Dev blog: New Feast rewards

[Aviars]

LOL, what? I don’t care about PvP at all in this game; I don’t even care about the Hellhounds, nor this mount. But I know of people that do, and I just think the exclusivity is stupid. These mounts were highly requested by the general playerbase, and the developers tossed them in the Feast (extremely niche content) to try and incentivize people do to the Feast, which isn’t really working considering it’s limited to Top 100 per Data Center anyways. The Centurio Tiger is locked behind the most obscenely ridiculous achievements in this game, and it’s far more effective in getting people to participate in Hunts than the Hellhounds or Hojo-Wannabe Chair (at least on my server, the Hunt community is far more active than it was in the past). Because even if it takes you 3 years to get the Tiger, you can still obtain it later. You can’t do that with these mounts.

If it ever came down to it, I would think that top 100 players in futures seasons can forfeit the current seasons top 100 reward for a past one if they so chose. Even though I don't agree with it. that is by for the most reasonable compromise out there.

I doubt the developers will keep the level 70 / i340 sync once 5.0 is released. Even if they do, though, you can still obtain the weapon and the title far after its period of relevancy. The point people are trying to make with you is that these aren’t obtainable later via other means, and such exclusivity is ridiculous since they don’t apply it to any other aspect in this game.

What you think they will do is irrelevant. If that was true they wouldn't have added ilvl sync in the first place.

Nah the biggest point is the time exclusivity, and I have already said that if top 100 players from future seasons want to forfeit the current seasons reward for a past one, that would be fine. You seem to have a problem with people not having the talent or skill to be capable of obtaining such items or mounts. However Ultimate is already non-reachable for about 99.9% of the playerbase.

"Wow it's so hard SE please nerf and give me everything"

That is such a sad mentality

I feel like I have to repeat: I don’t care about PvP in this game; never have, and it has zero to do with the mounts and more the fact that I don’t care for the content in general.

I just don’t see the need for exclusivity, especially for a mount that people requested multiple times (e.g., the Hellhound mount), and was thrown into a niche piece of content AND made ridiculously exclusive on four separate occasions, killing chances of more casual PvPers (or even people that have no interest in PvP but would try for it in the event that they wanted to try and get the mount) wanting to even shoot for it.

The community requests and wants everything. Not everything is made for you, you need to get over the entitlement for things that you don't want to insert the same effort/skill for.

Exclusivity is overrated.

Even with locking older PvP mounts behind “grindy achievements” an entire expansion later (thereby giving those Top 100 time to “enjoy” their “exclusivity”), said achievements would still require you to actually put forth enough effort to win the matches. The mount behind the grindiest achievement in this game is, again, more effective at drawing people into doing its relevant content than PvP is with it’s mounts. And that’s all these mounts are: a thinly veiled incentive to try and draw people into PvP, but having them unobtainable unless you are the “best of the best” turns a lot of people off.

But, please. Feel free to tell me more about how I feel. Since you are so knowledgable about it all.

first off all, you act like people spam hunts for the mount, there are other aspects of hunts that are useful and far more relavent then the mount. Stop acting like people do hunts for the sole reason of the mount. It is disingenuous and just not true.

And yes I will tell you how you feel because it is easy to discern by reading your post. By saying things like " unobtainable unless you are the “best of the best” turns a lot of people off" just shows you are insecure about not being able to perform the same as players that do have the talent/hard work. So obviously you would want rewards to be easier to get. That is why you LIKE the idea of Ultimate having the ilvl sync removed in a later expansion. It is clearly the talk of a casual who wants to achieve the same feats as a talented player by wanting grindy achievements and plowing through old content with a lvl and gear advantage.

It is clear as day, sorry buddy.

[Aviars]

Unique abilities does not make it comparable to a separate game. I never denied Feast has rewards not exclusive. If you bothered to read my actual posts, you'd have noticed. I'll reiterate, Feast is the only content in FFXIV that has exclusive content that can only ever be obtained at one time. Just because you couldn't refute the LoV argument doesn't make it self-defeating, hun.

