Tanks and super pulls

[wereotter]

You know I've started seeing this.... these "super pull" stunts only work when you have a heavy long range DPS stacked and a whole lot of bloody luck. Lately I keep getting paladins who do stupid things and DPS that seem to be doing literally nothing - when in fact its not that they are doing nothing - they can't keep up with the bloody mess that the tank started.

I've been seeing a lot of this in Skalla lately. Enemies with enormous hit rings that don't always stack well on top of each other which makes spamming AOE as a caster difficult, who telegraph lots of attacks, which makes AOE difficult to impossible as a melee, yet tanks still try to pull literally everything. That said, the dungeon is still probably one of the more fun ones for me, specifically because of the forced slowdown on the last third that actually allows me to use all my moves. Not just Doton, Battletoad, and Death Blossom.

[NephthysVasudan]

I've been seeing a lot of this in Skalla lately. Enemies with enormous hit rings that don't always stack well on top of each other which makes spamming AOE as a caster difficult, who telegraph lots of attacks, which makes AOE difficult to impossible as a melee, yet tanks still try to pull literally everything. That said, the dungeon is still probably one of the more fun ones for me, specifically because of the forced slowdown on the last third that actually allows me to use all my moves. Not just Doton, Battletoad, and Death Blossom.

Cant...resist....meme.

SHOW ME YOUR MOVES!

phew..harder than it looks to resist that.



-Neph

[bswpayton]

I've been seeing a lot of this in Skalla lately. Enemies with enormous hit rings that don't always stack well on top of each other which makes spamming AOE as a caster difficult, who telegraph lots of attacks, which makes AOE difficult to impossible as a melee, yet tanks still try to pull literally everything. That said, the dungeon is still probably one of the more fun ones for me, specifically because of the forced slowdown on the last third that actually allows me to use all my moves. Not just Doton, Battletoad, and Death Blossom.

ha that dungeons so easy to super pull in done it only twice on pali and its actually so easy to pull all those adds at once, the mistake many tanks m ake is they act like they dont have an aoe themselves if a tank isnt using aoe then they are bad and shouldnt be doing big pulls

[Zojha]

[...]yet tanks still try to pull literally everything.

I would hope they do, because healing small pulls is excessively boring. Aspected Benefic + Wheel of Fortune + Extend = You could go AFK now, your job for the pull is done. In bigger pulls, it's what allows you to spam some Gravities, but in small pulls, it's just utter overkill. I alternate it with Lucid Dreaming + Celestial Opposition + Earthly Star, as the AoE stun also allows for some Gravities and spamming Gravities like that leaves you with little mana. I did notice that in Skalla, melees like to get hit by the landslides in the second passage, but even if they get hit by two, an essential dignity puts them right back to full and they never come back to back, so no harm in keeping them low for a while either - You can also put an Aspected Benefic on them and reserve the Dignity for the Tank, it doesn't matter much.

I personally find big pulls most stressful from the tanking perspective, but that's because the healer is the one in control of my health bar, not me. As healer, I'm the one in control which makes dungeons rather relaxing, big pulls or not. Hence why I generally queue up as AST for tomes, even if I don't consider it my main nor equip it first.

[NephthysVasudan]

<snip>

No - and If your not healing (when none is needed) - you should be dealing damage - which ironically makes the dungeon go FASTER...not slower.

The Party controls the dungeon...not the tank..not the healer. Everyone does their part...or you don't go anywhere at all.

People assume they have to "go with the tank OR the healer" when in fact we choose to do so based on necessity. All it takes is someone to stand up and just point the direction. Communication - or severe lack of - is the issue here. Sorry - i don't mean to make so much salt over this - but even I know better than to say "The party lives an dies by the healer - CAUSE I SAID SO" - Ain't true...nor is it the case for tanks. We all work together...or we don't work at all.

The reason I've not started "kicking the tank" by refusing to heal is I don't want to get slapped by GM's for being that "guy/gal" who mucks things up. i'd rather warn the tank "Hey....I may screw this up..just so you know" and watch the tank make an ass out of himself/herself when they call me a newbie and then call them out for being a idiot and not know how to read or pay attention. Which subsequently makes DPS'ers laugh at the tank and yeah...you know where that goes.

-Npeh.

[Zojha]

No - and If your not healing (when none is needed) - you should be dealing damage - which ironically makes the dungeon go FASTER...not slower.

Not gonna argue against that - That's why I pointed out how I enable that DPS even in big pulls via cooldowns.

In small pulls, it's just excessively boring, because healers have no DPS rotation to speak of. Combustx3 + Malefic spam is even less engaging than Rogue used to be at level 18, who at least had Gust Slash to combo off Spinning Edge after spreading Mutilate. And as stated before, healing more isn't required. Even while adding DPS, healing small pulls amounts to level 18 DPS gameplay. Such engaging, much fun.

[NephthysVasudan]

Not gonna argue against that - That's why I pointed out how I enable that DPS even in big pulls via cooldowns.

In small pulls, it's just excessively boring, because healers have no DPS rotation to speak of. Combustx3 + Malefic spam is even less engaging than Rogue used to be at level 18, who at least had Gust Slash to combo off Spinning Edge after spreading Mutilate. And as stated before, healing more isn't required. Even while adding DPS, healing small pulls amounts to level 18 DPS gameplay. Such engaging, much fun.

Strangely enough I've seen many situations where I start out DPS'ing the DPS'ers - course this isn't exactly a good sign...but its fun in any case. Now this is a White Mage i'm talking about - can't say the same experience for Astro or Schollar.

-Neph

[ElonMuskForPrez]

WHM holy bomb is really powerful because what class has AoE that do 150-200 potency? Summoner Painflare (cast 3x since it takes aether stack) does 200. And we're casting it super fast, lol. A dungeon run 1 tank/3 WHM = super fast run