Wow, no mention of Auction house / MW improvements

[Tsuga]

all i hear is time sink, TIME SINK, like that's a bad thing. games are sposed to be a time sink, work is productive. cooking a meal is productive, spending time with my lady friend OO LA LA. is productive. playing a game is not productive its fun. and fun is a time sink. full stop

take playing football its fun? its a time sink.
or you play profesional, productive (makes you money)
do you play FF14 as a careerer ?? then its a fun time sink

Some time sinks are fun (imo, grinding, partying, NM fighting, dungeon exploring), and some time sinks are completely unnecessary, confusing, and frustrating (the process of buying and selling ANYTHING using the Market Wards).

It's not just the matter that it's a time sink, it's that it's a system that is not friendly to the users at either end of the transaction, and is fundamentally unrepairable without turning it into a buying counter, or "Auction House". Hence why we want an Auction House implemented (and not necessarily spawned from the MW, since some people seem to like the tedium of using it).

[Delsus]

NO.

We want a system where we can flippin' buy things from the damn search menu.

Here's an example of me purchasing two items in the wards (assuming that I can even find them with the godaweful search function):

Searching, zoning, running, browsing NPC, buying, running, searching, zoning, running, browsing NPC, buying.

This ridiculous method could be simplified to:

Searching, buying, searching, buying.

It's as easy as letting me buy from the search menu. Running to the retainer, and buying from it serves NO PURPOSE what-so-ever.

This would also make it so that I could sell my wares in the more popular wards, which are ALWAYS full.

You can keep your silly market wards for all I care, just give us the option to use an AH separately (I guarantee that it would instantly negate the necessity for a market ward, anyway, considering it's a far more streamlined, logical, and modern system).

Edit:

When most people say "AH", we're referring to an XI style AH, which was the same thing as the current search function for the MW. The only difference was that it relied on price history, vs. current prices of items, and it let you buy the items from the menu, instead of forcing you to hassle with slow-to-pop retainers, and useless running and zoning load times.

Lol hardly anyone liked FFXI's AH, mainly because it was so easy to manipulate, you could put the same item up 10 times and sell them to yourself, or so its harder to be noticed use mules to buy em straight up for a price you want and everyone will put them up for the same price, bam the AH is how you want it, not how it should be.

Also if you ask for an AH, we will probably get a bidding system, which will be alot more of a time sink than the wards, if you want buying from the search, or a desk outside ask for that, not an AH because you dont want an AH you want a direct buy system.

As I said before FFXI's AH was not a proper AH, it was a direct buy system where you didnt know the price, also it was a huge time sink (which apparently what you dont want) when you wanted the best deal, you want to buy say an Iron Spear, you check history and it says last 10 sales were 10k, so you bid 10k, rejected, 15k, rejected, 15.5km rejected and it goes on in 500g increments to 30k. That took ages, infact longer than the wards do now.

[Tsuga]

Lol hardly anyone liked FFXI's AH, mainly because it was so easy to manipulate, you could put the same item up 10 times and sell them to yourself, or so its harder to be noticed use mules to buy em straight up for a price you want and everyone will put them up for the same price, bam the AH is how you want it, not how it should be.

Also if you ask for an AH, we will probably get a bidding system, which will be alot more of a time sink than the wards, if you want buying from the search, or a desk outside ask for that, not an AH because you dont want an AH you want a direct buy system.

As I said before FFXI's AH was not a proper AH, it was a direct buy system where you didnt know the price, also it was a huge time sink (which apparently what you dont want) when you wanted the best deal, you want to buy say an Iron Spear, you check history and it says last 10 sales were 10k, so you bid 10k, rejected, 15k, rejected, 15.5km rejected and it goes on in 500g increments to 30k. That took ages, infact longer than the wards do now.

Lol, I never said we wanted XI's AH. I said that I want a function where I can buy the items directly from the search menu that is ALL READY IN THE GAME.

Thus your argument, and every argument for the MW is completely moot, because all you're arguing for is useless zoning and running, and a system where a lot of people cannot even put items up for sale due to retainer restrictions.

/thread.

[grandm]

Some time sinks are fun (imo, grinding, partying, NM fighting, dungeon exploring), and some time sinks are completely unnecessary, confusing, and frustrating (the process of buying and selling ANYTHING using the Market Wards).

