I might of figured something out today. Game too easy for leveling duties?

[akaneakki]

I always wondered something. When people clearly want harder content, the peopel who doesn't, are usually the RP'ers or limsa afk people, why does it bother them if content will be harder? D:

[ToasterMan]

I always wondered something. When people clearly want harder content, the peopel who doesn't, are usually the RP'ers or limsa afk people, why does it bother them if content will be harder? D:

It doesn't. As an RPer my self, I could use from more challenge in expert so I don't fall asleep. I thought Mhach was great.

[akaneakki]

It doesn't. As an RPer my self, I could use from more challenge in expert so I don't fall asleep. I thought Mhach was great.

My bad, which is true. But there are insanely many RP'ers on this forum who complains about it however. I have nothing againt's RP'ers, so you know that . Or people who just afk a lot. But yeah, I agree with you! Mchach was great! and I would love to see stuff like that againt too!

[Kallera]

I always wondered something. When people clearly want harder content, the peopel who doesn't, are usually the RP'ers or limsa afk people, why does it bother them if content will be harder? D:

Prople don't only just do one activity in this game. I find this game's definition of "harder" often to be more "frustrating" than "challenging" as it relies on--you guessed it -- instant kills. makes someone wonder why hp numbers are even a thing. if one is supposed to be killed in one hit.

It is often a subjective judgement to talk about "how to improve the player base" and I think it is more than just making it harder all around. You might just have more people avoiding the roulette or selectively bailing. From my own experience ive had more problems from people that flake from playing at the first sign of trouble than from one who is new or lacked damage.

[Driavna]

I will be happy with something similar to heroics dungeons during WoW Cataclysm at release or a new mode similar to how mythic (and mythic+) dungeons work, also no DF only premades for this new mode. Normal mode for raids should be similar to expert primals and 24m should stay the same.

But outside a new mode for dungeons anything else won't happen, others MMO's tried this "hardcore" route it already and did not work, the game failed or subs dropped.

[ToasterMan]

My bad, which is true. But there are insanely many RP'ers on this forum who complains about it however. I have nothing againt's RP'ers, so you know that . Or people who just afk a lot. But yeah, I agree with you! Mchach was great! and I would love to see stuff like that againt too!

I might have an idea why. Remember Steps of Faith? That was a disaster the first time it was released. Not because it was hard, but because people didn't want to take the time to do it. They would zone in, realise what the trial was and then zone out. They didn't want to waste their time wiping. I'm wondering what would happen if they made both of the new expert dungeons like it. Would people stop running it? Or would the player base actually get better? Aurum Vale suggests that they would and Steps of Faith suggested that they wouldnt. It's interesting to think about.

[RukiaFae]

I might have an idea why. Remember Steps of Faith? That was a disaster the first time it was released. Not because it was hard, but because people didn't want to take the time to do it. They would zone in, realise what the trial was and then zone out. They didn't want to waste their time wiping. I'm wondering what would happen if they made both of the new expert dungeons like it. Would people stop running it? Or would the player base actually get better? Aurum Vale suggests that they would and Steps of Faith suggested that they wouldnt. It's interesting to think about.

The issue with Steps was more of the design. It took way too long to wipe and start over. It wasnt the difficulty that made people instantly zone back out it was the way the trial was designed IMO.

[Talraen]

I've been doing a lot of leveling dungeons on alts going through Heavensward recently, and it's been frustrating. Last night we wiped four times on Tioman, and I'm not even sure why. It didn't seem to be ignorance of mechanics, just an inability to stay alive. And it wasn't fun. Challenge is great as long as you still win in the end, but when you don't, it sucks.

[ToasterMan]

The issue with Steps was more of the design. It took way too long to wipe and start over. It wasnt the difficulty that made people instantly zone back out it was the way the trial was designed IMO.

Yeah I think so too. There was a point in the fight you were waiting for ages just to see the wipe.

I just have a question. Do you guys think that uping the difficulty would get rid of the laziness of the player base?

[Talraen]

I just have a question. Do you guys think that uping the difficulty would get rid of the laziness of the player base?

Yes, it absolutely will, but that's not necessarily a good thing. If you're good enough to get through hard content, great. If you're not, you're going to do one of two things: get better, or quit. Either way, the people who are left will be better. But the problem is, people quitting is bad for the game financially, so it's not something Square Enix will do (nor should they).

In terms of laziness specifically, I'm not sure if it will matter. Most of the laziness I see is downright incompetent. For instance, people pulling in leveling dungeons like they would in a level cap dungeon. That has never worked, and will never work, yet people do it anyway, and then get mad when it fails. I think the problem is that people can clear content and memorize mechanics without having any understanding of why those mechanics work the way they do. Every time I see a tank pull multiple groups at level 20 when no one in the party has any AOE attacks, I die a little inside. That tank just has no conception of why pulling multiple groups is effective. They just know that's what people do, so they do it. I think laziness is similar: people ignore mechanics because they've learned that you can, but in some dungeons (especially leveling dungeons) you can't actually get away with that because you're not nearly as overgeared as you are in level-cap dungeons.

So if you forced every player to have a strong understanding of the game itself, and not just memorize mechanics, you'd be left with a very small population of very good players. And again, that's not a good thing.

EDIT: Actually the more I think about it, the less convinced I am that making the game harder will help. "Harder" in this game typically just means you need to memorize more mechanics. And memorizing mechanics only helps in that fight. Indeed, people often try to extend those lessons to other fights where they aren't appropriate. But I don't think having less mechanics is going to compel people to understand the game better, either. Bottom line, easy works, hard might not, so they go with easy.