BLM needs some love and RDM needs a nerf

[Galvuu]

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Have you played this job at a high level? Genuine question.
But let me dispel some of these claims for the sake of clarity.

Procs are unreliable rng- you may get a lucky Thundercloud when a mechanic requires movement. But more often than not, you won't. This is like saying that AST can deal with tankbusters better because he can just Bole the main tank. We both know this isn't true. This is made worse by the fact that if you are unlucky and get a slow mana tick with Sharpcast up, you either Sharpcast the Fire to get the full rotation or save it for some mechanic and lose a F4.

As for the warps, Aetherial relies on someone being there quite early for you. When I was in my static, I used this plentifully for great effect, but the moment I'm on the PF Aetherial becomes useless half the time. Also, 30s is a surprisingly long cd- I wish I could zap back and forth in Susano EX for the levinbolts using my party, but I can't.


"Between the Lines" is indeed great for handling mechanics. Ofc if you use your Ley Lines as a mobility tool indirectly, you're also putting them down at a moment where you'll have to move out of them (thus losing dps). I actually do this for the stun+Levinbolt mechanic in Susano. I lose dps by not being on the Ley Lines, but less than not having the option to instantly tp to the right side and get 1/2 of my casts under LL.

I do agree that utilized perfectly, we can handle a lot of the stuff the game throws at us. I think only that horrible levinbolt+2x puddles mechanic in Susano EX (or a knockback when the cloud is in an uncomfortable spot) messes me up and makes me seriously lose casts.
That said, this is all moot, because even if the fight was a dummy our dps wouldn't be that much higher than most other jobs without us bringing any substantial utility. The moment you have to move, it gets worse, and damage is all we have.

[Furious]

Only really "potent" if doublecast which isn't instant. If we are bringing utility in to the argument, it should also be noted that BLM is pretty much only viable source for Mana Shift.

It's potent in comparison with what other people who compete for the same slot have.

As do SMN and while Verraise is more flexible to use, it is worth remembering RDMs also have fewer ways to recover mana to afford to use it.

SMN have one instant spell per minute. RDM have one instant spell per spell. As for the mana cost; when talking about clutching through initial fights, someone doing less dps for a period of time is less restrictive to progression than someone being dead for a period of time, especially a healer or tank.

Are you referring to Displacement? Is melee range backstep really worth being envious of when BLM have Between the Lines with less than 10% of the cooldown?

I'm referring to one out of every two casts at a MINIMUM being instant cast, leaving you with more than half of your combat time being mobile.

[Furious]

Indeed. Which is compensated by the fact BLM will hands-down do more damage than any other caster in lower movement situations. SMN meanwhile has multiple instant-cast abilities and DoTs that continue to tick when movement is required.

Each of the three casters has different strengths and do better at different types of encounters. I see no problem with this.

There is no such thing as a low movement situation, and if there is, it's ridiculously easy in any case.

Being strong in low movement scenarios is as useful as being waterproof in the desert.

[Maero]

Thing is.. with blm you need to be perfect on your rotation, maximize so you do not have to move much at all during mechanics so basically blm needs to know in advance and pre-plan otherwise dps takes a big hit, other jobs simply are not affected so much by this...
So yes blm should be up there in damage even with melee. Also the fact that only thing blm brings to a group is damage, like Galvuu has said.

Red mage potencies should remain as is however, no nerfs. Buff smn and blm as well by some.

[Waliel]

481potency per (at current) 2.73s vs 270+300 in 1.87s + recast.

Just a friendly note that your recast is always the minimum amount of time you can have in calculations. Using B3 or F3 will have like a 1.5s cast but you still have to wait the full 2.5s to do another spell.

This makes this more like 1139 (after both Thunderclouds, plus the second effect's full dot) instead of 720 like you claim.

I have no idea how you got that number but full TC is 40*8*2+70=710p.

[Coldbrand]

BLM still has no utility, but gets beaten by all jobs on single-target damage (the only type of damage which matters) except for DRG, BRD and MCH.

I don't think you know what the word all means.

[Bhearil]

On a dummy test, blm has parsed as the second best single target damage, with only sam doing more. The complains are like saying that Monk should be doing much more damage because his utility(as crappy as it is) skill does not works on a caster group thus they have no utility on that case.

Of course blm is gonna suffer on a heavy movement fight, but if you buff him you will make it godlike on those fights on which movement is not needed so outside of very minor changes blm is probably gonna stay like that, moreso when there are other jobs in FAR worse places (mch anyone?)

Even if its a role skills Blm are the job best suited for mana transfer something that both rdm and smn cant do at will due to lesser mp recovery

[Galvuu]

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Name one fight where "movement is not needed" from the past two years.
There's like. A9S, and that fight was an utter joke.
Spehirot, Sophia, Zurvan, A5S, A6S, A8S, A10S, A11S, A12S, Susano, Lakshmi- all of these have more than enough movement to make whatever dummy dps we have irrelevant.
Has there even been such a thing as a "no movement fight"?

[JunseiKei]

*Looks at fight data from raid group. Sees BLM sitting at the same DPS as RDM and MNK on multiple different fights (all new Omega, Lakshmi EX, Susano EX) on multiple runs.*

...BLM needs love and RDM needs a nerf. Wut? Have you compared the classes against others of the same level? I mean, I know our group comp is weird (PLD, WAR, AST, SCH, RDM, MNK, BLM and BRD), but sans the BRD, everyone sits at the same DPS. A SAM friend was pulling more DPS than us, but we were all evenly geared with optimal melds. Our SCH also plays SMN, but until she's about geared as us, or I'm partied with a SMN of equal skill level and gear, I can't really tell how good or bad they are currently. A friend is saying it's top DPS; due to reasons, I largely believe him. I mean, when I first started playing RDM, I felt it was a little OP, but as I started doing fights with the raid, I found we mostly fell into the same area on amounts we did and I suddenly didn't feel so OP.

RDM is mostly punished when they "need" to wait for mechanics to happen to pull of their melee range combo- or run the risk of having their mana the same amount and messing up their priorities a bit.

[Galvuu]

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So you think it's fine a class with easier execution and more utility does as much damage as us (RDM)? Even MNK has more utility than we do, especially in terms of damage...

https://www.fflogs.com/statistics/15/#dataset=90
Any percentile you check from 75% onwards (the "good" level of play), NIN, MNK, RDM and SAM beat us on average- over a large number of parses, too. Like thousands. It's not "that one group", it's a consistent thing. There's a large corpus of data supporting this.

Also, just look at that "punishment". RDM's punishment is doing their spell rotation for a few seconds while they wait for an opportunity to use corps-a-corps to dash in and do the melee finisher. The only downside is putting their burst on hold, while dpsing, and losing nothing else (they don't even have any cds they need to align).

Mine is doing literally no damage during the whole mechanic and having to hit transpose, resulting in further dps loss when I can finally cast stuff again.
SMNs lose Bahamut and are thrown back into a 2 min buildup for their burst.
Seems fair.

This isn't against you personally. I'm just putting in perspective what the other two caster jobs have to put up with for smaller returns.