Discrimination of certain jobs - your opinion

[Lord_Zlatan]

A clear is a clear. Doesn't matter how you get it.

This all day. For most people this is the situation they are facing and just want a clear.

[Altera]

This is how I have felt towards anything Shinryu EX and upwards contentwise as BLM sadly. If 4.2 doesn't bring big changes to BLM, I might return to WOW for a while, or play other singleplayer games until they do sort the classes out.

[TenguNakata]

Players are not locked to a single job. They can freely choose which job they're going to play. If I've been playing job X but I'd be more useful on job Y, I can switch to job Y. The "skill" and "chemistry" are unchanged, but I've increased my usefulness to the team.

Yay! First post. Anyway, that's of course a valid argument. But this is not just about one person in particular (Ama) and I'm certain he/she can still raid Savages like every other person, it's a fundamental problem known to the 'endgame playerbase' that a couple of jobs at the moment are behind all the other jobs (BLM, SAM) in value and a increase in their value would be welcoming. That means exclusion wouldn't even be an issue. That's what patches are there for, and we have seen it with other jobs as well - I am not going into whether it was actually a positive change, because there are a hundred different opinions on job changes.

For me, personally, it took a lot of my spare time and life to get my jobs to where they are now. Getting for example a NIN to the point where a good SAM is (or a MCH, whatever job really) requires dedication and playtime. It's fine if a person wants to focus on a particular job or two and as far as I can see he/she is also levelling a WAR - to be able to switch classes I presume.

I don't think the whole 'you should be able to play more classes to be valuable to your group; adapt or die' is getting this discussion anywhere good. It's all personal preferences and has nothing to do with the main problem that got addressed here by many other gamers as well.

It's not about elitism. The guy ASKED for opinions. Should I walk on eggshells?

...

True, FF14 does not have anything like that. If that person is trying to be the %100 best at something (Sam) he/she should expect that others want to be %100 best at what they want. That is what the person said they want. I'm saying sometimes you need to adapt.

First of all, I wouldn't make the assumption that everyone is a guy. Be a bit more decent m8. Secondly, you don't need to walk on eggshells but you also don't need to be as harsh as you are. And lastly, it's not about a single person getting excluded from some content here. It's about the bigger picture, and the bigger picture is that both BLM and SAM are in a bad spot and need adjustment.
Also, people requesting meta in PF can usually not even pull their own weight, and as many others stated here before some of them don't even know what they are talking about really or how to make use of it.

[Raikki]

For me, personally, it took a lot of my spare time and life to get my jobs to where they are now. Getting for example a NIN to the point where a good SAM is (or a MCH, whatever job really) requires dedication and playtime.

That's true, which is why I'm still sympathetic when someone has invested their time in a class only to have it turn out to be not so great. However, I do think this game does a pretty good job lending you a hand in that regard. Not only do you get hefty EXP bonuses on leveling alt jobs, but in a lot of cases there's shared gear, so if they wanted to try playing MNK until SAM gets sorted out they already have everything short of the weapon for it (likewise for BLM -> RDM/SMN). We can't fix these jobs on our own, so I'm just trying to urge people who are having a bad time right now to try out some other stuff in the meantime. There are lots of fun jobs to play in this game and it can be really rewarding to learn multiple!

[Lilseph]

Simple: A super optimal composition is nice if you want to speedrun, or pad your numbers in fflogs. For clearing purposes alone, it doesn't matter.

[TenguNakata]

That's true, which is why I'm still sympathetic when someone has invested their time in a class only to have it turn out to be not so great. (...) We can't fix these jobs on our own, so I'm just trying to urge people who are having a bad time right now to try out some other stuff in the meantime. There are lots of fun jobs to play in this game and it can be really rewarding to learn multiple!

Definitely! I agree with you there 100%. But there is no arguing that the devs need to make some changes. The first job that needs to be fixed is BLM, indeed, but if you introduce a new job and it doesn't work as well as you expected it to work, then you need to see that and tackle the issue. It's up to SE really, not us, that much is right. It's still good to voice opinions, I mean that much we can do.

[Bourne_Endeavor]

Or play the game (emphasis on this being a game and a form of entertainment) and have FUN playing what you want to play.....

Take your "non optimal setup" and leave it in the trash. I've seen plenty of those "non optimal setups" do better than the "meta". It takes skill and chemistry, not the class you play to decide how well you and your team will be able to perform.

Team player with 25+ years experience my foot.

What if those players find fun taking advantage of optimization and squeezing the absolute best results? If someone sets up a PF and decides to lock specific jobs, who are you to tell them otherwise? They have just as much a right to dictate what jobs they want for their party as you do allowing open access.

[akaneakki]

The elitism grows....)

Yawn. Helping others is elitism, correcting others are eltism, I can go all day whatever people call elitism.

[LalaRu]

I found it increasingly hard to get into groups as SAM

You can down everything with any job, so your problem is not the game but facing greedy people that wants make the kill as fast and easy as possible.

Then, pugs are pugs, you can expect nothing from them. More you go towards raiding, less you can rely on pugs.

Get a static or a FC suited to your needs.

[AmaSagahl]

@Kaldea

I'm not emotional or irrational. I told everyone what I observed - and as I stated before, out of 10 groups there are probably about 6 with job restrictions. Which is not 80%, that's true. I corrected my initial post.

I managed to hit 4.9k yesterday without the meta comp on o1s - so I request to cut me some slack. I'm also not here to discuss my dps with you. I am playing this game since 3 months and I'm doing my best to improve, so don't get down on a personal level please. You are basically also making this a lot about me, when it is not just about me. It was mainly a discussion about the value of SAM, and in that matter also BLM - because it's not any different, even though in a worse spot.
I have absolutely no patience for that, and I am also not agreeing on all of your points so let's just leave it at that


@Bobs

What Tengu Nakata said. Also, I am not a guy!


@Raikki

Yeah, I get your point. And also agreed on the fact that it would be easy trying out MCH, and that SE has a good system there with gear sharing. It's just not the solution to the problems.