It's not just the matter that it's a time sink, it's that it's a system that is not friendly to the users at either end of the transaction, and is fundamentally unrepairable without turning it into a buying counter, or "Auction House". Hence why we want an Auction House implemented (and not necessarily spawned from the MW, since some people seem to like the tedium of using it).

so i'm to understand its hard to use the market ward? i go there i need pgl weapon. i look under the right directory to find pgl weapons i scroll down to find the one in my rank see there is 2, so click on them to see how much and where they are i see the name of the retainer that has the lowest price is in the masons ward. i go there, look for the retainer with a star above there head to get my new weapon. my first ever transaction and no1 told me how to do it. i would say it was quite easy to figure out. and no one told me how to do it. since then i have even managed to sell things with my retainer, again no one has told me how to do it

[sirenxiKillertius]

I understand the fustrations with FFXI and the constant battle with RMT's and all other BOT's Ect. "please be kind for i am older" But for the overall ease of just useing the AH for quick buy's and for the fact im a grinder and never liked the crafting aspect in any mmo it was conveinent for me...... also killed time while waiting for a pty ^^ So i'm gonna say i kinda miss them. I've gotten used to going to them in most mmo's and i'm having a hard time getting used to the ward's. Also i worry about the same RMT overpricing there retainer's in the ward's as well ;; which would lead to the same thing just on a retainer to retainer basis with overly priced goods. I due wanna know if im in the only boat with Missing Mog House's? Anyone else kinda miss there's? I miss a place to store my stuff and have my own individual sence of self and space also a place to store all my special items like my Sandy Christmas tree....... So anyone else miss the mog house?

[Tsuga]

so i'm to understand its hard to use the market ward? i go there i need pgl weapon. i look under the right directory to find pgl weapons i scroll down to find the one in my rank see there is 2, so click on them to see how much and where they are i see the name of the retainer that has the lowest price is in the masons ward. i go there, look for the retainer with a star above there head to get my new weapon. my first ever transaction and no1 told me how to do it. i would say it was quite easy to figure out. and no one told me how to do it. since then i have even managed to sell things with my retainer, again no one has told me how to do it

Great job, you get a gold star.

I have seen plenty of people get confused by the market wards, to the point that they just gave up trying to use it.

On Besaid, all of the wards that I want to set my retainers in (weaving and repairing wards) are full. All of the time. It's been that way every time I log on for months. Even if I'm just unlucky, the fact that I cannot sell my wares alone is a FLAW with the system.

[Delsus]

Lol, I never said we wanted XI's AH. I said that I want a function where I can buy the items directly from the search menu that is ALL READY IN THE GAME.

Thus your argument, and every argument for the MW is completely moot, because all you're arguing for is useless zoning and running, and a system where a lot of people cannot even put items up for sale due to retainer restrictions.

/thread.

Then you arent asking for an AUCTION HOUSE you are asking for a market system which uses a menu based interface rather than having to render the graphics, which I would prefer. What I am trying to get across is an AH is when you bid for items which is not what you are asking for, if you ask for an AH that is what you will get, an AUCTION system not an instant buy from a menu.

Incase your english is off, here is the definition of an AUCTION and this is exactly what you will get if you ask for an auction

1 a public sale in which goods or property are sold to the highest bidder:the books are expected to fetch a six-figure sum at tomorrow’s auction
[mass noun] the action or process of selling something to the highest bidder:the Ferrari sold at auction for £10 million

2 Bridgethe part of the play in which players bid to decide the contract in which the hand shall be played.

and the link, incase you dont believe me http://oxforddictionaries.com/definition/auction

The second one doesnt matter because it is for the card game bridge, but i put it in for completion.

If this is what you want, by all means ask for an AUCTION house, if you want to buy from the search counter to eliminate MW traffic and graphical limitations ask for that. You will only get what you ask for.

[grandm]

Great job, you get a gold star.

I have seen plenty of people get confused by the market wards, to the point that they just gave up trying to use it.

On Besaid, all of the wards that I want to set my retainers in (weaving and repairing wards) are full. All of the time. It's been that way every time I log on for months. Even if I'm just unlucky, the fact that I cannot sell my wares alone is a FLAW with the system.

really you know ppl that can't use the market wards? what's not to understand. search for an item, get told where it is, go and get it. really if the internet generation can't figure this one out we are in trouble

[Tsuga]

Then you arent asking for an AUCTION HOUSE you are asking for a market system which uses a menu based interface rather than having to render the graphics, which I would prefer. What I am trying to get across is an AH is when you bid for items which is not what you are asking for, if you ask for an AH that is what you will get, an AUCTION system not an instant buy from a menu.

