weapons.

Yet PVP gets quite the new stuff all the time. Nice unique looking glamour and now even nice mounts and things like the hellhounds was something the people wished for in PVE content. And on top of that its the only content in this game that as a time and number limit at the same time. Why is that fine with PVP would stuff like savage does not get that?

[Crit]

all of you that are arguing that the mount is too exclusive and unfair are literally being dumb hypocrits.

you complain about the mount being too exclusive, what about the trophy that only 6 people get in the world????? oh right you want the mount so you complain about it like the selfish casual you are.

just work for it, its not hard.