I did refute the LoV argument for one thing, maybe you should actually read? hun ;]


I said in a post just now that I am open to the idea of allowing top 100 players to forfeit the current seasons reward for a past top 100 reward in it's place. Even though I disagree, it is a compromise that is as good as I will make it. So it's whatever. A majority of people I am arguing with want it for the gold saucer or some lazy grinding achievement and I would never agree to such blatant casualization of rewards.

I never said content relied on them. You're erected strawmens now. What I said is they have been a ubiquitous reward for PvE yet never made exclusive whereas twice now they have been in PvP.

You made the claim that the rewards only had connections to PVE and therefore they shouldn't be a part of pvp, reread your own comment.

You keep putting words in my mouth and trying to sound smug. It's cute. I never said there isn't a reason to have PvP rewards. I said they shouldn't be exclusive because no other content in the game operates this way. As for your subjective stance. You keep prattling on about how PvP should be viewed separately from PvE. So why create mounts out of mini bosses from PvP content? It's far more likely they chose those mounts due to people's repeated requests. Putting them in Feasts may get people to play the mode.

I didn't say you said that pvp shouldn't have rewards. You made the claim that PVE had more of a right to the exclusive mounts and I proved you wrong. It is quite simple.

... either you are being willfully obtuse or are just completely daft. By your own admission above, this makes Feast mount rewards exclusive whereas Ultimate rewards aren't. That is the whole argument. Nothing from Ultimate is exclusive because the requirements never change. Even if left gated by ilvl, you can go back in 5.0 and still obtain everything. Hellhounds can never be obtained again unless they are brought back. This inherently makes Feast have exclusive content whereas nothing else in the game does.

The ranked Feast requirements don't change either, that was the whole point of the argument. To receive certain rewards you are required to play in that season and get top 100 in that season. That requirement does not change. I really can't make it simpler than that champ.

[HyoMinPark]

What you think they will do is irrelevant. If that was true they wouldn't have added ilvl sync in the first place.

Let me repeat myself since you seem to have missed what I said the first time: even if the ilvl sync was never removed, you can still obtain the weapons and the titles any time you want. The thing people dislike with the Hellhounds and this mount are that you cannot get them unless you are Top 100 during their relative season. Nothing else in this game follows such exclusivity.

I’m only saying I doubt they’ll consider leaving older Ultimates locked behind level and ilvl syncs when new expansions come out because there will be new Ultimates at that point, since they have claimed that UCoB is not the first and only of its kind. With a new expansion, they will probably figure that there’s no need to maintain the syncs anymore.

It doesn’t matter to me if they remove it, or if they don’t. The entire point is that the title and weapons can always be obtained if you put forth the time/effort to get them. These cannot, and that’s what people dislike.

You seem to have a problem with people not having the talent or skill to be capable of obtaining such items or mounts. However Ultimate is already non-reachable for about 99.9% of the playerbase.

You’re not familiar with my posts at all if you think that I think people should be able to obtain rewards without earning them. Please browse through my post history before you start making assumptions, my friend. They are very unbecoming.

"Wow it's so hard SE please nerf and give me everything"

That is such a sad mentality

Except I never said that. Feel free to quote directly where I said that. I will wait.

The community requests and wants everything. Not everything is made for you, you need to get over the entitlement for things that you don't want to insert the same effort/skill for.

The general community asked for a mount. The developers stuck it in PvP. I don’t care one way or another about Hellhound mounts; I’m not a collector of mounts (I prefer minions). But the PvPers weren’t asking for these mounts; the general/casual playerbase were.

I think you should look up the definition for “entitlement” since you clearly don’t know what it means if you’re trying to insinuate that I’m the entitled one in this conversation. Not that the word has much meaning anymore with the way people throw it around nowadays.

first off all, you act like people spam hunts for the mount, there are other aspects of hunts that are useful and far more relavent then the mount. Stop acting like people do hunts for the sole reason of the mount. It is disingenuous and just not true.

