"Casual" content thoughts

[Kaethra]

Diverging from the previous argument...

HyoMin, have you ever tried to imagine what it's like for genuine newcomers to MMOs? Or to gaming, for that matter. Most MMO players (heck, even myself) have a distorted view of what people consider "easy" and "hard".

Why did you choose portal instead of Dark Souls, the new Doom, or Planetside 2?

That's a rhetorical question.

A game cannot cater to everyone, a game that tries to do this is boring to all. You select a baseline difficulty and go from there. I have friends from Everquest, keyboard turners and ability clickers who would NOT be able to do the solo Duties in class/job or main scenario quests. I veer them away from FFXIV due to this. They would not, and COULD not ever enjoy the majority of the game due to their limitations.

So when forum posters call something easy that your mother and my friends would find super hardcore. They're right. It is easy, for the baseline that has been set. Some people aren't meant to get past the first goomba in World 1-1. Some people can do the solo duties and find them challenging, making some of the trials and extremes out of their reach. It happens. you simply do as much content as you are capable of.

As I said on the second page, there is varying levels of content. If one is too easy, go to the next one. If it gets to hard, work on it or go one stage back. This isn't meant to be condescending. Its just a fact. There is some content some people aren't meant to be doing. But fortunately for them, the content is in a pyramid. The easiest content makes up the majority and the hardest is the smallest amount. The amount of content favors the lower end. Its always been that way.

[Sylvina]

Why did you choose portal instead of Dark Souls, the new Doom, or Planetside 2?

That's a rhetorical question.

A game cannot cater to everyone, a game that tries to do this is boring to all. You select a baseline difficulty and go from there. I have friends from Everquest, keyboard turners and ability clickers who would NOT be able to do the solo Duties in class/job or main scenario quests. I veer them away from FFXIV due to this. They would not, and COULD not ever enjoy the majority of the game due to their limitations.

Easy is indeed a completely impossible thing to define, but I disagree that without a literal physical or mental handicap people are "incapable" of getting good at this game or any game. It's all a matter of practice and the will to improve and not giving up.

[Kaethra]

Easy is indeed a completely impossible thing to define, but I disagree that without a literal physical or mental handicap people are "incapable" of getting good at this game or any game. It's all a matter of practice and the will to improve and not giving up.

What do you do with someone who can't pass the first solo duty? Level is scaled, they cannot outlevel or outgear it. You cannot join them to give a boost. There's only two things you can do. One is to login their character and do it for them. The other is to inform them that the game just isn't for them.

I have one friend who likely falls into that category. They've been in MMOs for 15 years. If they haven't 'gotten it' by now. They're not going to. No handicap either.

[Sylvina]

What do you do with someone who can't pass the first solo duty? Level is scaled, they cannot outlevel or outgear it. You cannot join them to give a boost. There's only two things you can do. One is to login their character and do it for them. The other is to inform them that the game just isn't for them.

I have one friend who likely falls into that category. They've been in MMOs for 15 years. If they haven't 'gotten it' by now. They're not going to. No handicap either.

Never met anyone like that but it really sounds like they indeed have some kind of handicap if they've been in MMOs for 15 years and can't adapt to an MMO which isn't much different from the standard formula.

FFXIV is as standard as they come, I sense that something isn't right with your story.

[Kaethra]

Never met anyone like that but it really sounds like they indeed have some kind of handicap if they've been in MMOs for 15 years and can't adapt to an MMO which isn't much different from the standard formula.

FFXIV is as standard as they come, I sense that something isn't right with your story.

Standard compared to what?

I did Heroic and Mythical raids in WoW: Legion and none of that even compared to some of the PUG content in FFXIV. EQ2's most complex group mechanic was a debuff that silenced the healer and had to be taken off a mage. The high end dungeons in RIFT had telegraphs comparable to FFXIV's level 30 dungeons. ESO has some interesting mechanics, none of which are punishing like they are here, and I've been able to complete all of them on Vet, even with a Nightblade Healer (a non-standard healing build).

[Sandpark]

Never met anyone like that but it really sounds like they indeed have some kind of handicap if they've been in MMOs for 15 years and can't adapt to an MMO which isn't much different from the standard formula.

