Feedback: Please do not lower Paladin damage.

[DWolfwood]

Even if it's not a major nerf, fuck nerfing PLD already. WAR has been lording over the tanking meta forever now. Let them cry in the corner for a while. They'll live.

Yeah, some of us actually care about balance.

[FallenWings]

Aylmao

Literally all these PLD complaints are exactly what the WAR's have been asking in 3.0.

"Don't nerf us! Just boost the others to our level!" - WAR 3.0, PLD 4.0, DRK 5.0.

something something live long enough to see yourself become the villain something something

SE truly is incompetent and just wants the tank community to consume themselves with the endless infighting.

[DWolfwood]

Aylmao

Literally all these PLD complaints are exactly what the WAR's have been asking in 3.0.

"Don't nerf us! Just boost the others to our level!" - WAR 3.0, PLD 4.0, DRK 5.0.

To be fair, all tanks wanted to be buffed to WAR's level rather than see it nerfed to PLD/DRK's.

Also, I'm convinced that DRK will never be OP. Yoshida and the team seem pretty determined to not ever let that happen.

[HoodRat]

To be fair, all tanks wanted to be buffed to WAR's level rather than see it nerfed to PLD/DRK's.

That's not how I remember it.

[DWolfwood]

That's not how I remember it.

How is it you remember it? Because there wasn't really much point to nerfing WAR back then. You could nerf its damage sure, but its utility made it irreplaceable. Slashing debuff was too strong back then, and Storm's Path was OP for progression. PLDs wanted more damage, to block magic, an AoE, and to be able to cast while tanking. DRKs wanted their janky kit fixed instead of SE making raids catered to them.

[FallenWings]

Also, I'm convinced that DRK will never be OP. Yoshida and the team seem pretty determined to not ever let that happen.

FeelsDRKman.

Lmao I can't even be salty at how SE likes to balance the tanks anymore. It's like DRK doesn't even exist to them.

Like holy shit, what did DRK ever do to yoshi-p.

Hahahahahaha tank balance.

[SunAurel]

Since Paladings Raid utility gets cited so often, let's take a look at it?

Divine Veil: You will always have a healer in your party that can shield already and one extra shield with 5k hp every 2 minutes (!) is not really noticeable

Cover: Only works if you are OT'ing or if your party is dead and you need to shield the healer for lb3, + the range is too small, + doesn't work on everything

Clemency: Good self-heal, but you're better off casting holy spirit with your mana or you save it for when you know your healer cannot heal you right now

PoA: Only useful for transitions since you are most likely the MT and no one should go in front of the boss

Intervention: You need to sacrifice Rampart/Sentinel to make it really count and you need to be ot for it + oath gauge fills vey slow in Shield Oath

Raid Utility did not get Paladin a spot in 3.0 and it won't give it one in 4.0 since raids value the maximum damage output possible. As long as you can skip phases via dps, damage will be the most important thing to contribute in a raid

Paladin is a good 'oh shit' tank if something goes wrong, but those occasions should be the minority of cases once you're familiar with mechanics and then like 5 skills lose their purpose and then the best utility is simply put, Damage.. For the learning phase aka the first 3 weeks pld will have a spot, but then later you can't justify bringing one anymore when you could have a drk or war

It can't fall too far behind WAR and DRK because the use of the utility is time-limited, and it does by far not need something that messes with the fluidity of the gameplay and frankly after 2 years of asking for buffs and ways to make the class feel less clunky, this is a spit in the face.

[SyzzleSpark]

Raid Utility did not get Paladin a spot in 3.0 and it won't give it one in 4.0

That... is not how that works.

3.0 PLD had competition. 4.0 PLD doesn't.

Look at the big picture.

[SunAurel]

That... is not how that works.

3.0 PLD had competition. 4.0 PLD doesn't.

Look at the big picture.

3.0 paladin competed with classes that can bring utility that's more valuable than group mitigation aka damage which is was a big reason why PLD was a joke while Warrior had no competition for 2 years

4.0 paladin has no competition, which is why I AM NOT AGAINST WARRIOR/DRK BUFFS, quite the contrary, I am all in favor of them

what I am against is an additional Paladin nerf to their overall gameplay/fluidity, and damage when the utility they offer is only valuable for a limited time and then loses its purpose

4.05 paladin and the tank-spots will just be the same as heavensward with DRK/WAR being mandatory because PLD's utility won't be needed since the raids are designed to be cleared without it, and then it's a matter of 'who does the most damage?'

please do not take me being against paladin nerfs for me also being against warrior/drk buffs, I play those classes as well as do many other paladins that are against this nerf.

[SunAurel]

snip

i have been in favor of buffing WAR and DRK ever since it got evident that pld was op. I pushed my DRK to 70 a week ago because I loved playing that class in HW and I want to see it change for the better because guess what you can actually play and love more than one class and after my Sam hits 60, War is the next class I'll be bringing to 70 because guess what I am a tank main, but yes I love Pld the most.

I've been on the forums for a short time, but after you had to go through the majority of HW as pld you'd understand why I am salty. It took me a long time to find a Raid Group that wanted to take a PLD , and it was even harder to find farm parties that were not enforcing DRK/WAR as well, coupled with all the other 'pld is trash what do you want with it main war ' comments

I tasted fluid gameplay for a class I love and it finally feels complete so of course I am going to be upset if they mess with the goring blade uptime that is going to be influenced by it, or with the ogc's, or the requiescat window. I would not be opposed to a straight up potency nerf to it down to like 420 or 410, that would be fine with me but the pld problem and utility is based in the general raid design.

Even the quote you got from me literally has me saying 'i am in favor of buffing warrior' so what the hell do you want

Warrior is not the only class entitled to fluid gameplay lmao