Naoki Yoshida's Comment in Regard to Jump Potions/Boost Potions

[Legewiel]

So by skipping content, and making yourself look bad, while getting to the end but still not able to complete the content and quit anyways-- you not only:
1)lost money
2)you lost time you could've spent playing a game you ENJOY
3) you start a community who will easily judge players who buy jump potions like we already do drg's ingame

Why would they quit? you're thinking that absolutely everyone that uses the jump potion will just do bad on the game and quit, but why that doesn't happen on wow that have the same system? I don't see wow empty cause people used a potion to get more level and in wow you receive a potion for free when you buy the expansion, so absolutely every new player is using a potion and still wow is not empty...
And about the community, if they start to judge others cause of that, it's cause its just a bad community that go judging other ppl without knowing them and their potential.

[Elkanah]

All these examples are very different to the reality of the Jump Potions. Even if you jump an alt job you still need to lvl through the last 10 lvls to get to cap. Its not like people will use these potions and start queuing up for EX roulettes 10 minutes later.

Right, but what content do you play with from 1-60 and 60-70? It's definitely not endgame. But it's content you already don't understand. You're not planning to make a difference unless you decide to make that push and make it aware that you are willing to try and put in effort. Going the route of the jump potion is just lazy. 10 levels won't mean much today as it does when you or I ourselves are level 1. Why play a game you plan to think about quitting after 5min getting to the top, and realizing you plan to quit because the content at the end of the road is too hard. This is no different than the 'We Want' players who stop doing the content because 'this is too hard and I want a nerf for this content'.

Retainers you can buy to make more gil ingame quickly? P2W
Gil buying? Able to buy the best gear on the market. ALL P2W.
Buying weapons and armor that give you a higher advantage? P2W.

I'm not saying that ALL these things will be ingame, obviously, but that's the joke. All games in 2016 have had some kind of micro transaction system. Most shooters are the brunt of that joke.

[Elkanah]

snip

For players who play the game, and have played since the beginning, know their jobs and use the potions, I get. It's also hypocritical to say vets should get it while new players dont, which is why I didn't add the bit in there lol. Because I'd be a hypocrite about it too. As a few people have mentioned, people who pay or play mmo's, have a general understanding what and how mmo's work. It's the same reason that people complained about Destiny and the difference between a FPSMMO and just a game they decide to play in their free time and continue to pay for it through xbox live or psn.

[Nestama]

If I actually ever argued skill... this would be a valued question... However; I didn't.

You didn't answer my question, though. How is it that someone who gets to level 50 faster than someone else = P2W? All they're getting is a level 50 character and (maybe?) Gloam gear (i110), something which you get anyway if you decide to take your time and enjoy the ride. The most that can do for you is being geared for level 50 dungeons and prepared for the HW story.

To me, P2W is something to the equivalent of being allowed to buy Savage raiding gear, Savage/Extreme mounts and Savage/Extreme achievements.

[Bourne_Endeavor]

Soo what you are saying is, your personal threshold of P2W, extends in to hundreds of dollars? Please correct me If I am wrong.. I stand by what I said though.... your "opinion" or "definition" of what p2w is, doesn't, actually change what p2w is. You are just saying what it means to you... personally.... and that is perfectly ok, and I'm willing to accept that.

Sigh. I don't know how I could articulate this any better. I specifically said a consistent advantage where buying power is the most optimal solution. The number was merely an example. It's the consistency and optimization which determine pay to win. At least, in my opinion.

To give some FFXIV examples. Say our Relic weapon was upgraded each patch cycle and it was definitively BiS. The grind associated will take nearly three months, however you could buy the needed components from the mogstation. This is pay to win because by the time you've grinded it out, the weapon will be invalidated within a few weeks-- making the most optimal solution to always be spending money. Another example would be in Savage, if the Gobdip, Gobtwine and Gobcoat all had their drop rate reduced to 5%... but were made purchasable on the mogstation. You can't farm them per Savage loot rules, thus you have to either pray to the RNG gods or spend money.

It's that consistency and optimization that factor into what is pay to win. You're buying power, and you always have to in order to keep up.

[Austherus]

To me.

To you.

Different opinions.