FFXIV is as standard as they come, I sense that something isn't right with your story.

Standard compared to what?

I did Heroic and Mythical raids in WoW: Legion and none of that even compared to some of the PUG content in FFXIV. EQ2's most complex group mechanic was a debuff that silenced the healer and had to be taken off a mage. The high end dungeons in RIFT had telegraphs comparable to FFXIV's level 30 dungeons. ESO has some interesting mechanics, none of which are punishing like they are here, and I've been able to complete all of them on Vet, even with a Nightblade Healer (a non-standard healing build).

Easy or Hard?
That varies from player to player with or without handicaps.

Skill?
There are different kinds. Reflex, Cerebral, Memorization, Number crunching.

You may excel at all, a few, or suck at all of them.

The difference between this mmo and most other besides their older sister.

Is that most mmos these days allow you to:

Reach level cap and progress the story entirely solo,it's usually not difficult at all and if there is anything requiring to group to advance the story it is extremely simple and a rare occurence.

This is not a diss to other mmos or saying they have no hard content. I have played a good amount. EQ2, Swtor, ESO, GW2, Black Desert, Tera, Warframe, and a few others. FFXI and XIV are one of the few mmos riddled with hundreds of rights of passages, and a strong focus on multiplayer storywise even if XIV has less focus on multiplayer than it's older sister did.

It's a blessing for me personally to play the FF mmos. I like the rights of passage and a focus on wanting players to group up for some story stuff. But there are a few occasions in both FF mmos where I am like, this is a bit too hard for story content. I get a bit frustrated, but always manage to persevere and win. But I have seen other players in both games just hit a wall, and question whether to stop playing or not.

One difference between the FF mmos and offline ones. Are that there is no time gating or level gating in the offline ones. So regardless of how difficult, you can outlevel or outgear anything as soon as possible. In the mmos you have to wait a bit for that to happen ranging anywhere from one patch to longer.

One thing you have no control over is in a multiplayer requirement, you need people, no people equal you don't progress the main story, even if you were the best XIV player in the world. And if you are one of the most skillfully challenged, well the multiplayer aspect might frustrate you a bit more, as parties disband for one-two deaths, less than optimal rotations, or any other act of god.

That part I didn't get for awhile coming from an old school mmo. Even with experience loss or deleveling, minus COP, players even in pugs would try over and over with little drama and usually would win. The answer was time, time is more important than any penalty an mmo could enforce to this era of mmos.

[Sylvina]

Standard compared to what?

I did Heroic and Mythical raids in WoW: Legion and none of that even compared to some of the PUG content in FFXIV. EQ2's most complex group mechanic was a debuff that silenced the healer and had to be taken off a mage. The high end dungeons in RIFT had telegraphs comparable to FFXIV's level 30 dungeons. ESO has some interesting mechanics, none of which are punishing like they are here, and I've been able to complete all of them on Vet, even with a Nightblade Healer (a non-standard healing build).

I havent even done mythic raiding in WoW only mythic + dungeons but having played both I can tell you that the pug content in FFXIV isnt that much different from LFR raids in wow. I don't see where you're getting this from.

Also being able to complete the hardest content on a non standard healer in ESO isnt indication of it being easy, it's DESIGNED that way so people can play and build how they like. one thing ESO does better than FFXIV.

[Kaethra]

I havent even done mythic raiding in WoW only mythic + dungeons but having played both I can tell you that the pug content in FFXIV isnt that much different from LFR raids in wow. I don't see where you're getting this from.

Titan Hardmode was (when it was current) a bit tougher than anything LFR had in WoW. And for modern content, Shinryu Normal is way more punishing than anything in LFR.

Also being able to complete the hardest content on a non standard healer in ESO isnt indication of it being easy, it's DESIGNED that way so people can play and build how they like. one thing ESO does better than FFXIV.

When I can two button heal veteran White Gold Tower and Morrowind veteran DLC dungeons on a Nightblade.. its far too easy. Its one of the reasons I stopped ESO. I basically beat it. That was at Champion 300 where max is 660. I could probably ignore most mechanics if I was 660. Healing a Plane of Fear break-in on a Druid on a Everquest progression server was more challenging then that.