Just played Final Fantasy XI

[AnimaAnimus]

This

Let me extend this.

As someone who just rolled another char on a different server outta sheer boredom, the msq is mind numbingly boring and monotonous as all get out. Not to mention the fetch quests, and more fetch quests and yes even more fetch quests.

But you go back and reroll a char on XI and the story still holds up. Its still exciting to re-experience. The world....feels alive and truly in danger. Sure it can be long winded in parts but damn does it tell a good story overall. From the expac main quests, to the mini expacs and the little side stories you come across. You don't just bust through them to get them done. You experience them.

[Cakekizyy]

In XIV you can't get to max level without going through the expansion so it's kind of a weird comparison.

What would stop you from doing so?

[Talraen]

Took a break from XIV to return to XI a couple of years ago. Now I come back to XIV for patch day, or a week for the xpac, but find it hard to stay. Coming up to 4.2, am trying to get back into XIV with friends so we can play the upcoming endgame challenges, but... it's so dull.

On my PC next to me runs XI - not XI from 2004 or 2009 or 2012, but XI from 2018. It's updated monthly with content. Of course, there's been no budget for new zones or monsters since 2015, but we do get new reward systems, tougher challenges at endgame, more gear which isn't just better stats than the last (aside from upgraded gear) and can be used in the different situations presented. The game is *deep*, and that's not just because it's had 16 years compared to XIV's 8, but because of the base design and the producers' ethic.

If you think FFXIV has gotten dull and repetitive, that's a perfectly valid complaint. I don't really feel that way myself, but I understand it. But if FFXIV does need to evolve, it most certainly does not need to evolve into FFXI. That's the problem I have with this line of thought, and I'll give a few specific reasons why.

XIV started off so well, using newer tech to create a game that XI could never be. It's story was great and it was dangerous. With ARR everything got dumbed down, your hand was held, and DF meant that you could ignore all other players if you chose to for everything except a single series of fights per patch. I accepted that because 1.0 was financial ruin and subscriptions were needed, so if we could be part of a slicker, more beautiful version of everything that was already out there, then fine (and I love XIV's UI to bits).

Most of FFXI was not "dangerous." It would be, if Sneak, Invisible, and the items that granted them didn't exist. But I never saw anyone actually run through zones without them, except on low-level runs to get to a different starting city. The fact that everyone used Sneak and Invis to go literally anywhere dangerous is because danger is not actually fun. Also not fun: having to waste items or constantly recast spells to move. Also not fun: making one mistake and losing an hour or more of travel since mobs would literally never stop chasing you. Or getting to the zone line and being killed anyway because of the free hits they got when you were loading. What part of any of that makes the game better? It makes it slower and more frustrating.

It's true that the duty finder means you could ignore all other players, which in turn means that far more players can play the game. Making the game an exclusive club might be fun for the people in the club, but it's not a good financial strategy. It's not going to happen.

Also not for nothing, but 1.0 failed because it was bad. And I loved 1.0. The original crafting system seemed to be designed specifically for my exact personality. But if a game only appeals to a small handful of players, it is a failure. And 1.0 was a failure. Also its story barely existed, so I'm not really sure what made it "great."

But then 3.0 came and it was the same again in a different skin. We got a lot of extra fluff, but gear continued to be discarded entirely each patch - a side-effect of a huge lack of character stats and gear being able to influence individual abilities. Patches spread out, and story/quest content in them was reduced to 2hrs play at most every four months (by quest, not meaning relic grind here).

4.0 was the final straw. For those two weeks, it was a fantastic ride. Loved the zones, loved the music, loved the characters, loved the story, loved the trials and the raid. But then... left with repetition. Repetition in the knowledge that it would all go up in flames come 4.1, come 4.2... etc.

Vertical leveling isn't going anywhere. Horizontal leveling is hostile to new players. You may love going back three expansions and grinding out one fight over and over to get a particular drop that gives a 2% advantage and is thus absolutely required for some totally unrelated content due to a coincidental use of some weird, unique ability, but most people don't. All they hear is "you can't do this content unless you do this other content." And in FFXI that probably meant doing it yourself. Or calling your friend at 2 AM to get his help killing Argus in your twelfth unsuccessful attempt to get whatever he dropped (peacock charm?).

And as a reminder, if you don't have to do all that, then horizontal leveling is meaningless. Literally the only appeal it has is keeping old gear relevant.

I'm not going to lie; knowing I get to fight Byakko, to ride the Phantom Train, excites me a little because it feels like it's going to be fun. But then on week 2 when I have to do it again? Week 3? I'm worried Eureka will be another Palace of the Dead or PvP - a complete achievement system outside your character than lands a new piece of gear that stays relevant for one patch like everything else. And something you have to play so often that it destroys the very will to play it.

So I turn back to FFXI. I've got 22 jobs to choose from - levelling to cap only takes a few days. Gearing up solo via dozens of different types of content, a few weeks. Bringing the job to a group to work on final upgrades, whilst perhaps obtaining extra pieces for that job and others is broad and healthy progression. Helping out the new and returning players that arrive in Vana'diel every day (even on a smaller server like Shiva) is renewing and forging new bonds.