Except, they do? Why do you think people continue to do Hunts? It’s not just for the cracked clusters/materia (which the game barfs at you already), or for Centurio Seals (which, if you don’t need VI materia, after you get the riding maps, emotes, and minions from it, are useless).

What’s disingenuous is you continuing to put words in people’s mouths. Please stop if you want to have an actual debate with people.

And yes I will tell you how you feel because it is easy to discern by reading your post. By saying things like " unobtainable unless you are the “best of the best” turns a lot of people off" just shows you are insecure about not being able to perform the same as players that do have the talent/hard work.

I don’t need exclusive mounts to feel like I have more skill or can “perform the same as players that do have the talent/hard work” when I know that I can. I don’t know how else I can tell you that I don’t give two flyings about PvP in this game. I don’t put the effort into PvP because I don’t care about it. My cup of tea lies with Savage/Ultimate. That’s where my effort goes.

That is why you LIKE the idea of Ultimate having the ilvl sync removed in a later expansion. So obviously you would want rewards to be easier to get. That is why you LIKE the idea of Ultimate having the ilvl sync removed in a later expansion.

Where did I ever say that I LIKED the idea of Ultimate removing it’s sync? Please point that out to me. Quote me directly. Because, as it is now, you are just putting words in my mouth because you can’t provide valid enough points to back up your own arguments. And you would rather resort to ad hominem to try and defend yourself than debate the actual argument at hand.

It is clearly the talk of a casual who wants to achieve the same feats as a talented player by wanting grindy achievements and plowing through old content with a lvl and gear advantage.

It is clear as day, sorry buddy.

Not that it’s any of your business what type of player I am, but I am a “casual” that is progging V8S and who has seen to Blackfire Trio in Ultimate. Clearly, I am a filthy casual.. Who wants to achieve the same feast as a talented player via grindy achievements via level and gear advantages.

Why don’t you stop focusing so much on ad hominem and debate the actual argument? Since you can only seem to argue by attacking the character of people who disagree with you.

[Rieze_Xeero]

We already gave SE the best idea to promote the feast, and it is via wolf collars with good rewards including mounts. So its now up to them to capitalize on that.

As for Aviars, I give my hat to you man. You really are debating with everyone who post on this thread even if the reason is fair and logical.

[Bourne_Endeavor]

I did refute the LoV argument for one thing, maybe you should actually read? hun ;]

Poorly.

A majority of people I am arguing with want it for the gold saucer or some lazy grinding achievement and I would never agree to such blatant casualization of rewards.

Please quote those people and highlight them specifically saying such because thus far, you have only made baseless assumptions or flat out put words in other people's mouths to justify your bias. I needs only look above for an example. Nowhere in Hyomin's post did she mention removing the ilvl sync from Ultimate nor did she ever once insinuate wanting things nerfed yet you assumed that stance just as you have in your replies with me. With all that said, I'll be crystal clear in how I believe the system ought to change.

Top 100 - 50 Wolf tokens
Top 500 - 25 Wolf tokens
Top 1,000 - 10 Wolf tokens

Each prize will always remain available for purchase but those who perform better will be able to purchase it faster. This removes the exclusivity of each mount without making them an easily obtainable reward.

You made the claim that the rewards only had connections to PVE and therefore they shouldn't be a part of pvp, reread your own comment.

I did not. I said they were ubiquitous as a reward for PvE. To simplify, the overwhelm majority of mounts are made available through some form of PvE content and none are exclusive.

I didn't say you said that pvp shouldn't have rewards. You made the claim that PVP had more of a right to the exclusive mounts and I proved you wrong. It is quite simple.

... I assume you mean PvE because the wording of this implies I was arguing for PvP mount exclusivity. If you proved me wrong in that context, well, you're actually agreeing with me. Soooo

The ranked Feast requirements don't change either, that was the whole point of the argument. To receive certain rewards you are required to play in that season and get top 100 in that season. That requirement does not change. I really can't make it simpler than that champ.

