1.2 Needs to fix Sentinel, Tanking, and XI Class-ism.

[Jinko]

Then that's an issue with the server tech or some other aspect, unrelated to the fight itself.

I'm sure server lag isn't an intended strategy of Ifrit's :-p.

LOL that made me laugh because although probably not you never can tell where SE are concerned.

Although what i meant is that people are trying desperately to beat this boss and thats where the force of using sentinel is coming from because you just don't know where you are standing with the lag.

SE should have been a bit more mindful when designing this boss fight how the servers would cause issues, im sure the moogle fight will be no different and we will be stuck playing like this until 2.0.

[Xatsh]

Sentinel is not going to save you in the lag issues on Ifrit. It lowers dmg from 1600-1800 an eruption to around 800-900 an eruption.

The danger comes when it does it 3xs... so 900 x 3 = 2700 yea probably gona near kill people anyways.

NA/EU players are at a major disadvantage on the fight, but it i doable. You have to be ready for the TP attack before it happens and you have to know where to stand and what to do.

For those having issues killing it here is a hint, The Special attacks ifrit does are in pretty accurate intervals and there are places you can stand to always 100% avoid plums.

Yea it is BS, and not an excuse for SE not to fix it but it is doable. And sentiel is not going to save you if you screw up anyways. Kill 2-3 spikes and sentinel is not needed if everyone is cured up and has stoneskin (can easily survive with 2 spikes down 2700+hp and stoneskin).

[Tempestmoon]

Nerf Sentinal and the community will just find another new required skill to replace it. It's a lose/lose situation. It's the Players fault, not the design of the game.

[Tiraelina]

Exactly.

Depending on how much "freedom" players are given with the add-on system for XIV, I fully expect the same thing to happen here. Certain add-ons - even those that absolutely are not necessary - will be deemed "mandatory" to have or you'll be told (ironically) to "learn how to play"... which of course, really translates into "We need you to use those add-ons because we suck and can't complete anything without them".

I always find it funny how in MMORPGs (XI, WoW, you name it), the people who are the most dependent on guides/add-ons/cookie-cutter build/etc. to beat content are the self-described "hardcores" who deem themselves "elite players". They look down their nose derisively at those who prefer not to use them and to instead, you know... play the game without training wheels and helpers.

I'm sure (unfortunately) that same "We need add-ons and walk-throughs to win" mentality is going to pervade XIV as well.

Whatever changes SE makes to the game, no matter how they try to "balance things out", the same exact thing is going to happen. The so-called "elite" are going to quickly find out which approach/build guarantees the best, most predictable outcome, create a template/walkthrough of it and then declare that all others must follow that same setup or they don't know how to play and don't get to do the content. Because, again, that's the only way they know how to beat it.

The sad thing is, many others will - without even second-guessing it or bothering to think of alternatives - will resign themselves to those guides being "the one right way to do it", and won't even try to complete the content using any other setup. Sadder still is some of them won't try for fear of being mocked and derided by other players for "not doing it right".

And please, nobody bother coming back with the whole "it's all about efficiency"... that's a player mentality. The idea of content is to experience and complete it. There is no "law" stating "it must be done in the most efficient manner possible, or you're doing it wrong". Again, that's just players who require those guides/cookie-cutter builds in order to succeed at the game twisting their own inadequacy into a mandate. They need everyone else to play a certain way in order for them to succeed.

A friend of mine created a static for Zilart, CoP and Aht Urghan. For all three, his setup was - according to the "elite" of FFXI - "the wrong setup". He was told, constantly, "you're doing it wrong", "that's not the right build", "you're going to fail without "x-jobs" for "y-fight". He was mocked by his own "elite" LS-mates who called him and his group {Too Weak}.

Lo and behold, he and his "too weak" group finished Zilart, CoP and Aht Urghan - every one straight through to the final fight.

What did an "elite" player say when he informed them of his group's accomplishments? "So what? You got lucky. I would never have let you do that in my group. You gotta learn to play the right way, man. Those guides and walkthroughs exist for a reason". My friend's response: "The point is, you and everyone else told me we'd fail, we'd never finish it, it wouldn't work, we were doing it wrong and all this. We beat it anyway and didn't need any of that. Yet you're still telling me that following those guides is mandatory to complete the content. Who needs to learn how to play again?"