I don't understand this. You don't want to continuously replay well-designed instanced dungeons and trials, but you're perfectly willing to grind exp, not to mention JP if you're actually doing any hard content, on 22 jobs? You know what I spend my time doing in FFXIV? I level up all 26 classes to max level, to experience the unique story that every single one of them has. (Actually there are 27 class/job storylines, thanks to Scholar.) FFXI's job-specific stories end with AF. The last 50 levels, and all of your job points, are a mindless grind with no content payoff. But that's less boring than having to run the same dungeons for four months at a time until you get brand new ones? I confess I can't understand that.

Overall FFXI *was* the best of the two, and then it wasn't. Then FFXIV was the better of the two for a long time, but it slipped a couple of years ago. FFXI has maintained integrity since its (presumably) final form in 2015, whereas FFXIV has stagnated with resources being spent on fixing a housing mess that should never have happened, mini-games requiring whole new systems with lastability measured in hours, dozens of sets of armour which the playerbase wear for a fortnight and then discard forever, (I'm not gonna say PvP...) PvP, and not enough lore, character development, exciting plots or frequent updates.

Sorry for so much rambling. I hope FFXIV gets better again soon. I'll stay subbed to both, as always^^

Which game has better plots is a matter of opinion, but FFXIV having "not enough lore"? It has as much as FFXI did, if not far more. There are many, many more story quests with much, much more dialogue. There are plenty of side quests, and none of them require jumping through incredibly annoying hoops to finish. I got every map in FFXI before they made that easy, I know. Character development? FFXIV has been developing its main cast since 1.0, FFXI discards almost the entirety of the cast outside of your character between expansions, since they aren't connected and therefore they can make no assumptions about what you've done before. FFXIV is updated more frequently than FFXI ever was, and don't act like adding a few new fights and the 400th different currency compares to actual new assets and content. I've been very impressed at FFXI's end-of-life update cycle, but come on now.

It's not even particularly fair to compare FFXI now to FFXIV, because FFXI is only playable now because they've made it more like FFXIV. Trusts mean you can do all the content up to endgame solo. The ridiculous network of travel options make getting places easy. All the reward systems make it very easy to gear up at any level. This is nothing like what the FFXI experience actually was. Right now, FFXI is nothing but endgame, because only hardcore players are still playing. Making FFXIV for the hardcore only is a terrible idea that would kill the game.

I love that people still play FFXI. The best part is, it's still running! If you want that game, play it. Keep its archaic systems out of FFXIV, though.

[Yasuhiro]

I'm pretty new to Final Fantasy XI just started playing late 2015 and I love it. My only regret is not being able to play it in its prime because when I was little my parents would have had to pay a sub fee and they were put off by that so I had to settle with Final Fantasy X to keep me going.

Lovely game and the graphics still look great even today.

[Jkap_Goat]

I played ffxi free trial for a week ,three months ago, and it was so much fun getting lost and literally chasing me all over the zone without losing aggro from a certain feet and getting killed. Man I felt hopeless and it was a such a good feeling. I wish I could have played ffxi in it's prime but I didn't have the money or funds to get internet and a ps2 because it was expensive at the time.




I want to be a dancer

[Cakekizyy]

I would love playing some FFXI but don't wanna drag out 360 and my PC hates me right now. Would love a PS4 version.

[Thayos]

FFXI in its prime was amazing. It's still decent now, but not at all friendly to new players.

FFXIV is good too, but whether you play now (prime years) or like five years later really won't matter, assuming the formula doesn't change. In fact, you could disappear for five years, come back and be caught up in a month! That's the blessing and the curse of XIV. It's a great appointment game that doesn't require much work.

I actually prefer XIV these days because I'm busier and have less time. But that doesn't change the fact that after a couple of expansion cycles this game gets downright boring.

[Naraku_Diabolos]

Unfortunately what stands out is the last day I played. I spent 3 hours waiting for a leveling party in Juno, (Jeuno?) mostly because I was an undesireable job/race combo of Galka Dark knight and when I finally got a party we wiped twice almost immediately to a caterpillar and someone training the NM in the area to us (mushushu I think). I de-leveled, and could no longer wear all of my AF and had to drop out. I stood there in my home city again.. thought long and hard about how much time I had essentially just wasted.. and quit. Never subbed again.

This is exactly why I quit for good. I could not find a party anymore, and there wasn't anyone to do content with me. Of course there were those Trust NPCs, but I failed to unlock them because no one would help me. Sure there are guides online, but still. Being all alone, it was the end for me playing any longer.

[wizisi2k]

hate to tell you but a couple months after the final content update, support for consoles went away. However, because you have a account on xbox 360, you can install the game on PC after obtaining from anywhere and login with your old credentials-provided your sub for FFXI is paid.

[Krotoan]

This is exactly why I quit for good. I could not find a party anymore, and there wasn't anyone to do content with me. Of course there were those Trust NPCs, but I failed to unlock them because no one would help me. Sure there are guides online, but still. Being all alone, it was the end for me playing any longer.

Trust NPC's didn't exist when I quit. It was party or nothing, when you found a good party you kept going till you actually hurt or were starving because god knew when you'd find a good party again. ..uphill.. in the snow... both ways =] I'm such a fogey. Oh well. It was fun when I got to adventure, but the leveling grind and absolute dependence on synergistic parties was not for me at the end.