Pros and Cons of each Healer Role

[Ghishlain]

.....



Show me on this tooltip where it says the spells you cast are, in your words:

.... ast can Burst heal the entire party without spending any MP and throw out a AoE regen too with 0 cost

or

... when ast does the same there burst is much higher then WHM in terms of AoE healing and dont eat up mana either

You actually had it right in the beginning of your condescending post.

.... Light speed reduce ur MP cost of spells aswell i swear ur both really over sighting the AST kit

But it doesn't reduce the MP cost to 0.

And again, the original comment wasn't about 0 MP costs (wherever the heck you got that from anyway)

The original comment was towards this quote you had:

U do know that spell speed effects lightspeed right ? Which allows u to get a lot more casts off

Which is, literally, UNTRUE.

Consider the following:

Lightspeed is 10s duration as per above tooltip.It reduces cast times by 2.5s to a minimum of 0 since you can't cast backwards in time (if only!). Let's also assume we have enough SpS to have a GCD of 2.30s.

With Lightspeed
@00.0s - First spell is casted and resolved
@02.3s - Second spell is casted and resolved
@04.6s - Third spell is casted and resolved
@06.9s - Fourth spell is casted and resolved
@09.2s - Fifth spell is casted and resolved
@10.0s - Lightspeed Wears Off
@11.5s - Sixth spell is casted.
Total of five spells resolved just after Lightspeed wears off and you're starting your sixth cast.

Without Lightspeed
@00.0s - First spell is casted.
@02.3s - First spell is resolved. Second spell is casted.
@04.6s - Second spell is resolved. Third spell is casted.
@06.9s - Third spell is resolved. Fourth spell is casted.
@09.2s - Fourth spell is resolved. Fifth spell is casted.
@11.5s - Fifth spell is resolved. Sixth spell is casted.
Total of five spells resolved in the same duration.

Yes, the EFFECT of the spells are happening 2.3s faster, but you don't get "more casts off" which to me implies you're getting more GCDs like Pressence of Mind would give you. You just happen to instant casting the spells and not gaining any GCDs in the process (again, Gravity is the exception to this but then you're taking a 25% attack penalty in the process when you use Gravity with Lightspeed)

Now if you said "Lightspeed gives the AST temporary mobility while healing!" then yes, everyone would agree with you. But you didn't. If you also said that Lightspeed reduces the MP cost of abilities (like you correctly stated initially) and not "casts spells for free" (like you incorrectly stated), we'd also take you more seriously.

Really, you need to learn to be logical and factually correct. No one is going to take your opinion seriously if its marred in incorrect information that you continue to spread fail to explain yourself properly. I can appreciate that maybe English isn't your native language but at least try to seem like you're making the attempt to improve both your language skills and your knowledge before, and this is going to be condescending as crap, you run your mouth.

So, flat out saying it now: You're wrong.

Eh, I kind of wanted to squeeze whatever knowledge out of Yhisa, but this works

I hate to be that passive aggressive person, but given the comment I made above I guess it wouldn't hurt here. We've both frequent these forums long enough to know a lot of stuff Yhisa says is factually incorrect and I can recall at least three to four instances within the last few weeks that have made my eyes roll at the comment. I try to ignore it and correct it when I can but I completely dislike misinformation, especially when it's presented in such a condescending and/or passive aggressive way. Right now Yhisa reminds me of those people who have the mentor crown but don't actually know what the heck they're doing and just white knight the crap outta AST when it doesn't need any white knights.

I do know what you're trying to aim for and we've probably had similar argument styles with other posters in the past >>; I guess just leave this one to me for now. lol.

I like your posts, but sadly I see a lot of people failing to understand what you point out.

Thank you, I try .-. Sometimes it's such a chore and I feel like I'm far too wordy for my own good and then the point gets away from me but concise has never been my strong suit. I'm working on it though.

Triple post cause on mobile

I know what im talking about because my warrior is always trying to get me to burn MP i always come out of fights after HUGE pulls and still remain at 100% mp and this is doing the mega hot trick, lightspeed/gravity trick dealing high AOE damage and insane healing whilst staying in cleric stance

Litterally come to my server on phoenix and i will show u the OPness of AST just whisper Miyu Shun and u be like wtf

I literally don't need to do this because I already know how powerful AST is and don't need to be shown any tricks from you because I already know them. I already consider diurnal AST more powerful than WHM and we don't need condescending and misinforming post to show people of this. Instead what they need to shown are the differences in the kits and where AST excels and where WHM excels and people can judge from there which kit they feel is more powerful or suitable for them.

[Yhisa]

.....table math nonsense

Sigh u my good friend need to stop doing table math and face reality

Follow these when doing ur tests

1) log into ur character
2) cast spells
3) move when ur cast bar is just above 3/4
4) watch how u can get the spell off without finishing the full spell cast

Like i said im always stutter casting on casters... Yes ur table math is correct... But in game it does not work like ur table math u can cast and move at the same time and its been like this since ARR released spell speed just makes STUTTER STEPPING much much easyier to pull off.. I can iceskate and cast at the same time before i even finish my cast off

Ur maths is correct on paper... But u seriously need to test it in game and it will blow up ur table math

[Yhisa]

Screw it search Fang_90 on twitch and ill show u stutter stepping >.> cant believe i need to do this just to prove u wrong

[Lyrica_Ashtine]

I hate to be that passive aggressive person, but given the comment I made above I guess it wouldn't hurt here. We've both frequent these forums long enough to know a lot of stuff Yhisa says is factually incorrect and I can recall at least three to four instances within the last few weeks that have made my eyes roll at the comment. I try to ignore it and correct it when I can but I completely dislike misinformation, especially when it's presented in such a condescending and/or passive aggressive way. Right now Yhisa reminds me of those people who have the mentor crown but don't actually know what the heck they're doing and just white knight the crap outta AST when it doesn't need any white knights.

