As a healer, is it my job to DPS? A new perspective.

[Bourne_Endeavor]

I thought I did see posts where it states content should be clearable. Without healer dps. Some posts here say dps when you are comfortabe with it. I think it a fallacy expecting every sch to be able to do it though. I even told the guy before I joined that I wasnt expert.

None of the content is tuned with healer DPS, yes. That doesn't mean you shouldn't be doing any in Savage. You keep ignoring the healer role in FFXIV is to mitigate and support the raid. Additional DPS means an occasional mistake can happen without potentially wiping the raid. Say one of the DPS gets caught unexpectedly by mechanics and drops or the tank miss-timed their cooldown. Both their downtime and weakness are somewhat eased by healers who have contributed damage. Should those scenarios be happening? No. But even the best groups do not always have ideal runs, especially during early prog. Nonetheless, when it comes to Savage, people expect you to perform to the full potential of your job. This includes the ability to stance dance. If I ever decide to raid on my Dark Knight, I need to practice staying out of Grit and knowing what I can and cannot get away with simply rotating defense cooldowns. Otherwise I am just a subpar Dark Knight. Healers have to learn the same.

If you happen to find a casual group who doesn't care one way or another. More power to you. I, personally, wouldn't raid with healers who refused to DPS out of some silly principle. The only time I wouldn't comment on low DPS from anyone is if one healer practically solo'd. They have a perfectly legitimate excuse not to DPS.

[Judge_Xero]

Im not in a hard core static at the moment, we just started a11s. I already see how annoying, it is.

Hardcore or not it's nice when everyone tries their best to achieve a goal.

You are playing a WHM now? There isn't much healing in A11S so just communicate with your team to not eat every avoidable mechanic and communicate with your support healer, which is hopefully a SCH to place their Pet in the middle so it can solo heal the first 2 minutes of the fight, other than the occasional Regen/Tetra on the MT and Medica II for after AOE damage goes out. It will make your life a lot easier.

No. Absolutely not. No.

My team and I have been trying for weeks. >>WEEKS!!!<< to beat a11s. So far we have gotten to 2.9% (wiping last minute...) and that's WITH me and our main healer DPSing, as well as tanks trying to maximize their damage. If your so called "solution" were entertained, it would take even longer for us because we wouldn't be able to push through as many phases as we are currently able to. Just because you can't stance dance properly and got hate as a result, doesn't mean the rest of us should get punished for it. Whether you like it or not, it helps A LOT. And I have ZERO identity issues as a healer.

Content shouldn't be blown through, sure. But being stuck on the same fight for well over a month (maybe 2) is EXTREMELY annoying when all you wanna do is progress. Makes you wanna blow your brains out, and it's very disheartening. Getting rid of healer dps would make that so much worse.

Keep at it . A11S does feel like a major accomplishment after 9-10 as it's such a large step up from those fights.

You are right that not having healer DPS would make that so much worse. It was so nice being able to skip the first Whirlwind the first time in that fight. Except when I was helping a PUG party I had no idea there was a Whirlwind after the EDD and everyone died without Shielding - whoops

[Feyona]

Hardcore or not it's nice when everyone tries their best to achieve a goal.

You are playing a WHM now? There isn't much healing in A11S so just communicate with your team to not eat every avoidable mechanic and communicate with your support healer, which is hopefully a SCH to place their Pet in the middle so it can solo heal the first 2 minutes of the fight, other than the occasional Regen/Tetra on the MT and Medica II for after AOE damage goes out. It will make your life a lot easier.



Keep at it . A11S does feel like a major accomplishment after 9-10 as it's such a large step up from those fights.

Of course ill do everything to support my team, we all want to clear. Yes the team already has a scholar.

[technole]

Many groups still on A11S last phase progression generally lack some dps in-general, which may include minimal or no healer dps. Could be deaths or mechanics slowing it down too.

Of course it mostly depends on how much tower damage the raid does in the last phase. If people get clumsy and damage all three recklessly the amount of raid DPS needed to clear gets higher. Ideally you can hit all three towers about 8 times with those hawk blaster circles and be okay with decent DPS, but a low DPS group will likely only get away with 5 hits. So the margins get tighter depending on tower health.

[Sylvain]

My view on the matter is that I rolled healer to heal. Not to DPS. When I want to DPS I switch to BLM.
Now, if my group overgear the content enough so that the boss dies quick enough, the tank takes little dmg and my heals heal more (so less heal required), I do not mind DPS and I while enjoy it as it makes me feel as we've reached a point where our gear is so great that I can ommit healing for a moment.


On the otherhand, when the content is fresh and we're working on new content, beside very situationnal case where there are 0 dmg on the raid and only dps is required, why the hell should I be dpsing?
If healing is so useless than they should design raid around 2 tank, 1 heal and 5 DPS instead of 2tanksm, 1.2heal and 5dps.

