WM - Why does it turn Bard's into DoT Casters?

[Cabalabob]

I can tell you now this isn't true. Merely an exaggeration in an attempt to push your idea.

It's actually quite an apt comparison if you think about it. Even their rotations are fairly similar.

50 BLM: cast your DoT for DoT procs. Cast your basic spell to proc another spell. Use your big nuke occasionally.
60 BRD: cast your DoTs for DoT procs. Cast your basic arrow to proc another arrow. Use your big arrow occasionally.

BLM cast times at 50 really weren't that strict, much like BRD's cast times aren't that strict now. However, when going to play BLM you know that cast times is what you're getting into. You have them from the start, it's what you're signing on for. With BRD it's tacked on after levelling it to 52. A little late in the job description.

I have the same gripe with the BRD job in general, playing archer you sign on for shooting things not singing, which is why so many BRDs don't use their songs, it's not what you signed on for. Really it just seems the entire class is a big bag of unwanted tricks getting shoved on it.

[Hasrat]

I have the same gripe with the BRD job in general, playing archer you sign on for shooting things not singing, which is why so many BRDs don't use their songs, it's not what you signed on for. Really it just seems the entire class is a big bag of unwanted tricks getting shoved on it.

More to the point, when do most of those early songs ever really shine? They just seem so situational that (personally) they can be totally ignored for the most part.

[Krindor]

snip

It's all due to balance, if BRD had the mobility they had in ARR and the DPS of a regular DPS, do you think anyone would pick different classes? See pre BRD nerf were they were at this level and you would have groups having multiple BRDs. If they dealt less than a regular DPS and had no support, why would you ever pick the class? The only way to input a archer DPS in the same way would be to limit it like a BLM were you got cast times and in that case the classes are too similar anyways.

As for WM, it was added to give the class some kind of skill level as it was a really easy class to play compared to the other classes. What actual use does WM have other than increasing thee skill ceiling? None, if BRDs had the same DPS as they do now but without WM it wouldn't make any difference balance wise. It would only be a really simple class to play.

[Awful]

I honestly like WM and GB it keeps me busier instead of running around because I can plus I love seeing the huge numbers with Barrage + Sidewinder crits are insane or 12k Wildfires into the mix it may feel like a chore to new people or people who lvl'd bard 1-52 but the pay off is amazing when played right and you can even cleanse yourself(!) fun times :3.

[Khalithar]

It's all due to balance, if BRD had the mobility they had in ARR and the DPS of a regular DPS, do you think anyone would pick different classes?

I think people would if only because they might not like brd or prefer other classes. That being said however, WM/GB are here to stay and won't be going anywhere anytime soon. But I did want to add another point, the complaint that brd goes from a highly mobile dps that could shoot while dodging telegraphs and then suddenly become a caster class after 52+ levels is a perfectly valid one. It is a rather drastic change in playstyle after playing the class for that long and I do believe that the criticism of not liking that drastic playstyle change after 52+ levels is a perfectly valid one.

[Duelle]

It's all due to balance, if BRD had the mobility they had in ARR and the DPS of a regular DPS, do you think anyone would pick different classes? See pre BRD nerf were they were at this level and you would have groups having multiple BRDs.

You're forgetting that encounters at ARR's launch did not have mechanics aimed at ranged DPS. Melee had to deal with most stuff while ranged had little if anything to deal with. That's why people had multiple BRDs (in general raids stacked ranged DPS). The "problem" would have worked itself out if encounters had mechanics specifically aimed at ranged DPS. You have to encourage balanced raid comps anyway, so it would have also worked towards that goal.

[CookieMonsta]

It would only be a really simple class to play.

The ease of use I argue was a good thing. IIRC, a while back there was a post by the Blizzard Devs detailing how they prefer to have at least 1 intentionally unbalanced "noob friendly" class per tier in order to lower the barrier for entry to difficult content. BRD played this important role in ARR as it allowed fresh green players of lower skill to participate in the raid scene and ultimately gain experience necessary to excel in the higher skill ceiling jobs. While it isn't optimal balance that BRD should have extremely competitive DPS while mobile, being mobile with 3rd or 4th tier numbers is OK in my books, just to give newbie raiders a chance.
In its current form, the FFXIV raiding scene has an extremely high barrier for entry because mastery of any class requires insane commitment already, let alone learning raid mechanics + player mechanics etc etc.

In this regard, I feel Wanderer's Minuet was a mistake that should never have existed.

[Whiston]

that being said. BRD is not a dps class.

This is awful and you should feel bad for trying to spread this horrible notion.

Bard is a DPS class. There are no support classes in this game, just DPS classes with support abilities.

Bards job, first and foremost, is to deal damage.

[MahoSenshi]

This is awful and you should feel bad for trying to spread this horrible notion.

^This. Anyone who play BRD as a "its a support class not a DPS" will be kicked out of endgame parties constantly. Because good BRDs do ok DPS while supporting and everyone will be looking at your magic numbers.

[Nekotee]

I agree a decent bard deal massive damage in no time

Coming from black mage and playing bard (occasionnant it's a subsubsub job for fun... and my bow is covered by dust now)
I was baffles to hear bard complaining about mobility when i see how Short cast time are

I mean... try out black mage flare or Fire IV and you Will talk about mobility struggle
Add with that leyline and aoe spam from the ennemies...

The bard lose a bit of his mobility but they really can't complain to a black mage
I had fun playing bard because as a previous black mage i knew how to position myself adequately to avoid unnecessary move