If you can't actually understand why addons get pushed on most of the players then I don't know what to say. You probably didn't participate in raids for an extended period of time to get acquainted with the PuG populations skillset. Most of them out there are incapable of getting out of a fire or any other hazardous area/moving somewhere else without explicit guidance. Let alone admitting they don't actually know what to do or how to play. This also has very little to do with the genre/game/IRL.

You get told to get addons because you are viewed as the weakest link in the group/raid, there's also that detail that encounters are designed around boss mods by the developers. It also severely impaired your ability to heal cross group without decent raid frames which is why they were built in. Those players suggesting you get an addon are probably not the ones that are going to screw up catastrophically and wipe everyone else.

Self-described hardcore is just another word to describe being bad. Same goes to stubborn guild/raid leaders, I've been there and done that. Smashing your face into something repeatedly is not a valid strategy just because someone else beat it that way doesn't mean you can or have to. I've repeatedly had to deal with other players telling me my class couldn't do something because they didn't know to do it themselves except they had no power over it because the group running it was my friends.

This is like tanks running to the forums and telling everyone they don't need to be crit capped because they downed a boss without it. That isn't anything but pure luck because getting hit by that 0.04% or higher chance meant instant death. Good luck trying to argue to a group of strangers why they should take you along with that in mind.

The actual elite/hardcore players that you bash every chance you get are the ones finding alternative ways of doing encounters and trying to streamline it for others if they so desire. Stop confusing them with the wannabe noobs that refuse to try outside of their sandbox.

[Tiraelina]

Nerf Sentinal and the community will just find another new required skill to replace it. It's a lose/lose situation. It's the Players fault, not the design of the game.

You don't design something a certain way and complain the players are misusing it. That is the definition of bad game design.

Having skills from other classes should help you/make it more enjoyable, not carry you.

[Destain]

You have the right to night rank up gladiator 4 sentinel just like another player has the right to not invite your squishy Mage arse to ifrit fight. It's not required. This isn't a design flaw. It is personal preference. There is no known patch for that.

[Jinko]

You have the right to night rank up gladiator 4 sentinel just like another player has the right to not invite your squishy Mage arse to ifrit fight. It's not required. This isn't a design flaw. It is personal preference. There is no known patch for that.

Mages are supposed to be squishy, its why they wear cloth .. /duh

In most MMO's mages also have high magic defense so something like an AOE firebomb would/should do them less damage.

[Teakwood]

Making no ability any better than any other ability in the base class system is a terrible idea, unfortunately. A game with no actual way to be mechanically efficient is a game in which your choice of equipped skill and choice of action at any given moment has no meaning, i.e., not a fun game.

However, your basic point about tanking is solid, and something I do hope they address in the jobs system.

(As for Sentinel... put the ability on Sentinel (i.e. Shield), that way if you're a mage only, you'll still learn it? I don't know. I sympathise, I'm not really enthusiastic about the idea of leveling GLD to 36 either, and it 'shouldn't' be necessary, I just don't know if it's actually possible to 'properly' balance this without making the game bland and uninteresting.)

[Physic]

Mages are supposed to be squishy, its why they wear cloth .. /duh

In most MMO's mages also have high magic defense so something like an AOE firebomb would/should do them less damage.

they have fire defense gear, mdefense gear and hp gear, sentinel is only one solution of many. The content does not REQUIRE it, some dudes who he wants to join requires it, because thats what they want, its not required by the game. Essentially they are trying to minimize the skill required to win consistently.

The players in this case are the problem the content does not force or require sentinel, there are mage ways to solve the issue.

[Holy_Dragoon]

To help combat the "Sentinel Required" we're taking the approach of hosting 2 types of runs. One being a hardcore run, where specific skills are required, and one being a standard run. Standard run lists helpful skills, but does not require any of our members to actually have them to participate.
Sure the standard parties might have a tougher time, but no one is excluded.