[Elkanah]

Why would they quit? you're thinking that absolutely everyone that uses the jump potion will just do bad on the game and quit, but why that doesn't happen on wow that have the same system? I don't see wow empty cause people used a potion to get more level and in wow you receive a potion for free when you buy the expansion, so absolutely every new player is using a potion and still wow is not empty...
And about the community, if they start to judge others cause of that, it's cause its just a bad community that go judging other ppl without knowing them and their potential.

You also have a mmo you're talking about like WoW and Everquest, that's years older than this game has begun to progress further down the road. Don't compare apples to guacamole. Two totally different mmo's in different playing fields. Im going to throw this out there, cause XI is doing something that makes the xp grinding to 99 incredibly easy, but didn't require a potion to do so. The only difference is that it uses a continuous quest clear system that builds the XP along with XP rings that can be bought from the quest points gained. Another big difference is that World of Warcraft really does allow you to play by yourself and not worry about really connecting or dealing with people til later down the road.

FFXIV doesn't exactly allow for this, as all the content in dungeons normal/hard and trials/DF along with higher content is necessary to be in or around a group of people. With FFXIV, if we could take the NPC's and chocobos to level, I'd probably play solo sometimes myself cause I don't have to worry about people. XI has a similar system but uses heroes and npc's from the story to level your character. This sets the example of allowing npc's to help replace and push through dungeons quicker, if you don't have a tank or a healer. Only down side is, they stand in everything lol. FFXI XP rings and quest clear systems that are at constant re-questing without having to run back to the npc, but continue to keep clearing areas or those levels til you hit the next tier of leveling can help level the playing field just a tiny bit. You can easily grind the xp in a short while. Same as a jump potion almost. Not exactly a jumping potion, but with FFXIV's system getting rid of PS3 soon, this could be a easier way to ease in the content from beginning to end. When did jump potions start in World of Warcraft? I don't believe it came out til after Crusaders, right? OR Mists of Pandaria/WoD? Correct me if I'm wrong (no seriously). How many years came out apart from the original WoW until the second expansion before the boost potions started coming out?

[Imoen]

You didn't answer my question, though. How is it that someone who gets to level 50 faster than someone else = P2W? All they're getting is a level 50 character and (maybe?) Gloam gear (i110), something which you get anyway if you decide to take your time and enjoy the ride. The most that can do for you is being geared for level 50 dungeons and prepared for the HW story.

To me, P2W is something to the equivalent of being allowed to buy Savage raiding gear, Savage/Extreme mounts and Savage/Extreme achievements.

I don't need to answer your question, because it is neither a pre-requisite to anything I said.. nor did I imply, or even lean in that direction for the entirety of me being here. Why do I need to answer a hypothetical, on something I did not even propose? You are randomly tossing this at me like it will some how either change my view, and or make a hole in something, that in my opinion is already well established... I will give you the courtesy of saying, that player skill or effects on the game internally haven't had any baring on any sort of decision I made to cancel 3 accounts, however. Honestly though, beyond that, I don't know what you expect me to say. Since non of anything you said or asked of me, even crossed my mind, during that decision process. I said earlier that "while this doesn't effect me" go ahead, click my name, view past posts. I'm not being rude, just seriously... that part of it, I don't really care about, the extent of any "in game thing" that I had a problem with was only related to 2.0-3.0 story line. Nothing more, nothing less.

Your proposed question, which wasn't part of your original, is asking me how I think someone leveling in front of someone else is P2W, I think I answered that pretty clearly... If player A buys the game and a potion, and player B buys just the game... does player A have an advantage? It is a simple yes or no... it isn't a debate... does that person have an advantage or not? That is rhetorical, you don't need to answer... but my answer is in that.

[Schan]

Explain to me how someone who farms FATE's (learning nothing about how to play their role at all), while the other person takes their time, is any different.

There's no real money involved, only the time invested.

[Nestama]

I'm comparing spamming FATE's to your so call P2W level boost potion.
No matter what happens, someone is always going to have a clear advantage over another person. Be it they spend their money to get to where the meat is, pay extra money for extra retainers (I believe this was accused of being P2W at some point), having more hours of play time over another, etc.