Try to predict Nerf/Buff/QoL of 4.2 Healer Edition

[Mortex]

Not really. Just means that people are more comfortable with the combo they are using. Noct AST is perfectly serviceable in Ultimate, you just have to play differently.

Nope its just not balanced, if you go from hard core progress astro sucks, they are not comfortable with sch/whm, sch is just better in any way, look at the omega 4S world first had a astro in the group because the aoe shields where stronger. The only astro you see in the kill groups are diu astros, noc astro cant beat sch atm not even with utility after the nerfs

[Kabzy]

not even with utility after the nerfs

Correct me if I’m wrong, but wasn’t it only the utility of The Balance card that was nerfed? I don’t recall AST getting any other nerfs. And like it or not, that was a needed change for the sake of both SCH and WHM. Their shields are still stronger afaik.

I’m not saying that N.AST doesn’t need any looking at, but we’re in a better situation than before. The balance isn’t so bad that N.AST is irrelevant, whereas before SCH was buffed it was being outclassed in almost every way. IMO, the current state of healers is still fine, bar maybe a few traits. If they keep working on AST, we’ll just have a repeat of 3.4.

Edit: they can’t compete with SCH because they don’t have a similar core design at all. The reason people value SCH is because of the Faerie and the AF system, and how it synergizes so well with the other healers. To match this, they can only increase utility again or make heals overpowered, and at that point the only job which will suffer will be WHM... again!!

[Heilstos]

Heyho Sage Kabzy,

The Spear changes came unexpectedly. [The old Spear (20%|30% CDreduc.) was great for Sleeve Draw,Lucid Dreaming and Celestial Opposition (NOT 120 sec -> 96|84 sec for 3 new Cards and Royal Road + extend from Celestial Opposition or more mana). (For utility in the dmg Astroaspect.)

Note from me: The AST get a nerf from 4.0. If you look at Luminiferous Aether with 24 Sec. duration and what Lucid Dreaming 21 Sec. You see that the Ast lose one thick and thats 12,5% less mana. But that Aspect can be out played with a better manamangement.

For healing its a bit harder. Collective Unconscious and Synastry (90 Sec -> 72|63 Sec) that hurts much for the Noctunal Astro. Both Talents conter high Burst dmg. If you are in Nocturnal you want want to avoid burst damage. The Problem is that one save CD is gone (RiP Disabel) and the other one (Collective Unconscious) has strict requirements and a high cooldown. (I heard you can not even guess in CU ^^)
The HoT is not important in Noctual for avoiding or nerf burst damage. (Maybe you save mana because less AoE heals, but that part from CU is better in Dirunal stacking HoT and extened with the other HoTs).

All of these aspects were under the shadow of the random factor and not great to see in the eyes from us all, but thats all Utility. Its like bole, nice to have, but tanks musst live without that card^^.

But what does the "new 4.05" Spear to give?? The most can not answer the question, or?! You lose 5% (AoE balance), 10% (normal balance), 15 % (150% balance) as save dmgup and utility (that the most Astro does not want) for what?!
You get a crit Card, wich has the power like an third balance or half arrow and is RNG-based.If you ask me, if that whole thing was a horse-trading. Yes that was it! But the most Astros are / were dazzled by euphoric bards, monks or warriors.
Ast cards changes 4.05 explanation

And I can understand the whole Raidleader from Ultimatestatics, who takes SCH over an Noc. AST after the 4.1 Patch. They don´t want have a "shild" healer, who have lost much Utility and lacking Option to reinforce his shild power.(The group has to adapt to YOU, as an astro, because YOU, as an astro, can not comfort the group, due to the lack of options.)

In addition, the alternative (SCH) has been strengthened. The SCH get cheaper shilds (Adloquium and Succor) and an reinforcement from the shild Succor to an 87% „Aspected Helios“ shild (befor it was only 58,1%). And have other cons (more personal DMG, Buffs (Chain Stratagem,Fey Wind with no RNG) and the Selene/Eos.

And I am already afraid what will happen with 4.2. Either nothing (But the Ultimate numbers are not consistent (like to A8S times)) or ....



Alternative ideas do not come from the community.

[Saraphin]

RE: Picture

AST shields to NOT need to be buffed up. that means that SCH shields have to be buffed up again. I don't play SCH, frankly i suck at it, but a Shield buff for the "Famed" Hybrid healer is not going to make things better, but we'll have another 3.X series patch of one healer being left out because of that.

As Kabzy said, WHMs didn't get hit with the nerf stick too bad (PI's Potencies...well...it's situationally used anyway in non-savage content, i guess?) but SCHs still got a lot of the bad end. I don't see this as anything good, just like some of the other AST "suggestions" people have given that all boil down to "Make their shields stronger!"

[Sebazy]

And I can understand the whole Raidleader from Ultimatestatics, who takes SCH over an Noc. AST after the 4.1 Patch. They don´t want have a "shild" healer, who have lost much Utility and lacking Option to reinforce his shild power.(The group has to adapt to YOU, as an astro, because YOU, as an astro, can not comfort the group, due to the lack of options.)

When you say Ultimatestatics, you're referring to Endless Coil right?

The issue there isn't so much that AST is underpowered, but rather that it's cooldowns and abilities simply don't mesh nearly as neatly with the content at hand.

Indom's faster cooldown easily outweighs Earthly Star's far superior potency with the constant barrage of AoEs that Coil throws at you.

Aspected Helios' slow cast time makes it unwieldy to use compared to succor.

Taken in isolation, AST's buffs are superior, however Chain can be guaranteed to align which Trick and such which allows it to punch far above it's weight.

Even little things such as SCH being able to apply mitigation at a distance with Sacred Soil in a manner which AST cannot.

Compare this to Savage, where Noct is much more competitive in the overall picture. It's also worth looking back to BCOB and SCOB where BLM and SMN swiftly traded seats in the 'meta' despite nothing actually changing initially. It was purely a case of the job not suiting the content (Furthermore, play count the BLMs in Unending Coil).

Yes it is and arguably always has been a bit underwhelming, but that's certainly not going to be fixed by a huge bump on it's shield potencies (Which would cause huge issues with end game content, I really don't get why you keep suggesting these bonkers numbers).

SE need to actually sit down and figure out where they want Noct AST to fit in the grand scheme of things and actually push it in that direction. The change to spear was a good start, but more needs to be done imho.

Ironically, whilst SCH is also back to being a powerhouse, IMHO I think the job still needs quite a lot of attention there too, primarily QoL stuff mind.

[Heilstos]

Hey Sebazy Spiritwalker,

These numbers were just an exaggeration (and should not be taken seriously !!!). I agree, like the rest here. It can not be the solution to raise the Shield Multipliers senselessly. Just to not worry about how far you should work with the Nocturnal Astro, because the shields are thick enough. And I dont belive that the Nocturnal Astro is underpowered.

The change to spear was a good start, but more needs to be done imho.

I agree, but the new spear opens option thats true, but it has problems in the Astro Cardsystem.



There are so much Option for the Noc. Astro:

- Conception: For Time Dilation/Celestial Opposition in Nocturnal

- What I have often read the last few days. Is the idea that the pvp Synastry could come to PvE.



The percentage should then be redefined and can not stay at 40% if the cooldown is shortened. But it could be a nice QoL change.

- Manacostsreduction on Aspected Benefic/Aspected Helios ?

-> in the case from "Aspected Helios" less cast time ?

Options and concepts are some there that can be realized. But that is in the hands of the developers.That's why I hope that the discussions, as well as the developers are perceived.