Ilberd

[Hinoto-no-Ryuji]

They want to escape an obsessive, cultist, military dictatorship. What exactly is selfish about that? What is selfish about Cid's reasons for defecting?

Garlemald is invading, and doing nothing good while doing so. Cid has very clear (and, frankly, very sympathetic) reason for wanting to ditch that noise. Garlemald uses science and tech at the expense of its own citizens! He's out. He's done. That's good motivation! We don't know Lucia's, but...dude, look. At some point, you're going to need to admit that these guys are closer to the Nazis (or Imperial Japan, or whatever) than they are to Rome. THEY ARE THE BAD GUYS. They enslave and conquer for no purpose other than that single, selfish end. If a former Nazi defected, and it led to the death of some German soldiers, that's war and perfectly understandable. Why can't you apply that logic here? You talk about pragmatic interpretation, yet you're blind to how the story presents this nation.

[Rhodkr]

Words.

What I'm talking about aren't the leaders, military or otherwise who turn a blind eye to what's going on. I'm talking about the normal people, the accountants, the bakers, the blacksmiths, the doctors. People a government needs to make the world go round. They're people who really have nothing to do with what's going on in war and might just be caught in the middle because they had the misfortune of moving into the new city-state. Honestly, this whole conquer and oppress thing that Garleamald has going for it started out as them trying to put a lock down on the summoning of primals. So in essence they were trying to save hydaelyn.

However the road to where is paved with good intentions? I'm sure that now a lot of the higher ups turned it into an opportunity to grab power and fame for themselves.

[Lauront]

*words*

How on earth do you think Rome operated? The story, nevertheless, doesn't present them in the same vein as Nazis, and if you want to argue that they don't specifically aim to destroy the Primals for the danger that they pose to Eorzea, back it up.

Not that Ala Mhigo has much of a leg to stand on in this regard, given its own history of aggression. As in, why should I sympathise with them, now that they have befallen the fate that they would have gladly inflicted upon their neighbours.



As for Ilberd, they would need to do a lot of character development to get him in a position fit to do anything as described in the OP.

[Theodric]

Not that Ala Mhigo has much of a leg to stand on in this regard, given its own history of aggression.

That'll just be brushed off as Ala Mhigo supposedly being more 'moderate' and somehow free of blame for many because it had a 'mad ruler'. Something, ironically, that can excuse Garlemald too. Albeit I'm reluctant to consider Varis as unhinged since he's simply very driven. He's a lot like Tywin Lannister - willing to do a lot of shady, questionable things for the perceived greater good. Sadly they're both the sort of characters many here struggle to appreciate to view as anything other than outright evil. I blame the mainstream media's glorification of simplistic morality.

[Hinoto-no-Ryuji]

How on earth do you think Rome operated? The story, nevertheless, doesn't present them in the same vein as Nazis, and if you want to argue that they don't specifically aim to destroy the Primals for the danger that they pose to Eorzea, back it up.

None of it is a direct parallel, though I actually quite like the "Allag as Rome" comparison. I simply said that Garlemald comes off as more of a modern Imperialist dictatorship than an ancient one, and it's entirely because of the way the game itself has presented them to us. You can conjure up potential sympathetic reasons for their actions all you want, but the actual evidence provided in game doesn't support a sympathetic view. Not yet, anyways.

Speaking of evidence! That the game itself has never presented the Garleans as especially concerned for the Planet helps, but as always, my primary source for Garlemald's anti-Primal drive is Moose's The Rise and Fall of the White Raven. It's made pretty clear that Garlemald's first major offensive in Eorzea (after capturing Ala Mhigo) was to control the source of regional Aether in order to prevent Primal summoning because of the difficulties Primals presented in Othard, and that article being endorsed by Fern himself makes me throw quite a bit of stock behind its interpretation of things.

So, yeah. The greater good of Garlean Expansion is their reason for doing what they do. But, if you can find evidence of their Primal crusade being motivated by the greater good of Hydaelyn, I'd love to see it.