Nor can I, champ. Feast requirements are timed exclusives whereas Ultimate isn't. The whole crux of this argument has been Feast shouldn't have exclusive rewards that can only be obtained during a season if no other content in the entire game has equivalently timed exclusives. To simplify even further...

Dreadwyrm weapons can be obtained from patch 4.1 onward.
Hellhound could only be obtained in 3.55

Can't make it any clearer.

[HyoMinPark]

^ In regards to this, HyoMin. You seem to totally ignore Aviars suggestion of having Top 100 players being able to choose a singular prize from a pool of previous prizes. This means that you can still obtain the previous prizes any time you want as long as you put in the time, effort and skill required to obtain top 100. Similar to your reasoning that you can obtain the Ultimate Coil weapons and title anytime you want - as long as you put in the time, effort and skill as well.

I took note of their compromise. But it was lost in their sea of assumptions personal attacks against me for just disagreeing with the idea of exclusivity in general (e.g., in regards to everything in this game). If someone wants to make suggestions/compromises, they should probably refrain from ad hominem while they’re at it. It would make people far more receptive when it came to listening to them.

I suggested the “grindy achievements” for Hellhounds an entire expansion after their relevant Feast Seasons, and was accused of being “a casual” that is “entitled” and “just wants everything handed to me” even though I have zero interest in PvP mounts in general; it was a compromise more so for those that would want them and who either couldn’t get them when they were in the revelant season because their rank wasn’t high enough, who weren’t even playing at the time, whatever the reason is. But how can anyone have civilized debates with people who resort to comments like that? Debate the argument, not the character of the person who is making the argument. If you can’t do that, then you have no argument, and choose instead to attack the opposing party.

I’m stepping out of this thread. I’m not even a PvPer, so I shouldn’t have even tried to talk with those who do.

[Rieze_Xeero]

I took note of their compromise. But it was lost in their sea of assumptions personal attacks against me for just disagreeing with the idea of exclusivity in general (e.g., in regards to everything in this game). If someone wants to make suggestions/compromises, they should probably refrain from ad hominem while they’re at it. It would make people far more receptive when it came to listening to them.

Yeah it went too far actually. Just a simple suggestion and compromise would be enough and beside it is in the hands of SE still so we all don't have any "power" to do anything.

[Rieze_Xeero]

Make the prizes obtainable via grindable achievements simply destroys the point of rankings entirely. Just have training mode and be done with it. Why put in the stress of ratings and ranked mode at all if there's nothing to obtain.

You seem to don't understand how long will it take to "grind" for wolf collars if they would add more rewards to that. Since it is given every end of the season (3 lowest if bronze), it would take more than a year for you to get 10 collars granted if you get to bronze. Meaning you would still need to work hard for your rating to get the reward. They can not add the top 100 mounts that's fine but I think they really should be capitalizing on it's potential to promote the feast. If you don't see that then you are being narrow minded.

I still believe collectibles is not the best reward for PVP, titles and unique armors/weapons is the best.

[Aviars]

Let me repeat myself since you seem to have missed what I said the first time: even if the ilvl sync was never removed, you can still obtain the weapons and the titles any time you want.

And I did mention a compromise in my response, but you seemed to ignore it. Seems like you prefer lazy, zero effort grinding achievement by ignoring it.

I’m only saying I doubt they’ll consider leaving older Ultimates locked behind level and ilvl syncs when new expansions come out because there will be new Ultimates at that point, since they have claimed that UCoB is not the first and only of its kind.

so that automatically means they'll nerf it, gotcha. Nice reasoning

You’re not familiar with my posts at all if you think that I think people should be able to obtain rewards without earning them. Please browse through my post history before you start making assumptions, my friend. They are very unbecoming.