Incase your english is off, here is the definition of an AUCTION and this is exactly what you will get if you ask for an auction

and the link, incase you dont believe me http://oxforddictionaries.com/definition/auction

The second one doesnt matter because it is for the card game bridge, but i put it in for completion.

If this is what you want, by all means ask for an AUCTION house, if you want to buy from the search counter to eliminate MW traffic and graphical limitations ask for that. You will only get what you ask for.

People are arguing for an "Auction House", because that is what it was called in XI. Most people don't know what else to call it, and so that's what's carried over. We're trying to communicate with the people who developed XI, and so we're using XI terminology. I'm sorry if that confuses you.

The point is we want a system that cuts out the middle man of having to constantly run back and forth for no real reason other than the devs designed a flawed system that they're holding onto because they're expecting to make a quick buck once retainers go on sale for real money. What it's called doesn't matter, if you read the contents of most people's arguments, instead of focusing entirely on the terminology, or taking an apologist's stance (like most people are doing) then you'd understand what we're trying to argue for.

I think I speak for most people when I say that we want a system that is not COMPLETELY FLAWED IN EVERY SINGLE FACET OF ITS DESIGN, which is what we have with the current MW.

Call it what you want, I'll continue calling it an AH because that is the language that people here speak (XI lingo, or whatever).

Edit:

really you know ppl that can't use the market wards? what's not to understand. search for an item, get told where it is, go and get it. really if the internet generation can't figure this one out we are in trouble

As if it were that easy. Before you can even search the damn things you want you have to take a guess at what ward the item you're looking for may be in. Want a shield? Try to figure out what category those fall into. Guessed wrong? Try again. And again. And again. And once you find the item you want, hit enter on it, and then try to guess what happens from there. 'Cause the game sure as hell doesn't tell you what you're supposed to do from there.

You probably knew how to use the wards because the Lodestone told you how when they were implemented.

Anyway, If I weren't all ready attached to this game and had to put up with that crap, I'd leave, too. The wards are completely unintuitive.

[Delsus]

People are arguing for an "Auction House", because that is what it was called in XI. Most people don't know what else to call it, and so that's what's carried over. We're trying to communicate with the people who developed XI, and so we're using XI terminology. I'm sorry if that confuses you.

The point is we want a system that cuts out the middle man of having to constantly run back and forth for no real reason other than the devs designed a flawed system that they're holding onto because they're expecting to make a quick buck once retainers go on sale for real money. What it's called doesn't matter, if you read the contents of most people's arguments, instead of focusing entirely on the terminology, or taking an apologist's stance (like most people are doing) then you'd understand what we're trying to argue for.

I think I speak for most people when I say that we want a system that is not COMPLETELY FLAWED IN EVERY SINGLE FACET OF ITS DESIGN, which is what we have with the current MW.

Call it what you want, I'll continue calling it an AH because that is the language that people here speak (XI lingo, or whatever).

Edit:


As if it were that easy. Before you can even search the damn things you want you have to take a guess at what ward the item you're looking for may be in. Want a shield? Try to figure out what category those fall into. Guessed wrong? Try again. And again. And again. And once you find the item you want, hit enter on it, and then try to guess what happens from there. 'Cause the game sure as hell doesn't tell you what you're supposed to do from there.

You probably knew how to use the wards because the Lodestone told you how when they were implemented.

Anyway, If I weren't all ready attached to this game and had to put up with that crap, I'd leave, too. The wards are completely unintuitive.

Ok you keep asking for an AH, but when you have to wait for 1RL day to get outbid then its not my fault, just keep the MWs for people that dont want a proper (bidding) AH for people that know basic english, seems I cant get though to you.

Oh and it doesnt take much inteligence to use the wards, Duhhh I wanna but a pug weapon but I dont see pug weapon anywhere all I see is pug arms.

And before you say I learned how to use them on lodestone, I was able to use them first day of the alpha before the lodestone was around, and before search was around, there simple and anyone with a tiny bit of logical thought can use them, while I do agree some could be named better, like Chirurgeons Ward, but all you need to do if you dont know what is sold in a ward is click it and it tells you OMG IT WAZ SO HARDZ MAH BRAINZ HURTZ.