Should Cleric Stance be disabled in party instances?

[Masekase_Hurricane]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but WHMs generally don't have any offensive capability until/if they get Holy very late into the game.

Whm had the set of spells Dia, Diaga, Diaja,Tornado and Aero before Holy, also cure in itself was damaging to undead. On top of this whm had individual spells to remove statuses and had a wider set of buff/debuff spells.

[Keramory]

Whm had the dia set of spells dia,diaga,diaja before Holy also cure in itself was damaging to undead. On top of this whm also had individual spells to remove statuses and had a wider set of buff/debuff spells.

Yes and those spells more or less can count for our Areo spells. However we're stone cold nuking a little more then we should be in a healer role. That time should have been more spent on needed heals, something this game doesnt give incentive of, hence some of our points.

[Masekase_Hurricane]

Yes and those spells more or less can count for our Areo spells. However we're stone cold nuking a little more then we should be in a healer role. That time should have been more spent on needed heals, something this game doesnt give incentive of, hence some of our points.

I am not sure what you mean why are you spending more time in cleric if healing is needed? It takes 5 secs to switch to heal and then switch back, also you choose the times when you have an opening in bigger fights certain stages don't need two to heal. Only reason we have two heals and two tanks is one is main and one is back up.

[Normalizer]

I don't know where it came the assumption that "a healer's primary role is to heal since it called a healer", probably from WoW :P I only see DPS in my party. I guess this problem won't go away unless SE renames the role to "DPS with some healing skills" :P

Joking aside i like the way healing works in ffxiv more than in other game, eg. WoW where all you do is spamming heal like there is no tomorrow without even thinking at all

If they removed cleric stance or make healer DPS worthless in instances, worst case is a lot of current healers will switch job (cause healing will be extremely boring at that time), double dungeon queue (lack of healer), longer time to finish (lack of healer dps, and all healers who play healer then gonna be ppl who either watching netflix or spamming heal skills with no idea what they are healing). Oh, then maybe we can see tank raging cause they get harder time to keep hate too, then there will be a thread... "Should tank dps-stance be disabled in party instances".

[Lmcgyver]

I don't know where it came the assumption that "a healer's primary role is to heal since it called a healer", probably from WoW :P I only see DPS in my party. I guess this problem won't go away unless SE renames the role to "DPS with some healing skills" :P

But... a healer's primary role *is* to heal. You don't recruit a healer for their ability to put out a lot of damage, you recruit a healer to keep your party alive. It's a healers secondary role to deal damage as the fight allows (and as they are comfortable), but it is their primary objective to keep the party alive above all else. Any damage they can squeeze out is just a bonus.

[Normalizer]

But... a healer's primary role *is* to heal. You don't recruit a healer for their ability to put out a lot of damage, you recruit a healer to keep your party alive. It's a healers secondary role to deal damage as the fight allows (and as they are comfortable), but it is their primary objective to keep the party alive above all else.

I meant ppl should stop thinking a healer's role is to heal, but rather a healer's role is to dps/support/buff/debuff while keeping the party alive :P Make those 2 objective equally instead of screaming healing is the ONE and ONLY role a healer should focus on.

[Caitlyn]

But... a healer's primary role *is* to heal. You don't recruit a healer for their ability to put out a lot of damage, you recruit a healer to keep your party alive.

Its like saying:
I m a tank, I tank. But I dont use defensive cooldowns or switch to DD-stance as Offtank.
I m a DD, I do damage. But I dont use support skills like mana song or virus.
I m a healer, I heal. But I dont do damage (even when there is nothing to heal).

Each role have to do more than only one job. Speaking of healer, 50% of your job is healing, while 50% is support (in form as extra damage). If you only keep on your main purpose, you re just using only 50% of your potenial.

[Lmcgyver]

Its like saying:
I m a tank, I tank. But I dont use defensive cooldowns or switch to DD-stance as Offtank.
I m a DD, I do damage. But I dont use support skills like mana song or virus.
I m a healer, I heal. But I dont do damage (even when there is nothing to heal).

Each role have to do more than only one job. Speaking of healer, 50% of your job is healing, while 50% is support (in form as extra damage). If you only keep on your main purpose, you re just using only 50% of your potenial.

I was replying to Normalizer, who seemed to be suggesting it wasn't the healer's primary job to heal. I'm fine with a healer putting out damage - I'm a SCH main who spends a lot of time in cleric stance myself - just as long as dealing damage doesn't get in the way of keeping everyone alive. If a healer is not comfortable putting out damage, they should not be forced to. Yes, they *should* deal damage during downtime, but it is by no means a requirement of the job.

I meant ppl should stop thinking a healer's role is to heal, but rather a healer's role is to dps/support/buff/debuff while keeping the party alive :P Make those 2 objective equally instead of screaming healing is the ONE and ONLY role a healer should focus on.

A healer's role *is* to heal. Any damage they can put out is a bonus, and should be a goal to aim for, not a requirement that must be fulfilled.

[Solaiel]

There is one point which is not being pointed out that much. As you said , there is bonus from damage, but no job actually has to do more than the very basic of your role.
So like if a tank tanks, dd does dps and healer heals , it is fine for most things on the get go. Especially if you are geared fairly enough.
Then if you like it that way, you can actually play the game that way. No one is stopping you from using or not using skills. That way you can play even if you are not that good and still fulfill your role.
But , the thing is if you want to improve then use just more than that, its a bonus to reward ppl to put their mind to it and actually think how to solve the encounter faster and better.
The only problem here is ppl who complain about other ppl for not being good and thus these threads pop up.
For example dishing out more damage or using support stuff as a dd. If you put your mind to it , nothing is bad in using your dps skills at moments you dont have to heal as long as you still have enough mana.
If you only want to heal but not attack and you do not have enough to do, then just go heal in cleric stance. that way you can heal way more often ^^
No seriously, you can always do things if you have more possibilities. So don't strip a class that can do more of its skills only because you dont like to use them.

[Taika]

So like if a tank tanks, dd does dps and healer heals , it is fine for most things on the get go. Especially if you are geared fairly enough.
Then if you like it that way, you can actually play the game that way. No one is stopping you from using or not using skills. That way you can play even if you are not that good and still fulfill your role.

In what content would it be considered fulfilling one's role and being just fine for a tank to do nothing but gather monsters and spam Flash (they're tanking!)? Or a DD to only spam one of their damage abilities over and over (they're doing DPS!)? The party may get through the content just fine, but that person is not playing up to the minimum standard, and same goes for a healer who uses only their healing abilities.