If raid bosses would actually deal damage with their AA and not only in a different form than aoe burst, this discussion wouldn't exist as everyone would agree that a healer who stops healing the MT for 5sec might loose the MT in the process, unless this one has top end gear and is under cooldown.

I understand tht in the current state of the game, healer have plenty of time to at least apply DoT.
The problem is FF stated they don't balance the raid around healer helping, which means that not only healers have to do their job but they also need to compensate for DPS not doing theirs properly. So I don't see why I should do it.

When I was healing in WoW, during progression I had virtually no time to dps. even if dps would actually matters, healing was so intensive in most fight that I either had to keep mana or spam heal. (I remember my tank passing from 100 to 0 between two greater heal...)

You are playing a WHM now? There isn't much healing in A11S so just communicate with your team to not eat every avoidable mechanic and communicate with your support healer, which is hopefully a SCH to place their Pet in the middle so it can solo heal the first 2 minutes of the fight, other than the occasional Regen/Tetra on the MT and Medica II for after AOE damage goes out. It will make your life a lot easier

This is a huge problem... a fairy can solo heal a fucking savage fight for 2min as long as the tank has 1 Hot...
Just think of how weird it would be if SMN and BLM had access to priest stance and were asked to Heal 80% of the fight because healing requirement is insane, and dps so not needed, that the fight would require 2heals + 2 support heal.

I redirect the question, to healers:
In its current form, the game on most encounter won't require heal from both healer. This will result in one healer, most likely a Scholar, dpsing with occasional heal support during intense healing moment. Would you want SE to substancially increase the dmg of boss, especially their AA, to make healer DPS beyond occasional DoT absolutely impossible. In other word, do you want to heal?

[Lambdafish]

snip

Can I ask... you said you are in a semi-casual static, but do you understand how raid healing works? Do you understand the concept of a main healer and an off healer? If you disable cleric stance, your off healer will have literally nothing to do. You made the argument about enrage being a DPS's fault, but that is because of Yoshi Ps comments about how raid health is calculated, which means the bare minimum a party must achieve. In fights like A11S, the off healer (in my static, a SCH) has a lot of downtime, which means that they should spend their time applying DoTs and using broil, until they are needed to heal.

You say that you don't want the expectation to be a good healer, but you literally need to learn how raid healing works and that healer DPS is integrated far more than you would expect. The MH and OH collaborate, work out when phases can be solo healed and when both need to be active, and more often than not, fights can be mostly solo healed if the MH is good.

[Cynfael]

snip

As I've said before, simply increasing encounter damage isn't a good solution; the game's mechanics would need to be overhauled. With the way encounters are scripted, more damage taken would just mean substituting bigger heals for smaller ones or spamming more heals overall. Not exactly more fun or engaging IMO.

SE is unlikely to mix up the healing formula too much since they want to keep the game accessible to players without great twitch ability. When you start randomizing targets and allowing for non-tank party members to get blasted without warning, you'll succeed at moving healers further from DPS, but at the cost of alienating many of the "casual" healers who never wanted a high-stress, action-intensive job. Hard to get roulettes and leveling dungeons populated without them.

[CookieMonsta]

As I've said before, simply increasing encounter damage isn't a good solution; the game's mechanics would need to be overhauled. With the way encounters are scripted, more damage taken would just mean substituting bigger heals for smaller ones or spamming more heals overall. Not exactly more fun or engaging IMO.

SE.

We need different victory conditions. Like fights such as an arena where wave after wave is thrown at the party and every mob applies a debuff. Or fights where you have to keep an npc alive. Or half the team has ti kill something while the other half move bricks to build a wall. Until such time, the current approach of kill this entity means dps is king.

[Feyona]

I understand tht in the current state of the game, healer have plenty of time to at least apply DoT.




I redirect the question, to healers:
In its current form, the game on most encounter won't require heal from both healer. This will result in one healer, most likely a Scholar, dpsing with occasional heal support during intense healing moment. Would you want SE to substancially increase the dmg of boss, especially their AA, to make healer DPS beyond occasional DoT absolutely impossible. In other word, do you want to heal?

It wasnt really like that with my first encounters in savage I was sort of main heal on sch and had to spam heal tank, both tanks in a10s and alot of people dying. So cant say I actually had down time.

[Feyona]

Can I ask... you said you are in a semi-casual static, but do you understand how raid healing works? Do you understand the concept of a main healer and an off healer? If you disable cleric stance, your off healer will have literally nothing to do. You made the argument about enrage being a DPS's fault, but that is because of Yoshi Ps comments about how raid health is calculated, which means the bare minimum a party must achieve. In fights like A11S, the off healer (in my static, a SCH) has a lot of downtime, which means that they should spend their time applying DoTs and using broil, until they ar.

Yes I do understand main heal/off heal. The decision has been made for me, I now wmg main heal so that I can heal more and not as much stance dancing required. Cos I dont feel ready to do it as scholar at the moment. Off heal role is more difficult cos of the constant need to change stance, learn windows more and many more spells+ pet