I do know what you're trying to aim for and we've probably had similar argument styles with other posters in the past >>; I guess just leave this one to me for now. lol.

Yhisa has the tendency to make up excuses or claim that we are "misunderstanding" the original post when responded on immediately - Which you've probably noticed on the last page and in the more recent "stat weight" topic. Thus I went for the approach where it is either: 1) Actually misunderstood, or 2) talk themselves into a corner. I believe it's far less tiresome and time consuming like this.

[Ghishlain]

Sigh u my good friend need to stop doing table math and face reality

Follow these when doing ur tests

1) log into ur character
2) cast spells
3) move when ur cast bar is just above 3/4
4) watch how u can get the spell off without finishing the full spell cast

Like i said im always stutter casting on casters... Yes ur table math is correct... But in game it does not work like ur table math u can cast and move at the same time and its been like this since ARR released spell speed just makes STUTTER STEPPING much much easyier to pull off.. I can iceskate and cast at the same time before i even finish my cast off

Ur maths is correct on paper... But u seriously need to test it in game and it will blow up ur table math

There's nothing to blow up my table math, my table math is right. I know what stutter stepping is.

If you said at the beginning "Lightspeed allows me to cast while moving" we wouldn't be have this discussion in the first place. Instead you claimed that Lightspeed:

U do know that spell speed effects lightspeed right ? Which allows u to get a lot more casts off

"Which allows u to get a lot more casts off" implies reducing GCDs (it doesn't). Maybe that's a language barrier issue there but that's why the discussion blew up like it is - because you failed to give correct context.

[EDIT]

Yhisa has the tendency to make up excuses or claim that we are "misunderstanding" the original post when responded on immediately - Which you've probably noticed on the last page and in the more recent "stat weight" topic. Thus I went for the approach where it is either: 1) Actually misunderstood, or 2) talk themselves into a corner. I believe it's far less tiresome and time consuming like this.

Hmmm, that's a good point too. Heh >>; Might need to try that in the future in a different thread if this continues (which it probably will).


[EDIT2]

Screw it search Fang_90 on twitch and ill show u stutter stepping >.> cant believe i need to do this just to prove u wrong

I don't need to see anything. I skate all the time while casting Stoneskin on AST in between pulls while auto running. I'm not sure what stutter stepping has to do with giving you more casts with Lightspeed, so if you want to explain that better, I'm all ears (eyes?)

[Lyrica_Ashtine]

For starters, I love how you have this idea you're better/more knowledgeable than Ghishlain (and possibly others as well).

Sigh u my good friend need to stop doing table math and face reality

I believe you're the one who has to face reality. Light speed reduces cast time, not recast time. All re-cast times are still in effect. And no matter how much spell speed you get with current gear, you'll always be stuck on a maximum of 5 spells to squeeze out unless you can obtain -0.83s recast time reduction by any means. Spoiler alert: It's impossible.

Like i said im always stutter casting on casters... Yes ur table math is correct... But in game it does not work like ur table math u can cast and move at the same time and its been like this since ARR released spell speed just makes STUTTER STEPPING much much easyier to pull off.. I can iceskate and cast at the same time before i even finish my cast off

Ur maths is correct on paper... But u seriously need to test it in game and it will blow up ur table math

Now this is interesting, why is stutterstepping suddenly a thing? It's completely irrelevant and you still present it incorrectly. First of all: Try doing that 3/4 move thing on big spells like raise. By your logic you'd be moving after about 6s worth of channeling. And secondly: By the same logic, you wouldn't be able to move and cast on 3s spells with Light Speed. Go ahead and do some stoneskinning on-the-move with Light speed.

Lastly: You still haven't explained yourself where the magic spell speed attribute bonus comes from for Astrologian that affects HoTs (and DoTs), but is not considered for White Mage

[Kaurie]

ADD the 5% speed u gain from Diurnal sect aswell... U can drop ur cast and recast to 1.50 cast and 2.20 recast if u throw an arrow on yourself

Iv already done it a few times and got 5 casts of remeber that there is delays when u cast spells within the game (u know the cast and move trick) so ur final 5th cast goes off anyway if i knew how to make videos and upload it i would have shown the prove of it which will then change the statement of Astrologian a lot

This suggests you should always be able to get 5 off

[winsock]

No, Gravity is not level 60 - it is level 52.

oops, my bad, editing

[winsock]

It just annoys me a lot when i see or hear poor things said about ast or compared to other

AST is not a bad class. It can do some things, but not all things, better than SCH and WHM.
Likewise:
WHM can do some things better than AST and SCH
SCH can do some things better than WHM and AST

AST require a HIGH skill cap to play and once u learn tricks with ur cooldowns it outshines all other healers

lol, 'math' has a different perspective.

Erm what? Have u played AST?

Yes. ^careful with comments like these though.
Have you played the other 2 healers? At this point in time your character search shows that you have played WHM to 48 and possibly SCH to 52

[Violette]

I thought by swapping to healer main I could escape the silliness of the tank forums and talk to a more sensible crowd.

Guess I should have expected this.

Now, I still want to learn this triple card trick, plz explain Yhisa