Let's add an option, SE [Previous PVP System]

[Wintersandman]

The 70 abilities combined with the old 60 ones would break the game. You think healing is bad now. Just keep it at 60.

We have the 70 abilities now. I don't see how it would break anything.

[RiyahArp]

We have the 70 abilities now. I don't see how it would break anything.

For healing as a white mage, that means not only would i have medica 2, regen, sacred prism, all my defensive abilities like attunement, and more, I'd now have shields (benison) massive MP regeneration (thin air), and a buff to my aoe heals through plenary indulgence. the 70 abilities are balanced on the post HW nerfed kit of pre 60 stuff.

[Wintersandman]

For healing as a white mage, that means not only would i have medica 2, regen, sacred prism, all my defensive abilities like attunement, and more, I'd now have shields (benison) massive MP regeneration (thin air), and a buff to my aoe heals through plenary indulgence. the 70 abilities are balanced on the post HW nerfed kit of pre 60 stuff.

But DPS would have more burst potential, Tanks would have other abilties, so would SCH and AST. Being able to use the entire kit would increase the burst potential of all DPS. Also bringing back the 3.0 scenario would go back to the 3.0 CC which all that massive MP regeneration would be null and void. Benison WHM's already have.

[RiyahArp]

I'm not sure that would help. Monk would be gimped in that situation, as all its post 60 stuff is fixing problems it had with pve or useless abilities. I'm not sure how DRK would even work, because the pve kit strains it for resources a lot more and paces it out. RDM and SAM of course have no real kits, so you'd need to add a bunch of stuff period. If you want older more complex pvp, its probably better to test it with the well defined 60 abilities first to see if it works.

[Wintersandman]

I'm not sure that would help. Monk would be gimped in that situation, as all its post 60 stuff is fixing problems it had with pve or useless abilities. I'm not sure how DRK would even work, because the pve kit strains it for resources a lot more and paces it out. RDM and SAM of course have no real kits, so you'd need to add a bunch of stuff period. If you want older more complex pvp, its probably better to test it with the well defined 60 abilities first to see if it works.

It was already tested. We had it, not much changed otherwise. I can see a DRK charging in now into a pack with grit and blood price loving it. Monk would have One Ilm Punch(Also a Stun) which would remove buffs since all healers now have shields and again higher burst potential. Having played MNK in HW in PvP I can tell you they wouldn't be gimped and if anything Riddle of the Earth would actually have use. Bard/MCH jumps you? RoE and charge in with full stacks (Stun) and go to town.

Here is a video for your amusement.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7-ojRzUBr70

[SummerScorcher]

DRK could be decent in a 70 PvP scenario actually. TBN is pretty much ToB every 15 seconds that proc's your new burst skill Bloodspiller. Syphon now also has a Dark Arts effect which makes it stronger. Not quite sure what you main with "already strains for resources in Pve", quite the contrairy, overflowing on them is what you need to pay mind to.

Blood Price would probably be unlocked outside of Grit for PvP as well, since that change was (presumably) made to encourage staying in tank stance more.

I agree with Winter, not only healers get new abilities at 70. Monk gets RoF which would be insane burst potential especially with Brotherhood.

[Rufalus]

I don't know how much bigger the communities are on other datacenters but speaking for my one, we can't afford to split things at all. Just needs to be one system and make it great. The only way pve actions in pvp might work is if it's restricted to only custom matches and 1v1 at wolves' den pier so they don't need to take time balancing anything around it, and still it might be too resource-intensive to be worth doing. It's probably more realistic to request certain actions that you like be added to the current system.

[Zojha]

Monk gets RoF which would be insane burst potential especially with Brotherhood.

Nevermind TCJ (1560 ranged potency in like 3 seconds), Bhavacakra, Demi-Bahamut, Triplecast, Kaiten'd Midare... the big winners of reverting to the PvE system would be DPS IMO.
Healers have always been so overpowered that if you allowed them to actually USE their abilities, they'll just outdo you, hence CC&Burst being the name of the game. Giving them stronger abilities doesn't really change anything, you need to kill stuff in the CC window where they can't use any of them to get anywhere either way. And most DPS have gotten burst tools in SB, making that process easier, doubly so with Crit and now DH Crit being a thing.

Which... is all the more reason it realistically won't happen. They went out of their way to go the opposite direction with SB.

[Shurrikhan]

Nevermind TCJ (1560 ranged potency in like 3 seconds), Bhavacakra, Demi-Bahamut, Triplecast, Kaiten'd Midare... the big winners of reverting to the PvE system would be DPS IMO.
Healers have always been so overpowered that if you allowed them to actually USE their abilities, they'll just outdo you, hence CC&Burst being the name of the game. Giving them stronger abilities doesn't really change anything, you need to kill stuff in the CC window where they can't use any of them to get anywhere either way. And most DPS have gotten burst tools in SB, making that process easier, doubly so with Crit and now DH Crit being a thing.

Which... is all the more reason it realistically won't happen. They went out of their way to go the opposite direction with SB.

Sadly so.

God forbid we add ways to meaningfully avoid or divert damage such that healers each with less throughput than any given DPS could, as in other games when their team coordinates intelligently, hold off or keep their team up against twice as many DPS as there are healers... That might detract from our visceral sense of cyclindrical hitboxes numerically slapping each other. The horror.