I think promoting a grinding achievement over my suggested compromise is very much you saying people should be able to earn those rewards with no effort. Getting top 100 versus grinding games out are on the two extremes of difficulty and you suggest the easiest one.

Except I never said that. Feel free to quote directly where I said that. I will wait.

Advocating a grinding achievement rather than having available in some form to future top 100 players is asking to nerf requirements. lol, maybe you should read your own posts?

The general community asked for a mount. The developers stuck it in PvP. I don’t care one way or another about Hellhound mounts; I’m not a collector. But the PvPers weren’t asking for these mounts.

I think you should look up the definition for “entitlement” since you clearly don’t know what it means if you’re trying to insinuate that I’m the entitled one in this conversation. Not that the word has much meaning anymore with the way people throw it around nowadays.

Again, the general community wants and asks for everything. The PVP community also wants things too. Don't be surprised if PVP actually receives something for once, it makes you look salted.

You also sound entitled due to the fact that you want to make certain content easier. that is not how life works buddy.

Except, they do? Why do you think people continue to do Hunts? It’s not just for the cracked clusters/materia (which the game barfs at you already), or for Centurio Seals (which, if you don’t need materia, after you get the riding maps, emotes, and minions from it, are useless).

What’s disingenuous is you continuing to put words in people’s mouths. Please stop if you want to have an actual debate with people.

You made the claim the main purpose was for a extremely grindy achievement and completely ignore the other more relevant benefits hunts give.

And no I am not putting words into your mouth, you can easily determine intention of peoples words through context and what they suggest relative to what they are arguing against. Requires critical thinking champ.

I don’t need exclusive mounts to feel like I have more skill or can “perform the same as players that do have the talent/hard work” when I know that I can. I don’t know how else I can tell you that I don’t give two flyings about PvP in this game. I don’t put the effort into PvP because I don’t care about it. My cup of tea lies with Savage/Ultimate.

Ya, you know you can so you want to make the requirements for mounts easier through grindy no effort achievements because you already know you are a great player huh? LOL

Where did I ever say that I LIKED the idea of Ultimate removing it’s sync? Please point that out to me. Quote me directly. Because, as it is now, you are just putting words in my mouth because you can’t provide valid enough points to back up your own arguments. And you would rather resort to ad hominem to try and defend yourself than debate the actual argument at hand.

You consistently make suggestions for making everything available through grindy no effort achievements. It's quite clear that at the end of the day. If you actually cared about keeping things hard for people you wouldn't make such a suggestion

Not that it’s any of your business what type of player I am, but I am a “casual” that is progging V8S and who has seen to Blackfire Trio in Ultimate. Clearly, I am a filthy casual.. Who wants to achieve the same feast as a talented player via grindy achievements via level and gear advantages.

Why don’t you stop focusing so much on ad hominem and debate the actual argument? Since you can only seem to argue by attacking the character of people who disagree with you.

You are quite clearly casual when it comes to pvp. and you do make comments that make things way too easy for people of that nature to receive the same rewards as top 100 players.

At the end of the day my argument is the top 100 rewards shouldn't be easily obtainable through low effort means that favor casuals. If you feel insulted by that fact maybe you should take a moment to reflect on that

[Aviars]

You seem to don't understand how long will it take to "grind" for wolf collars if they would add more rewards to that. Since it is given every end of the season (3 lowest if bronze), it would take more than a year for you to get 10 collars granted if you get to bronze. Meaning you would still need to work hard for your rating to get the reward. They can not add the top 100 mounts that's fine but I think they really should be capitalizing on it's potential to promote the feast. If you don't see that then you are being narrow minded.

I still believe collectibles is not the best reward for PVP, titles and unique armors/weapons is the best.

Wolf collars are the very definition of low effort. You can win 10 games to get bronze and at that point you just wait.

top 100 rewards should remain for players who achieve top 100

If there needs to be more incentive for wolf collars I am totally for giving wolf collars other rewards that aren't top 100 related